Blackpool - Manchester Electrification

[DJH1971]

I went to a Northern event in Leeds today, and the NR bloke in attendance said categorically that the Euxton-Manchester electrification was on time for completion by the end of December. So there we are! There were mutterings of disbelief among my group.

They need to get a wiggle on then!

 

[Hophead]

Are any blockades planned for Preston - Salford? Or is it all overnights & weekends?

 

[Whistler40145]

I see this week from the Twitter feed, that there is piling going on at both Poulton and Layton. I am so pleased they are doing stuff well before the blockade.

Between Layton and Poulton, piling now complete, the statutory plywood covering up the bases, masts are now on the ground waiting to be fixed into position, things are moving quickly now.

 

[ALX400]

They need to get a wiggle on then!

I can’t see it being ready at all for December, way to much to do, the station works for masts etc are all bespoke and there’s not much happening on that front :roll:

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Are any blockades planned for Preston - Salford? Or is it all overnights & weekends?

Somebody will know way better than me - I get my info here on this board and NW Sparks website.

http://nw-sparks.co.uk/works.php

I see no Preston - Manchester blockades just weekends and nights.

 

[edwin_m]

They need to get a wiggle on then!

Is a wiggle some sort of dangly or part of a TGBU?

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Is a wiggle some sort of dangly or part of a TGBU?

You are beginning to sound like Dave

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The GW route to Didcot is wired and powered up, but it is still not going to be ready for service before January, EGIP is broadly similar.
Meanwhile Salford-Euxton is still pretty much devoid of wires, with few masts Farnworth-Agecroft and through Bolton and at other stations.
The power equipment at Wavertree took ages to install and commission (but not important if it's only for ATF).
Still waiting for something to happen around Chorley tunnel/arches.
I could see wires to Salford Crescent being finished soon, if they wanted to, but that wouldn't really help anyone.
The extension east of Victoria is also needed for a full service to operate.

 

[Elecman]

Obviously there is the huge electrical substation/whatever at Lostock - but I guess even that is one weekend to deliver and install and then it can be worked on during the day - does not even need nights to do it.

And the equivalent one at Blackrod!!

 

[LDECRexile]

Reg has kindly sent a studyworthy shot from Lever Street bridge. (NB: is Lever St footbridge another Je ne sais quoi in all of this?)

I've added it to his album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157671732263863

and to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

Thank you Reg.

 

[absolutelymilk]

I went to a Northern event in Leeds today, and the NR bloke in attendance said categorically that the Euxton-Manchester electrification was on time for completion by the end of December. So there we are! There were mutterings of disbelief among my group.

Was this completion as in power on or trains running?

 

[WatcherZero]

I went to a Northern event in Leeds today, and the NR bloke in attendance said categorically that the Euxton-Manchester electrification was on time for completion by the end of December. So there we are! There were mutterings of disbelief among my group.

Said the same thing in Manchester last week. I think while the infrastructure might be completed in December there could be a couple more weeks before the first services operate on it, a few weeks past the annual mid-December timetable change.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Said the same thing in Manchester last week. I think while the infrastructure might be completed in December there could be a couple more weeks before the first services operate on it, a few weeks past the annual mid-December timetable change.

Agreed - full electric timetable May 2018

 

[LDECRexile]

Reg has kindly sent two more shots of progress at Burnden.

I've added them to his album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157671732263863

and to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

He (and I) asks if anyone can please explain the plain black sign in the distance in Photo 8364p.

Thank you Reg

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Reg has kindly sent two more shots of progress at Burnden.

He (and I) asks if anyone can please explain the plain black sign in the distance in Photo 8364p.

Thank you Reg

It's a screen to obscure the wrong-direction junction signal on the Down line further south, the red light visible over the top of it. They line up at one point, form the driver's point of view, which would be baaaad.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

It's a screen to obscure the wrong-direction junction signal on the Down line further south, the red light visible over the top of it. They line up at one point, form the driver's point of view, which would be baaaad.

That goes to show just how far risk assessment has developed. Back in the day that sort of issue would have been dismissed as just being part of drivers' route knowledge. I wonder if we might start to see such screens installed on existing layouts where such potentially hazardous mis-reads can occur? I suspect that on curved multi-track routes there could be quite a few...

 

[Malay States]

Was this completion as in power on or trains running?

He didn't say specifically, but I would assume that Network Rail would regard completion as reaching the point where the line is available to the operator to run electric trains.
Which does raise another issue. What electric trains? TPE Scottish services from mid February (I've heard), but Northern are only getting 4 more 319/3s (plus 8 bi-modes for Windermere/ Buxton/ Southport services perhaps). New class 331s don't go into service until Dec 2018, according to the MD of Northern at yesterday's event. So Manchester-Blackpool corridor will be mostly diesel for another year yet. Does anybody know different?

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Does anybody know different?

Full confession I do not. I will reread October Modern Railways - there seems to be a huge surplus of older EMUs about to become available though- will need refurb of course.

 

[LDECRexile]

I'm delighted to welcome Karl, a newcomer to submitting photos.

Karl has plunged in with shots he took on a walk from Salwick to Preston recently.

I've created an album for his work here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157687216131303

and added the shots to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

Great stuff Karl. Thank you and welcome aboard. Let's hope you go lots of walks in the area. (Westwards from Kirkham would cut new ground for us, notably the paths, footbridges and foot crossings west of the signalbox at Kirkham.)

 

[snowball]

I'm not very impressed by the new rolling stock in 8380k.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I'm delighted to welcome Karl, a newcomer to submitting photos. Great stuff Karl. Thank you and welcome aboard.

Agreed - welcome

-- (Westwards from Kirkham would cut new ground for us, notably the paths, footbridges and foot crossings west of the signalbox at Kirkham.)

Agreed -but definite progress looking west from Salwick - masts a plenty .

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I'm not very impressed by the new rolling stock in 8380k.

There used to be a stabling point called Sheeps Pasture early 60s?

 

[LDECRexile]

I'm not very impressed by the new rolling stock in 8380k.

Utterly baaarmy if you ask me.

 

[Starmill]

Maximum PS for a 185 is 80mph, not yet commissioned. The 20 through Bolton (its on all platforms that go over MVE2/3 (the former parcels subway)) is bridge related, compounded by having nowhere else to start it that suited everyone. At the moment you're doing 75PS - (50TSR though Moses Gate) - 75/100MU (not that that it can be achieved) - 50PS south of Burnden - 50mph facing turnout - 50PS - 20PS - 75PS from Bolton West onwards. Eventually the 75/100MU will start at Agecroft on the Down line.

The curve north/west of Bolton will always be 20mph due to track geometry, and the fact that almost all trains call at Bolton (and would continue to even if Bolton was 110PS).

The works completed so far haven’t had much effect. With Sprinter trains only able to do 75mph, and 185s restricted to 80 (but has been pointed out a blanket 75mph is in place from Bolton to Chorley anyway for whatever reason), the works has been basically a minor resignalling project.

When trains capable of doing the higher speeds arrive then that is when the enhancement will be noticed.

The only immediate improvement that has had a direct input into improving performance has been the resignalling of Agecroft to Salford.

Prior to this any train which required the platform (Up & Down Bolton) at salford Crescent was signalled Down to a red, which due to TOC defensive driving meant slowing down to 15mph before the signal would be able to clear. This signal was also on a right hand bend.

Now, with the addition of an extra signal, a 75mph approach is permitted as the signal controlling access into the platform has been moved so it is visible at the end of the straight, and can now signal trains straight in. With the slightly higher speed into the platform of 30mph, and a PSR of 50mph just before, it means trains can brake for the station and not the signal.

All it took was a close look at the speed on the facing crossover (raised from 25 to 30 with no major work required) and reducing the short and nearly pointless 50 PS to 40 earlier and lo! the MAR is removed. There aren't any extra signals - MP512 and MP510 have just been moved to better places.

No-one could understand why it was how it used to be ...

All very good to know - thank you!

 

[Foggycorner]

He didn't say specifically, but I would assume that Network Rail would regard completion as reaching the point where the line is available to the operator to run electric trains.
Which does raise another issue. What electric trains? TPE Scottish services from mid February (I've heard), but Northern are only getting 4 more 319/3s (plus 8 bi-modes for Windermere/ Buxton/ Southport services perhaps). New class 331s don't go into service until Dec 2018, according to the MD of Northern at yesterday's event. So Manchester-Blackpool corridor will be mostly diesel for another year yet. Does anybody know different?

Its all part of the DafT master plan so they can say look the north is electrified at a huge cost and northern still run old diesel trains under the wires
There are a lot of spare class 319's that could be sent north but will be left to rust away rather than let northern have use of them

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

What electric trains? TPE Scottish services from mid February (I've heard), but Northern are only getting 4 more 319/3s (plus 8 bi-modes for Windermere/ Buxton/ Southport services perhaps). New class 331s don't go into service until Dec 2018, according to the MD of Northern at yesterday's event. So Manchester-Blackpool corridor will be mostly diesel for another year yet. Does anybody know different?

Northern were supposed to be getting 12 (I think) more 319s for the start of the Blackpool service, plus 4 769s for Windermere at some point.
TPE won't get new electric 397s till late next year (and will then lose the 350s).
Northern might get some 331s late next year but the allocation isn't obvious (might not come to the north west first).
So it's 319s all round until something else turns up.

 

[PDG1949]

I'm not very impressed by the new rolling stock in 8380k.

Whilst the Bo-Bo axle combination is well known, perhaps the Ba-Ba formation is less well-known

 

[Joseph_Locke]

That goes to show just how far risk assessment has developed. Back in the day that sort of issue would have been dismissed as just being part of drivers' route knowledge. I wonder if we might start to see such screens installed on existing layouts where such potentially hazardous mis-reads can occur? I suspect that on curved multi-track routes there could be quite a few...

I'm informed that it was a headache when the 3D VR model was being used place the new signals, as the sighting team kept confusing them; something had to be done.

This kind of "eclipse" is thankfully relatively rare ...

 

[LDECRexile]

Ann and I are going away later this morning, back Saturday pm.

Please send photos as usual, I'll process them at the weekend.

 

[edwin_m]

That goes to show just how far risk assessment has developed. Back in the day that sort of issue would have been dismissed as just being part of drivers' route knowledge. I wonder if we might start to see such screens installed on existing layouts where such potentially hazardous mis-reads can occur? I suspect that on curved multi-track routes there could be quite a few...

There's one at Dore, which has been there for ten years at least.