Carousel Buses (Go-Ahead group)

[Deerfold]

Carousel have announced that they are ready to take over routes from Arriva in the Wycombe area if/ when the depot there closes

Carousel Buses – response to closure of Arriva High Wycombe and Aylesbury

We will be stepping in to run additional services across High Wycombe.

www.carouselbuses.co.uk

I can reassure them that Carousel is ready to step in, to ensure bus users can still get to where they need to go. If Arriva does proceed with its plans to close the High Wycombe depot, we plan to immediately provide a service on current Arriva routes 2, 3, 5/5a, 6/6a, 7/7a, 10, 11, 12, 13, 800, 850 and X80, from the date of the closure.

With much discussion on why and what else is happening in this thread:

Arriva to close Aylesbury and High Wycombe depots

Which depot operates the X4 and X6 Aylesbury-MK as those aren't listed as ending? Or is that operated by Aylesbury now (thought it was) but going to move to Wolverton? Where are the Leighton Buzzard locals operated from, is there a depot there? Arriva have an outstation at Leighton Buzzard...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[greenline712]

The Oxford Bus Page has information about incoming buses for Carousel from 27 July:

Editorial

Just numbers at the moment . . . I have no idea what they are!!

 

[bussnapperwm]

The Oxford Bus Page has information about incoming buses for Carousel from 27 July:

Editorial

Just numbers at the moment . . . I have no idea what they are!!

The 61 plates are former National Express Dundee Volvo B7RLEs that they sold to McGills when Dundee was disposed of. The 48xxs mentioned of National Express West Midlands are Enviro400s of 2009 vintage, and the 68 plates are ex First Group Enviro200MMCs.

 

[cactustwirly]

Hope the Volvos are for the Wycombe - Reading routes

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The 61 plates are former National Express Dundee Volvo B7RLEs that they sold to McGills when Dundee was disposed of. The 48xxs mentioned of National Express West Midlands are Enviro400s of 2009 vintage, and the 68 plates are ex First Group Enviro200MMCs.

The 68 plates are the 12 e200mmc that have just come off lease from First Glasgow. I think the e400 from NXWM are also ones that have just come off lease too.

Deckers are perhaps a bit older than you'd have hoped. Otherwise, the Eclipses are almost a like for like replacement for Arriva's Citaros and the e200mmc are a bit of an upgrade on the Arriva Versas so overall positive.

 

[overthewater]

Do we know how long the buses are on lease for? I take it, at least 2 years?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Do we know how long the buses are on lease for? I take it, at least 2 years?

Which buses on which lease?

The former NXWM and First ones have been returned by those firms off lease. Whether Go Ahead are buying or leasing them, who knows?

 

[overthewater]

Which buses on which lease?

The former NXWM and First ones have been returned by those firms off lease. Whether Go Ahead are buying or leasing them, who knows?

I assumed Go-Ahead had just leased the buses in question and didn't think they would have bought them out right at this stage.

Of course the Volvo B7RLE have been bought outright.

 

[greenline712]

If I've got the numbers right, that means that Carousel are not taking any of the existing Arriva buses at the end of July.
Bearing in mind the comments elsewhere about the state of the Arriva fleet . . . that's probably not surprising !!!

 

[Russel]

I assumed Go-Ahead had just leased the buses in question and didn't think they would have bought them out right at this stage.

Of course the Volvo B7RLE have been bought outright.

I read somewhere that Go Ahead have brought the E400s from Dawsons Rentals but can't remember where I read it now.

They've had 10 years of heavy urban use, I can't imagine they're worth all that much.

 

[hst43102]

I read somewhere that Go Ahead have brought the E400s from Dawsons Rentals but can't remember where I read it now.

They've had 10 years of heavy urban use, I can't imagine they're worth all that much.

The batch were new in 2009, so it's more like 15 years of heavy urban use. I'd expect they are almost fully depreciated.

 

[Surreyman]

The batch were new in 2009, so it's more like 15 years of heavy urban use. I'd expect they are almost fully depreciated.

Upgraded to Euro 6 probably makes them an attractive buy, reported that the other 22 are fo Go South Coast, would very nicely displace all the Scanias at Bluestar, mostly used on school/college contracts? Just my speculation.

 

[hst43102]

Upgraded to Euro 6 probably makes them an attractive buy, reported that the other 22 are fo Go South Coast, would very nicely displace all the Scanias at Bluestar, mostly used on school/college contracts? Just my speculation.

I'd heard they may be heading to Swindon to replace OmniDekka's. Either option is quite possible...

 

[thedorsetone]

I'd heard they may be heading to Swindon to replace OmniDekka's. Either option is quite possible...

2 are for morebus after taking on extra work (kingston maurwood contract)

 

[bussnapperwm]

I read somewhere that Go Ahead have brought the E400s from Dawsons Rentals but can't remember where I read it now.

They've had 10 years of heavy urban use, I can't imagine they're worth all that much.

Yes, they are purchases, not leases. National Express WM leased them from Dawsons rentals new for the 9/141 Halesowen - Birmingham corridor. One of them is a reregistration due to a horrific incident which forced its internal transfer between depots (which is why there is no BX09 PFZ) in 2013/2014.

 

[Russel]

One of them is a reregistration due to a horrific incident which forced its internal transfer between depots (which is why there is no BX09 PFZ) in 2013/2014.

Ah yes, I'd forgotten about that, 4816 as new, wasn't it?

 

[bussnapperwm]

Ah yes, I'd forgotten about that, 4816 as new, wasn't it?

Yes, 4816 BX09PFZ. It's the one that became 4799.

 

[Edvid]

The second Flightline 102-refurbished E400MMC (608 / RW64 OXF) is back in service.

Corousel Country • 608 • RW64OXF

Route 102 (FlightLine (Chiltern Hundreds)) : High Wycombe Bus Station - Heathrow Central Bus Station

www.flickr.com

613 / JG64 OXF has been off-road since the end of April, so could be next in line. Seven of them (Luke Marion quote below) will be converted in total.

608 is the next E400 currently away for conversion for the 102 and we will be doing all of 608-614.

 

[Russel]

Any update on what the plan is for the ex NXWM E400's, now they've all been handed back?

 

[greenline712]

Editorial

Malcolm Crowe's site has lots of details of the new buses and pictures of the old order.

I don't know why the link shows that, but it does seem to work . . .

 

[Surreyman]

Carousel are going to use a yard near the existing depot for which they have been granted an operators licence for 40 discs, The use of the ex Arriva Lincoln road site is delayed/deferred.

PF1000671​

CAROUSEL BUSES LTD​

Licence details (PF1000671)​

• Business typeLimited Company
• Trading names
• DirectorsLUKE MARION
• PAUL RAYMOND HENNIGAN
• MARTIN DEAN
• NEIL BUTLER
• Licence typeStandard National
• Licence statusValid
• Continuation date31 Jan 2027
• Traffic areaEast of England

Contact details​

• AddressCOWLEY HOUSE, WATLINGTON ROAD, COWLEY, OXFORD, OX4 6GA, GB

Operating centres​

Operating centre	Vehicles	Trailers
UNIT 2, HUGHENDEN AVENUE, HIGH WYCOMBE, HP13 5SG, GB	50	0
BELLFIELD ROAD, HIGH WYCOMBE, HP13 5GX, GB	40	0

 

[RELL6L]

Any views from anyone close to Wycombe as to how things are going with Carousel?

Sunday appeared to see a few breakdowns etc but were all covered by replacements - not like Arriva of old.
Some odd allocations though, deckers on the 800 on a Sunday slightly overkill, and few buses that started the day finished it.
I saw one B7RLE heading very early through Marlow towards Wycombe and going the wrong way.
Quite a lot in odd colours, although the two greens on the old Dundee colours look quite pleasant.

Was out on a trip yesterday (report to follow) but today some very late running on some routes.
Citaro 888 on the 850 leaving Wycombe at 07.50 left half an hour late, took the wrong route after going over Henley Bridge and then the wrong route in Reading town centre. Left an hour late on the return 800 journey, missed out Lower Caversham and Dunsden Green and then vanished...
Other journeys have started very late but caught up time, showing how much slack there is, eg 228 on the 07.30 850 ex Reading left 18 late but reached Wycombe on time.
I do want Carousel to do well, but they have set themselves ambitious timetables on the 32 and 33 with the aim of keeping the same frequency on the 32 with one less bus and more journeys on the 33 (Totteridge leg) with the same buses. it might work in school holidays but come September when Wycombe traffic hits....
Also, 09-plate E400s on Wycombe's hills - even if they have been well maintained with NXWM - if vehicles this old are anything like as unreliable as Arriva's ones then they will be a problem.

 

[EnviroExplorer]

Spent a day on Carosuel yesterday, overall not too bad but room for improvement definitely. Impressed to see leaflets available on buses and at all stands at Wycombe Bus Stayion, lots of posters too advertising key routes like the 1 and 102, and up to date timetables everywhere I found myself. Seemed like senior management (recognised their faces!) were on the floor if you will, at Wycombe doing their best to interact with customers and keep things running smoothly as best they could.

Noticed one ex First E200MMC going back to depot around midday, not sure of the issues but it was driven back (overheard driver conversation).

Experienced one journey cancellation on the 34 in the afternoon, although luckily I was at Wycombe so simply chose another bus to ride.

I made a return journey to Henley and in both cases there was room for improvement. The ex Dundee Volvo going down was very presentable with branding on the cove panels for all the places the 800/850 serve, but lost its gears on a roundabout and thankfully was fine after that. The driver left at least 5 minutes early from the timing point in Henley Centre before waiting further down the route.

The return journey was a 1 branded Citaro, which was duly swapped back onto the 1 at Wycombe. I was tracking its progress and it made up at least 8 minutes delay to arrive at Henley some 5 minutes early. The driver was by no means fast either. In Marlow the usual routing to serve Queens Road and Dean Street was missed out, and a wrong turn was taken onto the A404 missing out Marlow Bottom. The bus itself was immaculate though and the air conditioning welcomed.

Being from Birmingham I’m keen to see how our E400s will do on faster more challenging routes. Rode 80952 on the 32 which was a good vehicle all around with plenty of power, meanwhile 80956 on the 36 really struggled on the hills and didn’t smell too good either! As well as this it had one of the covers for the lights missing downstairs with wires exposed, which isn’t a great look. They were well looked after on the whole at National Express, but had a real tendency to go into ‘limp mode’ and lose power.

Interesting times ahead and I’ll be down Wycombe more in the future no doubt!

 

[sturfc]

Being local popped down into town each of the days this week, however it seems roadworks have hit today, causing a diversion out of the bus station as it became too tight to turn right out of the bus station which certainly has not helped.
Will be good to see more buses painted, which of course takes time but they are certainly making an effort over Arriva. Carousel staff continue to be visible in the bus station and timetable leaflets continue to be readily available.

 

[greenline712]

I've now had a chance to look at the new Carousel timetables, and I reckon the new PVRs are:

1-1A-1B: 9 buses.
102: 6 buses.
103: 3 buses.
104: 3 buses.
41-106-107: 5 buses.
800-850: 7 buses.
27: 1 bus.
30-31: 4 buses.
32: 5 buses.
33: 5 buses.
34: 3 buses (this could be 2 buses, but is rather tight!).
36-37: 4 buses.
38-39: 1 bus.
275: 1 bus.
577-581-583: 2 buses.

This looks like a total PVR of 59 basic buses. There may well be private school contracts to add to this. I haven't added in any buses for PickMeUp operations.
The timetables seem to ease out timings in peak hours, thereby adding robustness to schedules, and not requiring peak extras for that reason.

I'd expect, with 10% spares, to see a fleet total of around 65 buses, but I've seen elsewhere that up to 95 buses may be allocated!!
I'm not local to High Wycombe . . . anyone got any further information to add?

 

[Surreyman]

I've now had a chance to look at the new Carousel timetables, and I reckon the new PVRs are:

1-1A-1B: 9 buses.
102: 6 buses.
103: 3 buses.
104: 3 buses.
41-106-107: 5 buses.
800-850: 7 buses.
27: 1 bus.
30-31: 4 buses.
32: 5 buses.
33: 5 buses.
34: 3 buses (this could be 2 buses, but is rather tight!).
36-37: 4 buses.
38-39: 1 bus.
275: 1 bus.
577-581-583: 2 buses.

This looks like a total PVR of 59 basic buses. There may well be private school contracts to add to this. I haven't added in any buses for PickMeUp operations.
The timetables seem to ease out timings in peak hours, thereby adding robustness to schedules, and not requiring peak extras for that reason.

I'd expect, with 10% spares, to see a fleet total of around 65 buses, but I've seen elsewhere that up to 95 buses may be allocated!!
I'm not local to High Wycombe . . . anyone got any further information to add?

Just plotted on bustimes @1800 - no school routes, there must be interworking so pvr between routes will vary. Double deckers mostly on routes 1a/31/36/27/106/107.
1-1a-1b = 11 buses
30 = 2 buses
31 = 3 buses
32 = 5 buses
33 = 3 buses
34 = 4 buses
36 = 1 buses
37 = 3 buses
38 = 1 bus
39 + nil
41 = 2 buses
102 = 7 buses
103 = 7 buses
104 = 5 buses
106 = 1 bus
107 = 4 buses
275 = 1 bus
583 = 1 bus
800/850 = 6 buses
Just a snapshot.

 

[RELL6L]

I think @greenline712 is closer here. But the 33 has 4 buses while the 34 is 2 buses, although I suspect these (and others) will be quite challenging in the school terms.

There are school variations on the 36 and 37 which will mean extra vehicles in school times, also the morning X80. But the 27 can work off a peak extra.

 

[greenline712]

I think @greenline712 is closer here. But the 33 has 4 buses while the 34 is 2 buses, although I suspect these (and others) will be quite challenging in the school terms.

There are school variations on the 36 and 37 which will mean extra vehicles in school times, also the morning X80. But the 27 can work off a peak extra.

AARRGGHH . . . two Desborough Castle timing points!! I agree with your 4 buses! I'm not sure about the 34 . . . 2 minutes stand time at the Bus Station after a 58 minute rounder looks a bit heroic!! Although the 36/37 cycle might have possibilities for some interworking?

When I was there on Tuesday, there was only one bus laying over on the stand area between 1130 and 1230.

 

[RELL6L]

I'm not sure about the 34 . . . 2 minutes stand time at the Bus Station after a 58 minute rounder looks a bit heroic!! Although the 36/37 cycle might have possibilities for some interworking?

Yes but that seems to be what they do. Look at 82002 today, on the 34 all day, mostly every hour.

The 36/37 seems to be stand alone, generally with deckers. This was mainly where Arriva used deckers at least in school terms.

 

[jackgwycombe]

Carousel service changes from 1st September:
September service changes

the one 1 1A 1B 1C 1S

In partnership with Buckinghamshire Council, a new variant 1C will connect Chartridge with Chesham, Amersham and High Wycombe up to every hour on weekdays. Service 1 will also be altered to operate via Botley and Ley Hill and will no longer serve Lye Green.

34

The 0710 weekday journey from High Wycombe Coachway will be extended to run from Lane End at 0650 providing a new morning journey into Cressex and the Town Centre.

36

Service 36 will be increased to operate every 30 minutes between High Wycombe and Bourne End. The Sunday service will be replaced by new service 37B (see below). Together with services 37 and 37A, this restores the High Wycombe to Bourne End weekday frequency to up to every 15 minutes.

37 37A 37B 37S

We are pleased to be introducing a new Sunday service to Maidenhead on service 37, initially on trial basis. We hope this enhancement will be well used and that we can make this Sunday extension permanent.

Working with Buckinghamshire Council, a new 37A variant will be introduced running via Kingsmead Road, with service 37 returning to operate via the London Road through Wycombe Marsh and Loudwater. Buses will run up to every 30 minutes on weekdays, and together with service 36, this restores the High Wycombe to Bourne End weekday frequency to up to every 15 minutes.

Some journeys will also operate via the London Road between Wycombe Marsh and Loudwater. Journey variations will be as follows:

37 via London Road, Station Road and Boundary Road
37A via Kingsmead Road and Boundary Road
37B (on Sundays) via London Road, Station Road, Treadaway Hill, Flackwell Heath and White Pit Lane
37S (on school days only) via Kingsmead Road and Boundary Road, extending to Bourne End Academy after Bourne End Station

41 41H 41S

We will be amending the route of service 41 between Great Missenden and Amersham in partnership with Buckinghamshire Council, operating via Hyde Heath and Chesham Bois instead of Old Amersham. Within Amersham, buses will operate via Chestnut Lane, New Road, Plantation Road and Grimsdell’s Lane. Frequent connections are available in Amersham to travel to Old Amersham, with buses operating up to every 15 minutes on the one.

In addition, a new 41H variant will operate on school days, providing links for students in Prestwood and Great Kingshill travelling to Holmer Green Senior School.

Flightline 102

We have worked with Heathrow Airport to improve the Sunday service, with new early morning and late evening journeys. As a result of this, we’ll be operating a consistent timetable overnight on all days of the week.

103 X103

More trips will operate in peak periods, with a review of journeys operating between Slough and Windsor in order to make these improvements possible. There will also be additional late evening trips between High Wycombe, Beaconsfield and Slough to provide greater travel opportunities on Mondays to Saturdays, though these will not operate to Windsor.

Following the introduction of service X103 on Sundays and Public Holidays in June, we’ll be making some enhancements from September, with the hourly service operating all through the day. There will also be an additional round trip added to the timetable with new journeys from High Wycombe to Slough at 1800 and Slough to High Wycombe at 1900.

104

We’re adding a new morning trip from The Chalfonts and Seer Green to Beaconsfield and High Wycombe, providing an arrival into the town at 0720. There will also be some amendments to the journey times to maintain the headway of buses between High Wycombe and Beaconsfield.

For the first time, service 104 will operate on Sundays and Public Holidays, linking Seer Green and The Chalfonts with Uxbridge and Beaconsfield. For customers wishing to travel onward to High Wycombe, journeys are timed to enable an easy connection with Flightline 102 which runs every 30 minutes from Beaconsfield, Maxwell Road.

106 107

Services 106 and 107 will see some minor timing changes to improve punctuality during peak times.

583

Service 583 will see some minor timing changes to improve punctuality.

850

Following taking over services 800 and 850 from Arriva in July, we have identified a number of areas to improve the timetable. All buses will operate as service 850, via Wargrave and Twyford between Henley-on-Thames and Reading, up to every 20 minutes Monday - Friday, every 30 minutes on Saturday and hourly on Sunday.

As such, the 800 and X80 variants will no longer operate, with other links now available for those travelling between Reading, Caversham, Dunsden Green, Binfield Heath and Henley-on-Thames.

Some nice improvements to the network - great to see frequencies restored to Reading and Bourne End. I do think its slightly odd having the 850 as the only Reading service as it is 10 minutes slower than the 800. Though this will provide a more consistent service throughout the day now, it would be ideal if the 28 took the slower route of the 850, so passengers from Wycombe could have a faster journey to Reading as service 800.

I am surprised there haven't been changes to the 32 or 33 town services, as I think these could have some reliability issues come September!