Class 345 progress

[macaronlover]

 

[matt_world2004]

Anyone notice the floor appears to scuff really easily making it look dirty.

 

[IainG81]

The only thing I'm not sold on yet, I had my first ride on Monday 21st are the on board announcements i don't like "change here for National Rail Services" i would prefer "change here for services to Greenford" I'm already on a National Rail Service. Other than that I'm happy with the first day.

 

[gazr]

My only suggestion is they turn down/off the rather annoying buzzer sound the door makes whilst turning around at Paddington, especially in the coach nearest the buffer stops.

 

[samuelmorris]

I think if that was going to happen they'd have done that already - Liverpool Street has been putting up with that for almost a year now!

 

[transmanche]

The only thing I'm not sold on yet, I had my first ride on Monday 21st are the on board announcements i don't like "change here for National Rail Services" i would prefer "change here for services to Greenford" I'm already on a National Rail Service.

I assume you realise that how such things are announced on all TfL-operated services (LO, LU, DLR, etc.) and it avoids having to create a unique announcement for every single interchange.

Perhaps if you mentally insert the word 'other' between 'for' and 'National' you'll feel happier...

 

[leomartin125]

Modern Railways stated that it was down to 'not been cleared for service' as to why the 9 Car 345's aren't in service on the Hayes shuttles currently. However during my time riding the 345's yesterday, I noticed that a 7 car only just fit in Hayes bay, as the buffers are in a seemingly temporary position at the country end as a result of the station being upgraded, with the extension at the London end complete. Maybe this could also be a reason why TfL Rail are running 7 cars instead of 9? And because the 9 cars aren't cleared for service as mentioned already...

 

[Sebastian O]

The platform isn’t designed for XR at Hayes - the plan was 9 car 4tph to Heathrow, but when the issues came up about clearance via the Heathrow tunnels, and they had to gut two per hour to Heathrow (Class 360) and then a seven car into the bay as it isn’t suitable to have a 9 car on a turnback service into the reliefs.

Hence why the platform hasn’t been put to 12 - there is any room, but it is had a carriage worth of an extension back over the old station building footprint.

 

[swt_passenger]

The platform isn’t designed for XR at Hayes - the plan was 9 car 4tph to Heathrow, but when the issues came up about clearance via the Heathrow tunnels, and they had to gut two per hour to Heathrow (Class 360) and then a seven car into the bay as it isn’t suitable to have a 9 car on a turnback service into the reliefs.

Hence why the platform hasn’t been put to 12 - there is any room, but it is had a carriage worth of an extension back over the old station building footprint.

However TfL have said it would be extended to allow 9 car 345 operation...

 

[Railperf]

Is it a single unit operating the Hayes shuttle? From what i can see, the turnaround time is literally only a few minutes at each end!

 

[Kite159]

Is it a single unit operating the Hayes shuttle? From what i can see, the turnaround time is literally only a few minutes at each end!

Should be 2 units which pass each other around Ealing Broadway area

 

[AY1975]

I see from the Real Time Trains site that the Paddington-Hayes shuttles have train reporting numbers prefixed with a 9 rather than a 2. Stopping trains are normally Class 2, but presumably they have been designated Class 9 to tell signallers that they must use the bay platform at Hayes?

Class 9 is mainly used for Eurostar trains, but it also used for certain other trains with special requirements - for example Euston-Scotland via Birmingham trains to tell signallers not to divert them via the Trent Valley in case of late running.

Also of note on Real Time Trains is that they are shown as being booked for Class 360s rather than 345s.

 

[Railperf]

I'm surprised how short the turnarounds are at each end , less than 10 minutes!! Is it a pair of 345's running this shuttle or a 345 and something else I.E 360?

 

[mjn]

I saw 345036 at Crewe on the 18/05. First time ive seen one and didn't realise how big they were.

345036 Crewe by Mark Nulty, on Flickr

And here's what dragged it in

67028 & 345036 Crewe by Mark Nulty, on Flickr

 

[transmanche]

Also of note on Real Time Trains is that they are shown as being booked for Class 360s rather than 345s.

As is regularly pointed out, RTT does not tell you what type of traction has been booked for any particular service - merely what type of traction it has been timed for.

Presumably, in this case, it's been done so that if a 360 needs to substitute for a 345 it can do so and keep to the schedule.

 

[hwl]

I see from the Real Time Trains site that the Paddington-Hayes shuttles have train reporting numbers prefixed with a 9 rather than a 2. Stopping trains are normally Class 2, but presumably they have been designated Class 9 to tell signallers that they must use the bay platform at Hayes?

Class 9 is mainly used for Eurostar trains, but it also used for certain other trains with special requirements - for example Euston-Scotland via Birmingham trains to tell signallers not to divert them via the Trent Valley in case of late running.

Also of note on Real Time Trains is that they are shown as being booked for Class 360s rather than 345s.

All London Overground and Thameslink ECML services too.

 

[samuelmorris]

I see from the Real Time Trains site that the Paddington-Hayes shuttles have train reporting numbers prefixed with a 9 rather than a 2. Stopping trains are normally Class 2, but presumably they have been designated Class 9 to tell signallers that they must use the bay platform at Hayes?

Class 9 is mainly used for Eurostar trains, but it also used for certain other trains with special requirements - for example Euston-Scotland via Birmingham trains to tell signallers not to divert them via the Trent Valley in case of late running.

Also of note on Real Time Trains is that they are shown as being booked for Class 360s rather than 345s.

I don't imagine they'll have changed the timings yet, not until the current 'half and half' situation is resolved and 345s are used on all the ex-HC services.

 

[AY1975]

All London Overground and Thameslink ECML services too.

Thameslink ECML services yes, but I can't find any LO services on RTT that are Class 9: they all appear to be Class 2.

Does anyone know why the Paddington-Hayes and Thameslink ECML services are Class 9?

 

[Domh245]

Thameslink ECML services yes, but I can't find any LO services on RTT that are Class 9: they all appear to be Class 2.

Does anyone know why the Paddington-Hayes and Thameslink ECML services are Class 9?

LO services through the ELL core are class 9, ditto Thameslink services through the Thameslink core. I'm not sure why the Paddington-H&H services are class 9, but it'll be to draw the attention of the signaller, I seem to remember that when 16xs started working the Bristol - Cardiff services, they were class 9 as there was a platforming restriction on them at Newport (?) - perhaps reminding them that they need to run into certain platforms at Paddington?

 

[AY1975]

LO services through the ELL core are class 9, ditto Thameslink services through the Thameslink core. I'm not sure why the Paddington-H&H services are class 9, but it'll be to draw the attention of the signaller, I seem to remember that when 16xs started working the Bristol - Cardiff services, they were class 9 as there was a platforming restriction on them at Newport (?) - perhaps reminding them that they need to run into certain platforms at Paddington?

Or maybe because they need to use the terminal bay at H&H?

 

[TEW]

Looks like only 1 set today! 9P39 terminated at platform 14 at 15:37 with a 10 min turnaround to form the 15:47 9T44. This has been happening almost all day. Possibly due to the disruption today further down the line!

That is correct. The turnaround times are about 5-10 minutes at both ends with a roughly 20 minute journey time, so 2 sets required, passing each other around Ealing Broadway. Looks like 2 units in operation today as usual.

 

[swt_passenger]

Class 9 is mainly used for Eurostar trains, but it also used for certain other trains with special requirements...

Given the comparative numbers, it’s probably time for people to stop explaining every few weeks that Class 9 is “mainly Eurostar”...

 

[matt_world2004]

What do the class numbers mean?

 

[Fred43123]

I assume they use the class 9 headcodes to remind TVSC which services are XR and which are GW/HX etc.

 

[Domh245]

What do the class numbers mean?

(simplified)

Class 0: Light Engine
Class 1: Express Passenger
Class 2: Stopping Passenger
Class 3: Parcels or ECS
Class 4: 75mph max. freight (typically intermodals)
Class 5: ECS
Class 6: 60mph max. freight
Class 7: 45mph max. freight
Class 8: 25mph max. freight
Class 9: International, or for otherwise highlighting for signalling purposes.

 

[TEW]

I assume they use the class 9 headcodes to remind TVSC which services are XR and which are GW/HX etc.

Wouldn't have thought it was of much relevance to the signaller which TOC operates the service. 2Sxx headcodes were previously used for trains terminating in the Hayes Bay, without any major problems being reported. The use of Class 9 headcodes suggests that there is a restriction on where 345s can go at present.

 

[Fred43123]

Wouldn't have thought it was of much relevance to the signaller which TOC operates the service. 2Sxx headcodes were previously used for trains terminating in the Hayes Bay, without any major problems being reported. The use of Class 9 headcodes suggests that there is a restriction on where 345s can go at present.

Must be so they don’t send them to Heathrow as I’m aware they’re still having issues with the signalling on the 345s

 

[TEW]

Must be so they don’t send them to Heathrow as I’m aware they’re still having issues with the signalling on the 345s

That's illogical. GWR services also can't be sent to Heathrow, but they don't need Class 9 headcodes.

 

[swt_passenger]

That's illogical. GWR services also can't be sent to Heathrow, but they don't need Class 9 headcodes.

I had the same thought.
Perhaps they are just getting ahead for when they eventually go down the hole. Or maybe they have platform limitations at PAD. Thinking about those earlier explanations about curved platforms and centre doors?

 

[TEW]

I had the same thought.
Perhaps they are just getting ahead for when they eventually go down the hole. Or maybe they have platform limitations at PAD. Thinking about those earlier explanations about curved platforms and centre doors?

That would sound like a more likely explanation to me.