Bodyside Marker Light - Flashing when Guard Present

[tsr]

To be fair I think they were generally driver only operated for their entire existence until they went to SWT so the problem probably didn't arise much!

Various Horsham and Selhurst conductors were competent on 456s up to their withdrawal from Southern, as the stock was used on the Dorking-Horsham route (and a few others with conductor dispatch, here and there).

The quirks of 455 and 456 door key switches (whether or not the modified variant) are well known amongst the conductors of South London...

 

[jon0844]

BIL - Bodyside/Body Interlock Light Not sure if they are all called that but ours are.

Apparently changing from 'BIL' to 'OIL' (Orange Indicator Lights). If so, that's surely going to be confusing and a somewhat unnecessary change?

 

[BestWestern]

Apparently changing from 'BIL' to 'OIL' (Orange Indicator Lights). If so, that's surely going to be confusing and a somewhat unnecessary change?

Oh for goodness sake...

 

[ComUtoR]

Apparently changing from 'BIL' to 'OIL' (Orange Indicator Lights). If so, that's surely going to be confusing and a somewhat unnecessary change?

Ours aren't specifically for a loss of interlock and if they also flash for a Guards key then switching from BIL to OIL makes more sense. I don't like change for change sake but it would be a better acronym. Maybe BOIL (Bodyside Orange Indicator Light) might be a bit more illuminating.

 

[BestWestern]

Ours aren't specifically for a loss of interlock and if they also flash for a Guards key then switching from BIL to OIL makes more sense. I don't like change for change sake but it would be a better acronym. Maybe BOIL (Bodyside Orange Indicator Light) might be a bit more illuminating.

Why would 'orange' make more sense than 'bodyside'? Both are accurate descriptions, surely?

 

[ComUtoR]

I - Interlock

Ours aren't specifically for a loss of interlock

Or Is it Body (indicator) light ? /me heads to the glossary. Interlock to indicator makes sense to me.

 

[BestWestern]

I - Interlock



Or Is it Body (indicator) light ? /me heads to the glossary. Interlock to indicator makes sense to me.

Bodyside Indicator Light. They have other functions as well as just door interlock. Passcom activation, certain faults, etc. Also known as Hazard Lights, for that reason!

 

[jon0844]

They're more yellow than orange, so maybe they should have been YIL.

I like BOIL more though!

 

[twpsaesneg]

Pretty sure there was or is something in the rule book that an illuminated orange BIL is a stop and examine if seen by a signaller, which is why the postal units have blue ones to differentiate.

 

[E_Reeves]

Do the blue ones on the 325s count as BILs or similar or do they have another name?

 

[jon0844]

Pretty sure there was or is something in the rule book that an illuminated orange BIL is a stop and examine if seen by a signaller, which is why the postal units have blue ones to differentiate.

Yes, if a BIL/OIL light is on when a train is in service you'd need to get looked at. It could be serious (door interlock issue), or it could be, say, a 365 driver that has had a passcom alarm and is taking the train to the next station.

A flashing light would at least give a clue, whereas on units with only solid lights how could you know if a train passed through?

The postal trains are indeed an exception and it's referenced to in the rule book.

 

[driver9000]

All this talk of BIL, BOL and calling them Bodyside Indicator Lights makes me wonder where the name came from as in the north we have always called them Hazard lights. On 14x and 15x for example they light for certain MCB trips and fire system activation too.

325s are no longer mentioned in the Rule book but seeing the blue lights lit up has no meaning to anyone so they are to be ignored.

 

[BestWestern]

All this talk of BIL, BOL and calling them Bodyside Indicator Lights makes me wonder where the name came from as in the north we have always called them Hazard lights. On 14x and 15x for example they light for certain MCB trips and fire system activation too.

325s are no longer mentioned in the Rule book but seeing the blue lights lit up has no meaning to anyone so they are to be ignored.

Indeed, I prefer hazard light and suspect this is just a case of the usual hunger for changing the wording of things every five minutes just for the sake of it.

 

[FordFocus]

All this talk of BIL, BOL and calling them Bodyside Indicator Lights makes me wonder where the name came from as in the north we have always called them Hazard lights. On 14x and 15x for example they light for certain MCB trips and fire system activation too.

325s are no longer mentioned in the Rule book but seeing the blue lights lit up has no meaning to anyone so they are to be ignored.

I've known them as hazard lights but when you venture off the Northern network they carry different names, as hazard lights are referred to as flashing headlights for ironically, warning about hazards.

For the non-drivers and guards. The BIL, BOL, BOIL, OIL, orange side lights or hazard lights on DMUs can mean......

Loss of door interlock
Pass comm activated
Brake MCB tripped
Track Circuit Actuator fault
or fire system activated

More modern units will flash if a pass comm, guards keyed in or fire system has activated encase all the doors are released. Makes it easier to find the offending carriage.

 

[2W28 Last run]

Bodyside Indicator Light. They have other functions as well as just door interlock. Passcom activation, certain faults, etc. Also known as Hazard Lights, for that reason!

They also indicate fires in the engine compartment when flashing, a local Driver said they have five meanings I only know three door release, door interlock and fire. Could one be passenger alarm?

 

[trainmananthon]

They also indicate fires in the engine compartment when flashing, a local Driver said they have five meanings I only know three door release, door interlock and fire. Could one be passenger alarm?

Door release, door interlock, Track Circuit Actuator (TCA), passcomm activation and engine firebottles active.

 

[Bletchleyite]

On 350/2, /3 and /4 (but not /1) they also do a long flash when the doors are closing.

 

[BestWestern]

Door release, door interlock, Track Circuit Actuator (TCA), passcomm activation and engine firebottles active.

Door release and door interlock is the same; the illuminated light indicates that the door interlock is not complete on that vehicle. The oddity is the Voyager fleet, whereby the light illuminates only if a door is actually open, rather than simply being released. Hence you will often see them, usually when on layover for a period of time, with hazard lights/BILs illuminated on some vehicles but not others.

 

[GW43125]

They also indicate fires in the engine compartment when flashing, a local Driver said they have five meanings I only know three door release, door interlock and fire. Could one be passenger alarm?

On 159s they light for:

-Door interlock lost (this includes doors released)
-Passcomm operated
-Brake control MCB tripped
-External socket covers open
-Track circuit actuator fault
-Fire equipment activated

 

[K.o.R]

As this charming training video says, passenger alarm is indeed a reason for a light to remain on.

 

[2W28 Last run]

As this charming training video says, passenger alarm is indeed a reason for a light to remain on.

Fantastic thanks for the help guys

 

[tsr]

Door release and door interlock is the same; the illuminated light indicates that the door interlock is not complete on that vehicle. The oddity is the Voyager fleet, whereby the light illuminates only if a door is actually open, rather than simply being released. Hence you will often see them, usually when on layover for a period of time, with hazard lights/BILs illuminated on some vehicles but not others.

You'd love Turbostars.

With doors released, the BILs illuminate... when the engine is running, if it has just been shut down, or if the door key is active, but the latter only if the train is above its basic emergency power level. In some circumstances, "keying on" at a door panel or on the cab desk will not immediately result in a BIL showing if the local door is open but no others.

With minimal power, the passenger door buttons generally stop working. This happens coach-by-coach, and sometimes this means you can have every-other-coach (or a random selection) with the doors released. Which is handy. (The BIL lights then start to go out, even though a release had been given, so you have no idea which coaches had a door release, which is needed for any further use of Door Deselect.)

Additionally, the driver's key is generally required to activate the part of the buzzer system which sounds when the passenger alarms are pushed. If someone has pushed the alarm on a stationary train which has been shut down, the BIL in the affected coach won't illuminate and the buzzer won't sound, and often the illuminated alarm surround also doesn't work. This means the alarm will suddenly sound via the cab buzzer when the train is started up, and if the doors are then released, you've lost all hope of seeing where the alarms have been pushed.

Yet it's worse if there's been enough power to keep the doors released, as all the BIL lamps will still be on and therefore you have no idea which coach the alarm was in. So it makes you jump then tells you nothing. Sometimes you need to further push the saloon light switch to get the alarm surrounds to light up, but if not, you have to close all doors and work out which BIL is still illuminated and therefore where the alarm is. Cue somewhere or other in the evening peak having a passcom on a stabled train which is just being brought back into use...

 

[BestWestern]

You'd love Turbostars.

With doors released, the BILs illuminate... when the engine is running, if it has just been shut down, or if the door key is active, but the latter only if the train is above its basic emergency power level. In some circumstances, "keying on" at a door panel or on the cab desk will not immediately result in a BIL showing if the local door is open but no others.

With minimal power, the passenger door buttons generally stop working. This happens coach-by-coach, and sometimes this means you can have every-other-coach (or a random selection) with the doors released. Which is handy. (The BIL lights then start to go out, even though a release had been given, so you have no idea which coaches had a door release, which is needed for any further use of Door Deselect.)

Additionally, the driver's key is generally required to activate the part of the buzzer system which sounds when the passenger alarms are pushed. If someone has pushed the alarm on a stationary train which has been shut down, the BIL in the affected coach won't illuminate and the buzzer won't sound, and often the illuminated alarm surround also doesn't work. This means the alarm will suddenly sound via the cab buzzer when the train is started up, and if the doors are then released, you've lost all hope of seeing where the alarms have been pushed.

Yet it's worse if there's been enough power to keep the doors released, as all the BIL lamps will still be on and therefore you have no idea which coach the alarm was in. So it makes you jump then tells you nothing. Sometimes you need to further push the saloon light switch to get the alarm surrounds to light up, but if not, you have to close all doors and work out which BIL is still illuminated and therefore where the alarm is. Cue somewhere or other in the evening peak having a passcom on a stabled train which is just being brought back into use...

I need to lie down....

 

[2W28 Last run]

What is a brake mcb?

 

[driver9000]

What is a brake mcb?

It's the circuit breaker that protects the brake continuity wire circuit. If it trips then the train is brought to a stand automatically.

 

[2W28 Last run]

And what is the LCCB and the FIS?

 

[tsr]

I need to lie down....

Many a driver has regretted me fixing a train which they can't be bothered to troubleshoot. "But you see, I'm the one who gets shouted at, plus if you trip these two, close the doors and put the key on again..."

(I have, at least twice, had to resort to what can only be described as "black magic" at rural stations with no phone signal. Plus on one occasion I was on a Turbostar with a beeping noise which has never been heard more than twice, ever, following the tripping of an MCB which has no specific known function. On another occasion, only some of the wrong doors wouldn't open, but two specific switches made either all the right ones or none of the wrong ones work. Figure that one out!)

 

[FordFocus]

And what is the LCCB and the FIS?

Local Control Circuit Breaker. Controls the engine in that vehicle on Sprinters and other stock like 170s.

FIS I think is Fire Isolation Switch. Turns off the fire alarm if activated or there is a fault. Also means the engine is shut down and won't restart as there is no fire circuit active.

 

[FordFocus]

Many a driver has regretted me fixing a train which they can't be bothered to troubleshoot. "But you see, I'm the one who gets shouted at, plus if you trip these two, close the doors and put the key on again..."

(I have, at least twice, had to resort to what can only be described as "black magic" at rural stations with no phone signal. Plus on one occasion I was on a Turbostar with a beeping noise which has never been heard more than twice, ever, following the tripping of an MCB which has no specific known function. On another occasion, only some of the wrong doors wouldn't open, but two specific switches made either all the right ones or none of the wrong ones work. Figure that one out!)

The Turbostar wiring can be different from subclasses. The only beeping noise in the cab I can think off is a CACU/PA handset is off it's cradle somewhere on the train. Never really had any issues with doors that can't be solved without recycling the door controls or tripping out Door Control and Door Supply MCBs and trying again.

 

[221129]

Door release and door interlock is the same; the illuminated light indicates that the door interlock is not complete on that vehicle. The oddity is the Voyager fleet, whereby the light illuminates only if a door is actually open, rather than simply being released. Hence you will often see them, usually when on layover for a period of time, with hazard lights/BILs illuminated on some vehicles but not others.

Although if the doors are unlocked it is always illuminated on the Driving vehicles.