Bridge weight limit Health and Safety

[jackndanni]

Hi everyone!

I have joined the Forum mainly to ask you guys for your advice. I'll be completely honest with you and say I know absolutely nothing about trains!

My question is regarding a bridge over the railway. This bridge has a weight restriction of 10 tonne imposed on it as it is classed as a 'weak bridge'. Would you be concerned if vehicles well in excess of that weight, average about 20/32 tonne were crossing the bridge on a daily basis?

 

[telstarbox]

Give Network Rail a ring on 08457 11 41 41 if you are concerned and they will follow up if they think there is a problem.

 

[oversteer]

I guess I would be, I am sure there is some allowance in the weight limit but not 100% over.

Reporting it to your local police on 101 would probably be the sensible thing to do.

If they are big brand lorries (supermarkets etc) perhaps take a few photos and see if the local press are interested.

BUT If they are tipper trucks don't try this

 

[Monty]

The weight restriction probably applies to the axle loading of each vehicle, so even if a carriage weighs over 20-30 tons it's weight is spread out over the number of axles it has so the actual weight that is applied to the track is a lot lower. Hope that helps.


Edit: Nevermind I assumed you meant trains going over the bridge not road vehicles, however my point about axle loading still stands.

 

[tsr]

The weight restriction probably applies to the axel loading of each vehicle, so even if a carriage weighs over 20-30 tons it's weight is spread out over the number of axels it has so the actual weight that is applied to the track is a lot lower. Hope that helps.

I presume you are referring to a rail-over-road bridge, but I have a hunch that the OP is referring to a road-over-rail bridge - whereby the road vehicle is suspected of being too heavy for the bridge over which it's travelling! If I am correct, or even if I am not, I would echo the above advice to call Network Rail and discuss the issue with them.

 

[ainsworth74]

The weight restriction probably applies to the axel loading of each vehicle, so even if a carriage weighs over 20-30 tons it's weight is spread out over the number of axels it has so the actual weight that is applied to the track is a lot lower. Hope that helps.

My question is regarding a bridge over the railway.

 

[Monty]

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Further to Monty's understanding on single axle-weight, there is the possibility that it is a two-lane road, and that the structural engineer's assessment of maximum permissible axle weight will have been halved to provide for two heavy vehicles passing at the same time.
Consequently, a vehicle with double the indicated permitted weight might have been authorised if it is the only vehicle on the bridge.

This arrangement would not automatically apply to all bridges, but it is a possible interpretation. I know of one "weak bridge" where a 'chicane' has been laid out on the crest to ensure that only one vehicle can pass over the arch at any one time; that particular arrangement leads to the indicated maximum weight in one direction being the same figure as the total from the weight in all lanes.

As a follow-on, I have been concerned at some signage of maximum weights being innapropriately positioned such that some heavy vehicles will have little or no chance of taking a diversionary route by the time the driver encounters the sign.

 

[The Ham]

Bridge loadings can be a complicated thing. As some bridge decks are OK for normal traffic loadings, but the parapets are not, which can lead to weight restrictions or making the carriageway so it is in the middle of the bridge to get over the problem.

 

[jackndanni]

I thought I would show you some photo's I took recently which may give a better idea?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I always thought that for a road bridge the weight limit sign showed a total vehicle weight, not an axle loading weight?

 

[WatcherZero]

The actual sign appears to say 'warning laden weight not to exceed 10 tonnes'.

 

[snowball]

I always thought that for a road bridge the weight limit sign showed a total vehicle weight, not an axle loading weight?

It may show either, there are two different versions of the sign, but usually total weight.

 

[Llanigraham]

I always thought that for a road bridge the weight limit sign showed a total vehicle weight, not an axle loading weight?

Correct, it is the actual weight of a vehicle, not the axle weight. That is why many trucks get a weight loading ticket as they leave their depots.
It used to be the case that some bridges did state a max axle weight, but this was removed many years ago.

To the OP.
The matter should be reported to the Police, Network Rail AND the local Highways Dept. Sending them the photos might be a good idea.
I'm guessing it might be in Mid Wales?

 

[Smethwickian]

Just curious, but is that there ship in Jackndanni's photo the old Duke of Lancaster at Mostyn? Are these vehicles all going to and from the beached vessel for some reason?

 

[jackndanni]

Yes you're spot on there! The vehicles aren't on their way to the ship though. They are working on the sea defenses in this instance and also accessing the water treatment plant.

I will show you the latest collage of pics I have done. They even had the cheek to put a 'weak bridge' sign out then carried on regardless!

They were allowed to use the dock where the Duke of Lancaster is as a turning circle. At one point 3 cement trucks came at the same time each weighing 32 tonne? = 96 tonne

 

[Smethwickian]

Yes you're spot on there! The vehicles aren't on their way to the ship though. They are working on the sea defenses in this instance and also accessing the water treatment plant.

Thanks for that. I was puzzled by the "graffiti" on the old ship until I read somewhere that it's actually a commissioned art project!

Back on topic, seeing the number of trucks and cement mixers, I'd definitely query the weight limit with the relevant authorities, as others have already advised. There is, I suppose, a small chance there might be some dispensation or other agreement if this is the only access to vital works, and some arrangement might have been made to monitor the bridge - but you don't know unless you ask the question. I'm sure Network Rail would be happy to answer an email about it.

 

[edwin_m]

I'd add the Health and Safety Executive to the list of people who ought to know about this. If the operator of these trucks is ignoring a plated weight restriction they are clearly not fulfilling their duties under the Health and Safety at Work Act. It's possible they have got some kind of dispensation from NR based on detailed calculations of axle weight etc, but I think the consequences if that hasn't happened are great enough that it's worth making the call.

 

[TDK]

I'd add the Health and Safety Executive to the list of people who ought to know about this. If the operator of these trucks is ignoring a plated weight restriction they are clearly not fulfilling their duties under the Health and Safety at Work Act. It's possible they have got some kind of dispensation from NR based on detailed calculations of axle weight etc, but I think the consequences if that hasn't happened are great enough that it's worth making the call.

I think that Network Rail should be the first port of call, then maybe you could email Queen Elizabeth or David Cameron :roll:

 

[edwin_m]

I think that Network Rail should be the first port of call, then maybe you could email Queen Elizabeth or David Cameron :roll:

Thanks for your sarcasm, but while the immediate problem is for NR, HSE is the right body to take wider action if necessary. If (and I repeat if) a contractor is operating heavy trucks in an unsafe manner then in the worst case a lot of people could get hurt including the drivers of trains passing under this bridge.

 

[CatfordCat]

I'd go with give Network Rail a call and see what they suggest.

I'm not quite convinced this is the sort of thing that HSE enforce - they are not quite the all-encompassing legislating-against-everything that some parts of the media (that might just have a political agenda) like to suggest.

Unless of course these lorries are part of the testing operation as described by Dad

(Calvin & Hobbes, Bill Watterson)

 

[jopsuk]

This does not appear to be on a public highway, but a private one.

 

[jackndanni]

Have dug out the details from Network Rails ICA. Wondered if anyone could decipher the axle weights . Gobble de gook to me :roll:

Easting Northing Longitude Latitude Address 1 Address 2 City County STGO 1 STGO 2 STGO 3 Crane Cat A

CNH3/B/67A 316757 379950 -3.250845909 53.30991745 A548 Rock Hill To Isglan Road Mostyn Flintshire 41 47 54 36 59 59

Really appreciate all your help guys.

 

[90019]

Is there an alternative route?

 

[AndyPJG]

This does not appear to be on a public highway, but a private one.

Indeed, it's not an official sign authorized for use on a public highway, in fact it would be an illegal sign if erected on a public highway and totally unenforceable by the Police and/or the Highway Authority.

Weight limits are normally 1 of 3 types:
1) Gross Vehicle Weight restrictions, which apply to the actual weight of the vehicle whilst crossing;
2) Axle weight limits (usually on short span bridges);
3) Goods Vehicle Limits, which don't apply to buses, coaches etc, and relate to the gross plated weight of the goods vehicle not its actual weight at the time ie irrelevant if empty at the time - generally used for traffic management rather than structural reasons.

 

[TDK]

Thanks for your sarcasm, but while the immediate problem is for NR, HSE is the right body to take wider action if necessary. If (and I repeat if) a contractor is operating heavy trucks in an unsafe manner then in the worst case a lot of people could get hurt including the drivers of trains passing under this bridge.

The right body to take action with is NR and if NR decide it is an issue for the HSE so be it.

 

[Prairie_5542]

If Network Rail weren't happy about this, what could they do??

 

[Sheepy1209]

Is this the same bridge?

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/bridge_at_glan_y_don_mostyn_nort

 

[cjp]

Is this the same bridge?

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/bridge_at_glan_y_don_mostyn_nort

From the linked article this jumped out at me

Network Rail is not covered by the Freedom of Information Act, so
we don’t deal with requests in the same way as bodies which are.

Not accountable - but I think we knew that


Should this not be subject for Infrastructure??

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Wondered if anyone could decipher the axle weights

They aren't axleweights, they're gross vehicle weights (GVW).
For this bridge:

STGO 1	      41t GVW 
STGO 2	      47t GVW
STGO 3	      54t GVW	
Cat A Crane   36t GVW - Cranes up to 10,000 kilograms per axle 
Cat B Crane   59t GVW - Cranes up to 12,500 kilograms per axle
Cat C Crane   59t GVW - Cranes up to 16,500 kilograms per axle

The STGO bands are for large and heavy vehicles that fit into normal construction and use restrictions. Based on axle loads, length, etc. they get banded:

	      	      	      STGO1	      STGO 2	      STGO 3 
Motorways	      	      60 mph  	      40 mph	      40 mph 		
Dual Carriageways	      50 mph	      35 mph   	      35 mph 	
Other Roads	      	      40 mph	      30 mph   	      30 mph

In summary: no idea what the 10t sign is for.