Caledonian Sleeper

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by Essexman, 10 Jan 2019.

  1. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    It does appear that a shortage of 92s might have been the problem as 92006 off the down Highlander has appeared at Glasgow to take the empties (and 92043) to Polmadie.
     
  2. Mathew S

    Mathew S Established Member

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    I may be being thick, but why would a shortage of locomotives cause the service to have to be started at Motherwell rather than Glasgow Central?
     
  3. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    No engine to lead the empty stock into Glasgow Central and no run round facility.
     
  4. Mag_seven

    Mag_seven Established Member

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    Because to start at Glasgow Central you would need two locos - one for the empty coaching stock and one for the service itself. If there is no available loco for the ECS you can run it straight out of Polmadie down to Motherwell and start there with no reversal required.
     
  5. Steddenm

    Steddenm Member

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    One loco will take the ECS into GLC and sit on the buffers until another loco has taken the stock south to EUS. The ECS loco will then return to the depot. They need two Class 92s to be able to do this.
     
  6. marks87

    marks87 Established Member

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    Could this be the first demonstration of a significant drawback in having Dellner couplers?

    Obviously we can't assume an alternative loco would have been available, but it wasn't unheard of in the past for the Mk2/3 ECS to be brought in by a 66 or 47.
     
  7. Journeyman

    Journeyman Established Member

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    I've yet to do a full overnighter in the Mark 5s, but on Saturday morning I travelled in the seated car from Edinburgh to Fort William. I'd never normally consider doing a full night in the seats, so it's about the only time I'd ever use them.

    Must say I was quite impressed with the seated car, which I reckon is considerably better than the Mark 2s. The seats are spacious and comfortable, and I thought décor and lighting were good. Only niggle is that the coach was fresh out the depot on a changeover, and it was very cold when we boarded - it took some time to warm up, but the TM sorted us out with free hot drinks from the lounge car!

    Ride, like a lot of new vehicles, is a touch on the firm side, and was excessively bouncy on the dodgier bits of the WHL.
     
  8. Leo1961

    Leo1961 Member

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    Quite simply, yes.
     
  9. Meerkat

    Meerkat Established Member

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    Those luggage lockers can’t be all that big, and clambering into the bunks won’t be simple - the sliding partition and luggage locker means the ladder must be pretty near the foot of the bed with the ladder not pointing in the usual bunk bed angle.
     
  10. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    I'd argue that the first demonstration was after the brake issue at Stafford when a 92 had to be used as a translator at Crewe to allow a LSL 47 to shunt the coaches around but this is one of the first instances of it directly affecting the service.
     
  11. Mathew S

    Mathew S Established Member

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    Thank you all. Is there no facility at Central then, like there still is in some of the platforms at Manchester Piccadilly, for example, to stop short of the buffers and run a loco around? Whilst I don't imagine it being used very much, that would seem like a useful thing to have.
     
  12. Mag_seven

    Mag_seven Established Member

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    There isn't that facility although in days gone by they used to put some ECS into the carriage sidings outside the station, have the loco run round and then propel the stock in.
     
  13. SteveM70

    SteveM70 Member

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    Is there a compelling operational reason not to have done last night, or was operational convenience prioritised ahead of customer service?
     
  14. Mag_seven

    Mag_seven Established Member

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    The signalling arrangements might not permit it now - we are talking about quite a while ago when they used to do it. You would also need a shunter to assist with the propelling move.
     
  15. alangla

    alangla Member

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    Glasgow Central is also pretty busy right up to the close of service plus probably no-one that would be involved would have done a manoeuvre like that, so greatly increased risk of a mishap.

    In EWS days the ECS loco used to be whatever was sitting spare at Mossend, you could have a 37 one night and a 92 the next.
     
  16. Far north 37

    Far north 37 Established Member

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    Seen a few class 60s on it too.
     
  17. side effect

    side effect Member

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    Sleeper services cancelled tonight due to overhead line damage between Preston and Lancaster.
     
  18. Muenchener

    Muenchener Member

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    Cancelled? Why wouldn't they be diverted via the ECML?
     
  19. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    Diversions via the ECML cannot be organised at short notice

    For a start the longer running time means southbound passengers would be late arriving in London and northbound highlander portions would miss their paths beyond Edinburgh.

    I would guess that different traincrew are needed as well for ECML working who can't be arranged at short notice.

    With it being a Wednesday night, are the on board staff at the 'wrong' end as well?
     
  20. BRX

    BRX Established Member

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    Not something that can be arranged at short notice, I'd imagine. You have to reverse the train at Wembley, leave earlier, etc etc
     
  21. Essexman

    Essexman Established Member

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    I’ve cancelled my trip to Fort William.
    Can’t blame CS that the wires are down.
    Helpful lady from CS rang me back to tell me as soon as the decision was made.
    I was looking forward to my first trip on West Highland Line in the new stock.
     
  22. island

    island Established Member

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    What’s silly is that this isn’t front and centre on their web homepage (as at 1838hrs).
     
  23. Muenchener

    Muenchener Member

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    I understand some of the practicalities of that but how are the pax to reach their destinations? Tomorrow's service; 24 hrs later?
     
  24. JonathanH

    JonathanH Established Member

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    Not bother, go by alternative day train, replacement road transport or fly.

    If the railway line is not available then the train can't run - same as planes would be cancelled if airports were shut and coaches would be cancelled if the motorways were blocked.

    The sleeper isn't any more precious than the other trains that haven't got through today.
     
  25. cf111

    cf111 Established Member

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    That is very poor indeed. A previous iteration of the website had a light green bar at the very top advising visitors how things were running, it was very obvious. I am on a mobile so maybe it is still there on the desktop version.

    The one time that something similar to tonight has happened to me when First ran the show, they let us sleep on the train in Euston overnight and to travel north on either East Coast from Kings Cross or on Virgin from Euston. Hopefully this doesn't affect Friday night's workings as I don't fancy a coach from Inverness!
     
  26. Darandio

    Darandio Established Member

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    Replacement road transport is being arranged, they are also trying to sort ticket acceptance.

    One guy on Twitter has demanded they allow him to now use the 19:00 from Kings Cross instead but they told him ticket acceptance wasn't in place yet. He's adamant that he will go anyway and his ticket will be accepted. Good luck with that.
     
  27. cf111

    cf111 Established Member

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    I had just had a wee deek and Twitter and was about to post pretty much what you've said.

    I can understand the gent's frustrations even if I don't think he's being particularly polite with the person on the other side of the screen. The WCML has been disrupted for most of the day, I would have thought that ticket acceptance with LNER could have been sought at least in principal this afternoon and then advised to passengers after the 6pm decision to cancel the sleepers given the limited number of trains south later in the evening.
     
  28. Muenchener

    Muenchener Member

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    Rail Replacement transport is less than ideal for such journey but it gets people moving in the direction of travel and should help placate the understandable frustration.
    The guy going to Kings Cross may get what he wants; he's obviously buying time if he has already made his way there.
     
  29. Elecman

    Elecman Established Member

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    Once more no consideration of dragging over the Settle Carlisle
     
  30. Ianno87

    Ianno87 Established Member

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    What's there to consider if there's no route knowledge?
     

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