Bridlington rationalisation and re-signalling

[mike57]

The southern approach to Bridlington station is currently being rationalised and re-signalled. When finished the curve to the south will be eased and all the old semaphore signals replaced (and rationalised) by colour light signals

The problem that has arisen is that Historic England have decided to 'list' the signal box, right in the middle of the works, link here https://historicengland.org.uk/listing/the-list/list-entry/1477641

As far as I can determine this means that all work on the signal box has to cease while the the 'issue' is resolved, work had apparently already started to remove unused equipment.

This will currently put the reopening after a 9 day blockade in jeopody.

The matter has been discussed on social media locally, obviously with a lot of comments about the sense of this move.

The signal box was to be retained, housing the new equipment, as well as other equipment related to signalling in this area which remains unchanged

I have to question the sense of this move, the mechanical signalling equipment removed was apparently going to be offered to the heritage railway sector, and the structure of the box retained.

This listing will possibly mean that the box will just become an unused 'object' a bit like Falsgrave, windows barred to 'protect' it and left to moulder, with no use for it and at Bridlington there will need to be a Portakabin placed near the track at some suitable location nearby, as with Scarborough the signalling was moved to Seamer, but there is not suitable alternative at Bridlington. (Because a Portakabin is the only thing that could be got in place within a resonable timescale)

Note that my comments are based on posts on social media about the progress of the works, I have applied a 'noise' filter to arrive at the conclusions above, but if anyone with more detailed knowledge wants to add anything feel free

 

[ainsworth74]

It's does all seem very sad. Seems like Network Rail had a plan in place to protect the heritage of the box itself whilst making sure it remained useful to the operational railway. This having now been tossed onto the scrapheap as a result of the listing. My impression is that it might be down to an individual making an application for listing perhaps not fully understanding what was being proposed by Network Rail (perhaps under the impression the box might be abandoned or knocked down rather than continuing to be used).

I believe Network Rail have an alternative plan involving using some other space in the box to accommodate the proposed new panel but it now of course depends on Heritage England agreeing and doing so quickly enough for it not to endanger the blockade (if it does then goodbye nice well looked after box and hello portacabin and mouldering old box).

I do think the listing of historic buildings is important (having recently lost what I consider to be a very important building despite attempts at having it listed) but sometimes it seems to be counter productive in the extreme! We've gone from a situation where the building would be preserved, externally, as is (and the internal heritage features kept where possible or passed onto others where not) and well maintained for the future to a situation where it will end up boarded up and probably end up being an eyesore and eventually ending up knocked down anyway some years down the line.

 

[pdeaves]

I see the listing includes "impressive McKenzie and Holland 65-lever frame and locking rack, together with its associated circuit diagram, block shelf and block instruments". Aside from the fact that I think emotive language like "impressive" should not form part of a factual listing, it looks like NR is stuffed anyway even if it hypothetically decided to retain mechanical operation as the diagram would have to change to suit a new track layout, thus making it 'non original', etc. (I make the rash assumption that 'circuit diagram' means the track layout above the lever frame and not an electrical circuit wiring diagram).

 

[swt_passenger]

Is there a right to appeal this sort of last minute listing? Seems to me some people want every remaining signal box in the country retained.

Just how many do we really need to tell the historical story?

 

[mike57]

I actually think it does the whole purpose of listing a big dis-service. Try explaining that to the people faced with an hour plus bus journey compared to the normal 30 minute rail journey again on Monday if it results in a time overrun.

Whilst I understand that some pieces railway infrastructure need preserving, there is a long history of 're-use and adapt' on the railways which I think is a good thing. There have been multiple advances and changes since this bit of railway was built in 1846/7 and I think part of the interest is in seeing how those changes have taken place. How many other industries are still using equipment which in some cases is 100 years old, and even rolling stock upto 80 years old until recently (Think IoW units). But if you try and freeze it in time its just going to become a white elephant and a drain on someones resources.

 

[yorksrob]

Last minute listings can be very important to stop people getting away with demolishing things on the sly.

On this occasion, the fact that NR had decided to use the existing signalbox is the best outcome and we shouldn't let perfection become the enemy of good.

Hopefully the issue is resolved with the box reused.

 

[jamesst]

When they resignalled the lines I drive railtrack (which it was at the time) couldn't demolish the old signal boxes quick enough, one of the most sensible ideas they had!!

 

[Bald Rick]

This will be particularly frustrating, as 8 years ago a joint project between NR and the then English Heritage produced a detailed assessment of the then remaining signalbox estate, in the full knowledge that there was a plan to close them all in the next couple of decades. The project agreed which of the ‘boxes should be listed and why. 26 were listed, and Bridlington wasn’t one of them.

 

[HSTEd]

Is there any particular reason the panel was going to be located at a signalbox on site rather than at an IECC or ROC?

Has the ROC programme been entirely abandoned?

 

[Bald Rick]

Has the ROC programme been entirely abandoned?

Definitely not.

 

[snowball]

Is there still a national strategy for which areas will go to ROCs and which will go to other centres, or have the decisions been devolved to NR routes or regions?

 

[Tomnick]

Is there any particular reason the panel was going to be located at a signalbox on site rather than at an IECC or ROC?

It'll still work Absolute Block to the adjacent box, so shifting it alone into the ROC would introduce a load of complexity and cost for little benefit.

 

[swissrailpassion]

The box is in two halves and the new panel could go in the virtually empty half without the block shelf and frame. Quite a bit of re-planning involved to work around this and the sightlines etc would be different. Luckily it's a big box.

 

[mike57]

According to local social media the issue has been resolved in the short term with a 8 week 'grace' period to come up with a proper strategy. Short term main thing is railway reopens on time. (Not least because Mike57 and Mrs Mike57 are visiting friends Saturday week and are going by train from Bempton ) Longer term I can see it developing into a 'battle of wills' between Network Rail and Historic England, and the end result will be a boarded up white elephant, as I cant see it being easy to work with Historic England every time a change is required based on social media chatter particularly with respect to deadlines and timeframes.

What I dont get is why the listing was approved, the box has been heavily modified internally over the years by all accounts, back to my comment of re-use and adapt. Its part of working railway infrastructure not a museum exhibit or even part of a preserved railway. Yes preserve the best examples, but not everything, all that does is upset people, and devalue the whole listing process, probably doing a disservice to those structures which are worthy of listing and would otherwise be lost.

To be honest if I were Network Rail when planning work of this kind I would move equipment into a new structure in future rather than trying to reuse existing infrastructure, which would be a shame.

 

[thejuggler]

This will be particularly frustrating, as 8 years ago a joint project between NR and the then English Heritage produced a detailed assessment of the then remaining signalbox estate, in the full knowledge that there was a plan to close them all in the next couple of decades. The project agreed which of the ‘boxes should be listed and why. 26 were listed, and Bridlington wasn’t one of them.

Too late now, but belt and braces approach would have been for NR to get Immunity from Listing Certificates for those not on the list.

 

[Nicks]

At Holmwood, for example, there is a protected former platform signalling cabin - as each year goes by it just looks more and more derelict and uncared for - I struggle to see why this benefits anyone. There is not even any kind of plaque or similar explaining the significance of the box to the passengers using the station.

 

[Class 170101]

I cant see it being easy to work with Historic England every time a change is required based on social media chatter particularly with respect to deadlines and timeframes.

Hysterical England

 

[mike57]

Well works obviously completed on time, I heard first train of the day go up towards Scarborough at about 06:15

 

[John Webb]

Article here: https://railuk.com/signalling-and-t...tes-major-signalling-upgrades-at-bridlington/
which confirms that the works were completed on time and shows the new panel in the old box.

 

[WestRiding]

Bet the Signallers are right chuffed with a Panel in the kitchen.

 

[Ploughman]

Is there a diagram showing the new and old track layouts?
What are the fringe boxes now?

 

[John Webb]

Is there a diagram showing the new and old track layouts?
What are the fringe boxes now?

The Railuk item linked to above is virtually a complete reprint of the Network Rail press release. I understand only Bridlington was updated, so assume it's working to which ever boxes it previously worked to. (I assume Driffield and Gristhorpe?)

 

[swissrailpassion]

No change to the control, Driffield to the south is AB and Seamer to the north is TCB. Gristhorpe is a crossing box with the last remaining semaphores.

 

[MML]

The new modern panel looks like it's from the late 1960s, early 70s. Even the phone is pre 1980s. Where did they find this equipment from?

 

[WestRiding]

The new modern panel looks like it's from the late 1960s, early 70s. Even the phone is pre 1980s. Where did they find this equipment from?

Its a very typical example of a new NX style panel. The telephone is the best type, strong and functional with one push dial buttons with pre programed numbers etc. We have modern touch screen phones in our box and frankly, they're rubbish. Modern isn't always good.

 

[BoroAndy]

What's the new track layout, and have the platforms been renumbered?

 

[pdeaves]

Single track north; double track south and a simple crossover to access a bay platform (so a total 4 point ends). No renumbering.

 

[swissrailpassion]

Two crossovers and one turnout.

Not out with the old but in with the new - Network Rail completes major signalling upgrades at Bridlington

Network Rail has completed major work to upgrade the signalling system and track at Bridlington to bring a more modern, reliable railway for passengers in East Yorkshire – all whilst leaving the much-loved lever frame in place.

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

 

[pdeaves]

Extract from Sectional Appendix. Two crossovers in terms of ironwork on the ground but one only leads to a protective sand drag.

 

[BoroAndy]

Cheers all. Seems odd platforms not renumbered to 1-3 at this stage. Plus where would they put a special if one were to terminate there, are there any sidings nearby?