CAF class 197 Civity for TfW: News and updates on introduction.

[craigybagel]

RTT current has 1V93 allocated as 9 coaches (3x 197/1)
I'm sure there'll be plenty of "due to a short platform" announcements on there!

Realtime Trains | 1V93 0631 Holyhead to Cardiff Central | 30/03/2024

Real-time train running information for 1V93 0631 departure from Holyhead to Cardiff Central on 30/03/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

It also had 115 and 101 both on 1V91. Can only imagine the two were swapped around overnight but the original allocations didn’t disappear from RTT for some reason. So 1V91 will be a six-car from Chester, I should think.

115 by itself from Holyhead to Chester, with 044 added on there. According to internal systems anyway.

 

[northwichcat]

I agree; good point. When the 158s started coming back from their Arriva/WAG 'Ocean Blue' refurbishment I overheard some fellow passengers admiring their nice new train. I think this was another example of 'normals' caring but not knowing - they noticed that their train was different from what they were used to, and their first impressions seemed to be good, but they didn't know it was actually a recently-refurbished train rather than a brand-new one.

Most passengers probably don't realise how old the 158s actually are, so may well think an operator has ordered some new trains that are an updated version of the old ones. If you told them the 158s are over 30 years old, it might be that they'd realise.

RTT current has 1V93 allocated as 9 coaches (3x 197/1)
I'm sure there'll be plenty of "due to a short platform" announcements on there!

Realtime Trains | 1V93 0631 Holyhead to Cardiff Central | 30/03/2024

Real-time train running information for 1V93 0631 departure from Holyhead to Cardiff Central on 30/03/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

It also had 115 and 101 both on 1V91. Can only imagine the two were swapped around overnight but the original allocations didn’t disappear from RTT for some reason. So 1V91 will be a six-car from Chester, I should think.

The delay at Chester may well have been to get passengers to move between sets and to lock one out-of-use.

 

[Caaardiff]

The delay at Chester may well have been to get passengers to move between sets and to lock one out-of-use

There's no need to lock 6 car sets out now with ASDO.

 

[northwichcat]

There's no need to lock 6 car sets out now with ASDO.

The services referenced is being operated by 3 x 3 car 197s. Locking one set out-of-use will still leave 6 carriages in use.

 

[craigybagel]

The services referenced is being operated by 3 x 3 car 197s. Locking one set out-of-use will still leave 6 carriages in use.

In theory there's no need to lock a set out as ASDO will only open all 9 cars at the stations that can platform 9.

In practice this is moot as 9 car operation isn't permitted yet.

And as I pointed out above, it was only a 5 car set.

 

[victormildrew]

Any updates on the 5 or 6 car 197s test runs between Manchester and Shrewsbury?.

 

[Lurcheroo]

Any updates on the 5 or 6 car 197s test runs between Manchester and Shrewsbury?.

The 5 car test definitely run, a good friend was on board it. not heard that anything had come of it yet.

 

[victormildrew]

The 5 car test definitely run, a good friend was on board it. not heard that anything had come of it yet.

Thank you.

 

[Bikeman78]

Most passengers probably don't realise how old the 158s actually are, so may well think an operator has ordered some new trains that are an updated version of the old ones. If you told them the 158s are over 30 years old, it might be that they'd realise.

When I was a kid, everything that existed before I was born was old, and everything that arrived afterwards was new. The difference was stark because it was the transition from slam doors to sliding doors. So I still think of 158s as new trains!

 

[Geoff DC]

When I was a kid, everything that existed before I was born was old, and everything that arrived afterwards was new. The difference was stark because it was the transition from slam doors to sliding doors. So I still think of 158s as new trains!

When I was a kid everything was Steam Hauled except for the Green Southern Electrics.
So everything has been new to me except the 150s that looked old, just like the Southern Electrics, even when new.

 

[Richard Scott]

When I was a kid, everything that existed before I was born was old, and everything that arrived afterwards was new. The difference was stark because it was the transition from slam doors to sliding doors. So I still think of 158s as new trains!

Hopefully not digressing but think many passengers have no idea how old trains are as they go through refurbishments now, a mark 1 was fairly much as built apart from fluorescent lights etc so seemed old as little had changed. Also designs haven't really changed much over past 30 years (I know to us there's obvious differences but to someone with no interest they wouldn't think one was much newer) whereas if you take a mark 3 and going 40 years earlier the changes are huge and obvious to anyone.
Remember being at East Grinstead on a bus rally on a Leyland National a few years back, some teenagers got on questioning why this bus was at a rally as it was too modern (even though was 30 years old at the time!).

 

[childwallblues]

Due to both Avanti and London North Western being on strike today TfW put four car trains on the Chester to Liverpool Lime Street servive today. Being Friday afternoon there are always large crowds from Runcorn heading into Liverpool. 197007/004 plus 197011/015 were noted on this mornings services.

 

[Kite159]

Due to both Avanti and London North Western being on strike today TfW put four car trains on the Chester to Liverpool Lime Street servive today. Being Friday afternoon there are always large crowds from Runcorn heading into Liverpool. 197007/004 plus 197011/015 were noted on this mornings services.

I bet the guard was busy selling tickets to those from Runcorn whom think payment is optional and would normally get away with it on LNR (where the guard tends to hide away in the back/middle cab) etc

 

[BillStampy]

Just noticed that 197044, the unit that broke down completely at Lydney earlier today, is still very much there! (out of the way in a loop of course)
I'm supposing something is going to go get it soon?

 

[Western 52]

Just noticed that 197044, the unit that broke down completely at Lydney earlier today, is still very much there! (out of the way in a loop of course)
I'm supposing something is going to go get it soon?

Looks like this is the rescue train.

Realtime Trains | 5E43 2202 Cardiff Canton Sidings to Lydney Down Goods Loop | 05/04/2024

Real-time train running information for 5E43 2202 departure from Cardiff Canton Sidings to Lydney Down Goods Loop on 05/04/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[BillStampy]

Looks like this is the rescue train.

Realtime Trains | 5E43 2202 Cardiff Canton Sidings to Lydney Down Goods Loop | 05/04/2024

Real-time train running information for 5E43 2202 departure from Cardiff Canton Sidings to Lydney Down Goods Loop on 05/04/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Seems to be, thanks.

 

[sd0733]

The 5 car test definitely run, a good friend was on board it. not heard that anything had come of it yet.

The tests were all successful but they were only test runs, a further 5 car proving run is required from Shrewsbury to Manchester before they can enter service as 5 cars.

 

[Lurcheroo]

The tests were all successful but they were only test runs, a further 5 car proving run is required from Shrewsbury to Manchester before they can enter service as 5 cars.

Ahh that’s good news ! Hopefully be sorted soon then.

 

[Jez]

The tests were all successful but they were only test runs, a further 5 car proving run is required from Shrewsbury to Manchester before they can enter service as 5 cars.

Are we realistically likely to see any 5 cars in service soon anyway regardless of proving runs? Acceptance into service seems to have slowed down again and there are still several 3 cars waiting to be Introduced. Most of the 197s on Manchester to South Wales are 2 or 3 cars. Very few doubled up to 4 cars which can run the entire route to Milford Haven as far as I know. There are still quite a lot of complaints from passengers about overcrowding on certain trains from Swansea to Cardiff and Manchester.

 

[sd0733]

Are we realistically likely to see any 5 cars in service soon anyway regardless of proving runs? Acceptance into service seems to have slowed down again and there are still several 3 cars waiting to be Introduced. Most of the 197s on Manchester to South Wales are 2 or 3 cars. Very few doubled up to 4 cars which can run the entire route to Milford Haven as far as I know. There are still quite a lot of complaints from passengers about overcrowding on certain trains from Swansea to Cardiff and Manchester.

Planned for "before the summer" but like you say lots will depend on unit availability anyway. Quite a few 150/153/158 covering again today on 197 diagrams without trying for extra diagrams to strengthen.

 

[Jez]

Planned for "before the summer" but like you say lots will depend on unit availability anyway. Quite a few 150/153/158 covering again today on 197 diagrams without trying for extra diagrams to strengthen.

How many 197 diagrams do we have now, 2 car and 3 car and how many uncovered today?

 

[Lurcheroo]

Are we realistically likely to see any 5 cars in service soon anyway regardless of proving runs? Acceptance into service seems to have slowed down again and there are still several 3 cars waiting to be Introduced. Most of the 197s on Manchester to South Wales are 2 or 3 cars. Very few doubled up to 4 cars which can run the entire route to Milford Haven as far as I know. There are still quite a lot of complaints from passengers about overcrowding on certain trains from Swansea to Cardiff and Manchester.

I believe a 6car ran from Holyhead to Cardiff today. It may be that a 3 car is running and there’s a 2 car that could be put on it but they can’t as they’re not cleared.
We will start to see more as more get accepted.

 

[nigelsporne]

106. and 11 ran as the Holyhead to Llanelli before Easter. However the day before that it was 122 on its own.

 

[sd0733]

How many 197 diagrams do we have now, 2 car and 3 car and how many uncovered today?

24 2 car and 13 3 cars diagrams.
Looks to be 6 either shortformed or 15x

 

[Jez]

24 2 car and 13 3 cars diagrams.
Looks to be 6 either shortformed or 15x

Thanks for the info. Seems to be quite a few diagrams now. Considering there were 27 175s and about 23 of them booked for service when they had a full allocation (not in their final 2 or so years) plus we have the MK4's although I am aware some former 15x and 170 diagrams such as Conwy Valley and Maesteg are 197s too.

 

[L401CJF]

The 0820 ish from Chester to Cardiff is usually a 5 car, 2 from Holyhead attaching to 3 at Chester.

I've been on a 6 car set from Holyhead to Chester before, funnily enough on Sunday evening with a handful of passengers on it.

 

[Nick Ashwell]

although I am aware some former 15x and 170 diagrams such as Conwy Valley and Maesteg are 197s too.

As a regular user of the Cheltenham - Maesteg service the numbers feel like they have increased recently, with a lower chance of a 150 turning up. Although we did have a cancelled 197 followed by a 153 the next hour the other day.

Stop boards are also now up on the Cheltenham leg, although placing them further from entrances than stopping used to occur (the Cheltenham bound platform at Caldicot comes to mind) seems a bit odd and means travellers can't get on the train directly outside the shelter or closer to the ramp up to the platform.

 

[BillStampy]

As a regular user of the Cheltenham - Maesteg service the numbers feel like they have increased recently, with a lower chance of a 150 turning up. Although we did have a cancelled 197 followed by a 153 the next hour the other day.

Unfortunately just up to bad luck really, I'm pretty sure you're talking about 197044's fail at Lydney last week where a bunch of 197s were switched around and off for a single 153! I knew all 3 coaches wasn't going to last! It does seem to be improving rapidly though!

 

[victormildrew]

6Q97 just left Abbey Foregate for Crewe 1x3 car 197. Sorry no number.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

6Q97 just left Abbey Foregate for Crewe 1x3 car 197. Sorry no number.

197124