Class 390

[Bittern]

I've never been on a Pendolino, but I have been on a Super Voyager once (okay, only Motherwell - Glasgow but still!). It was quite nice, I enjoyed it.

It's the only Virgin Train I've ever been on sadly.

 

[generalvegitable]

when they first came out I was like hey this is great, its so quiet, and fast, and look at the cool radios! (but then again I was young and driven by technology) but now I realise that that was to distract you from how unbelievably sh!t they are! the seats don't align to the tiny windows, no legroom (its almost as bad as a bus), the radio is never even on! and it always feels like its about to fall apart, recently when I was one one, I heard a loud buzzing from inside the wall, yes inside the wall, and I can't get comfortable on the run from milton keynes to euston, I dread to think what its like going from euston to Glasgow, it must be one of the most uncomfortably built trains ever!

 

[whoosh]

A staggering ONE THIRD of the seats in standard class have a limited view, or no view at all through the windows. The seats are cramped and even at a window seat they are claustrophobic as the top of the windows is so low.
I used to think Voyagers were horrible trains, but they are very light and airy and comfortable compared to Pendolinos.

One of my friends lives in Preston and was very disappointed one day when he met me in London, complaining about how rubbish the train journey was. He'd been looking forward to relaxing in his seat, reading a book, and watching the world go by out of the window. Not much legroom, the sudden movements of the train tilting distracted him from his book, and what window??!!
On another occassion I met him in London again - it took him over five hours to get from Preston. He was annoyed at the length of the journey, but said that the train itself, "...wasn't too bad - it was alright actually." It had been a Voyager diverted via the Chiltern line.


I think the fact that Voyagers are thought of as an "alright" train shows how rubbish the Pendolino is.

If I wanted the travel experience of travelling in the back of a van, I'd find a dodgy bloke with a van!
I live in Derby and if I'm visiting my friend in Preston I can drive or get the train. I can get free travel to Crewe, and then 'Priv' (staff) rate from there to Preston. I did the journey once on the train, and I now ALWAYS drive despite it costing me more, because these trains are so awful.


Here's a couple of pics of the interior. How much daylight can you see? Especially in the first one?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/cumbria/travel/pendolino/images/train150x180.jpg
http://www.railwaypictures.co.uk/data/media/7/DSCF2191.jpg

Compare with the APT: http://www.apt-p.com/GArcherf.jpg

 

[Geezertronic]

Maybe I have travelled on different Pendolino's to you complainers...

 

[voyagerdude220]

I've recently completed my only journey in standard class on a Pendolino, with contrasting experiences on each leg.

On the way from Crewe to London, I could barely see out of the window, and had to strain my head if i wanted to see where we are, but at that angle, I couldn't read the signs. (If the window was bigger, like the ones in FC, i wouldn't have to read the signs, as I would've known where we are)

On the way back from London, I shared a 4-seat table with a friend, and fully appreciated the window view.

Although I found the different styling of the seating in SC a little hard to adjust to, compared to what i'm used to in FC, if the Pendolino's had bigger windows, SC would be very reasonable.

I'm confused about why the Super Voyager windows are far, far bigger than Pendolino's, as i'm wondering whether the few extra degrees more which Pendolino's tilt into corners, compared to Super Voyagers, demand the far smaller windows?

 

[generalvegitable]

I think that the small windows are to accomodate the luggage racks and other sh!t above the seats

 

[Geezertronic]

I just hope that common sense will prevail when the new Pendolino stock gets built but we'll have to wait and see... I still like them though

 

[generalvegitable]

there should be a subclass with decent sized windows

 

[MCR247]

I've recently completed my only journey in standard class on a Pendolino, with contrasting experiences on each leg.

On the way from Crewe to London, I could barely see out of the window, and had to strain my head if i wanted to see where we are, but at that angle, I couldn't read the signs. (If the window was bigger, like the ones in FC, i wouldn't have to read the signs, as I would've known where we are)
On the way back from London, I shared a 4-seat table with a friend, and fully appreciated the window view.

Although I found the different styling of the seating in SC a little hard to adjust to, compared to what i'm used to in FC, if the Pendolino's had bigger windows, SC would be very reasonable.

I'm confused about why the Super Voyager windows are far, far bigger than Pendolino's, as i'm wondering whether the few extra degrees more which Pendolino's tilt into corners, compared to Super Voyagers, demand the far smaller windows?

So now windows are bigger in FC??

 

[voyagerdude220]

The view available from around 142 out of the 145 FC seats is very good, with no pillars in sight.

 

[SuperVoyager]

A staggering ONE THIRD of the seats in standard class have a limited view, or no view at all through the windows. The seats are cramped and even at a window seat they are claustrophobic as the top of the windows is so low.
I used to think Voyagers were horrible trains, but they are very light and airy and comfortable compared to Pendolinos.

One of my friends lives in Preston and was very disappointed one day when he met me in London, complaining about how rubbish the train journey was. He'd been looking forward to relaxing in his seat, reading a book, and watching the world go by out of the window. Not much legroom, the sudden movements of the train tilting distracted him from his book, and what window??!!
On another occassion I met him in London again - it took him over five hours to get from Preston. He was annoyed at the length of the journey, but said that the train itself, "...wasn't too bad - it was alright actually." It had been a Voyager diverted via the Chiltern line.


I think the fact that Voyagers are thought of as an "alright" train shows how rubbish the Pendolino is.

If I wanted the travel experience of travelling in the back of a van, I'd find a dodgy bloke with a van!
I live in Derby and if I'm visiting my friend in Preston I can drive or get the train. I can get free travel to Crewe, and then 'Priv' (staff) rate from there to Preston. I did the journey once on the train, and I now ALWAYS drive despite it costing me more, because these trains are so awful.


Here's a couple of pics of the interior. How much daylight can you see? Especially in the first one?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/cumbria/travel/pendolino/images/train150x180.jpg
http://www.railwaypictures.co.uk/data/media/7/DSCF2191.jpg

Compare with the APT: http://www.apt-p.com/GArcherf.jpg

Yes i know what a pendo inside looks like.. Looks better than any train ive ever seen.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Thats why i hate them, But i hate 221`s more!

Look ian, Everyone likes differnent things, so stop having a go at me because i like pendolinos....

THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THEM!!!!
Lots wrong with the old S!IT YOU CALL TRAINS

 

[me123]

Here's a couple of pics of the interior. How much daylight can you see? Especially in the first one?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/cumbria/travel/pendolino/images/train150x180.jpg

Not very much in the First one. Mostly because it's looking down the aisle and not at any windows

As much as I'm a fan of the Pendolinos, I can not find any justification for the windows. They're too small, too far apart and let the train down.

Otherwise, I can not see why people continually fault the train. I find it comfortable; I've done Euston-Glasgow and have had no problems with comfort. The speeds are excellent. The tilting is fun! (Although I appreciate why it would make some people nauseous!). The shop is a fantastic idea, and quite well implemented. And, as I've said earlier on, they've revolutionised WCML travel. Successful? I say yes.

 

[SuperVoyager]

Not very much in the First one. Mostly because it's looking down the aisle and not at any windows

As much as I'm a fan of the Pendolinos, I can not find any justification for the windows. They're too small, too far apart and let the train down.

Otherwise, I can not see why people continually fault the train. I find it comfortable; I've done Euston-Glasgow and have had no problems with comfort. The speeds are excellent. The tilting is fun! (Although I appreciate why it would make some people nauseous!). The shop is a fantastic idea, and quite well implemented. And, as I've said earlier on, they've revolutionised WCML travel. Successful? I say yes.

I say YES aswell!
Long Live The Pendolino!

 

[generalvegitable]

Here's a couple of pics of the interior. How much daylight can you see? Especially in the first one?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/cumbria/travel/pendolino/images/train150x180.jpg
http://www.railwaypictures.co.uk/data/media/7/DSCF2191.jpg

Compare with the APT: http://www.apt-p.com/GArcherf.jpg

That APT sure looks comfortable

 

[SuperVoyager]

That APT sure looks comfortable

Looks old

 

[generalvegitable]

but those seats are to die for after a journey on a pendo

 

[Bungle]

The big problem is that people on here, not unreasonably, see things predominantly from an enthusiast point of view. The main function of a passenger train is to get people from A to B safely. The Pendolino serves the purpose for which it was designed very well - it is safe, smooth, reliable and fast. While the window alignment might be an issue among the enthusiast fraternity and, to an extent, the general public, it's hardly the massive issue that many on here would have us believe. Inconvenient, yes, but I have sat on an EMT Mk3 or 222 many times and been up against a piece of plastic, yet this never gets mentioned. The reason MOST people get the train is to get from one place to another quickly - not to indulge in a bit of sightseeing. If you want to see a bit of the Lake District, as someone mentioned earlier, then why not either move to a different seat or, better still, go on holiday there.

Every time I've travelled on a 390 I've been impressed with the smoothness of the ride, the general ambience and the train in general. On the odd occasion that I've not had a window view, I've either moved seat or just read a newspaper, and just relaxed instead of sitting huffing and puffing about the injustices of replacing all the 'wonderful' old stock with these nasty plastic new trains. And to the person who said a 222 was better - have you tried sitting near the toilets on one of them? AND you have the underfloor engine vibration. They are not particularly pleasant things.

Nobody's saying they're perfect - yes, the luggage space provision is poor and the seats are a bit hard - but a lot of the criticism here fails to see the trains from the point of view of the average passenger rather than the spotter. And to compare it with 'a van', as one poster above did, is ridiculous and I'm sure most reasonable people can see that.

On a final note, have a look at some pictures of the rail crashes at Ufton Nervet and Grayrigg. Both 95mph derailments, both intercity stock. I know which train I'd rather have been in.

 

[SuperVoyager]

On a final note, have a look at some pictures of the rail crashes at Ufton Nervet and Grayrigg. Both 95mph derailments, both intercity stock. I know which train I'd rather have been in.

Pendolino?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

but those seats are to die for after a journey on a pendo

So your saying you like the pendolino seats..?

 

[87015]

On a final note, have a look at some pictures of the rail crashes at Ufton Nervet and Grayrigg. Both 95mph derailments, both intercity stock. I know which train I'd rather have been in.

One was a derailment, one was an impact crash. Bit of a difference in forces there.

 

[Bungle]

I'm aware of that, and initially yes the impact forces would have been different but the leading vehicle (the power car) would have borne much of the brunt of it. Regardless of that - I don't want to get dragged off topic on to a technical discussion, because I'm not really qualified to discuss it in any depth - I don't think you can deny that the crashworthiness of the Pendolino far outperforms that of the Mk3. That was the point I was trying to make.

 

[SuperVoyager]

I'm aware of that, and initially yes the impact forces would have been different but the leading vehicle (the power car) would have borne much of the brunt of it. Regardless of that - I don't want to get dragged off topic on to a technical discussion, because I'm not really qualified to discuss it in any depth - I don't think you can deny that the crashworthiness of the Pendolino far outperforms that of the Mk3. That was the point I was trying to make.

You all complain about the windows, but none of them smashed at the greyrigg incident

 

[devon_metro]

So your saying you like the pendolino seats..?

Quite obviously he isn't :?

You all complain about the windows, but none of them smashed at the greyrigg incident

What has that got to do with anything. All of the windows in a pendolino were laminated so less likely to smash, also it was only a side impact, so the forces that cause windows to pop out of frames and smash were not present.

As for the Mk3 related incidents, at that time they did not have laminated glass which is less strong. Also, in a collision the forces cause the train to squash so inevitably there will be more window damage as they provide quite a lot of the structural support.

I'd much rather travel on a Mk3 (fgw refurb whatever i don't care)

The chances of a crash are very low.

 

[SuperVoyager]

Quite obviously he isn't :?

Well " To Die For" Means you like something.

 

[devon_metro]

Notice

after a journey on a pendo

Suggesting whatever seat he refers to is to die for having travelled on a pendolino...

 

[generalvegitable]

I was talking about the APT

 

[snuk]

I haven't really had that much experience of either the old HST's or of Pendolinos but I have to say I love both of them, that is, when I can find a seat - that's the only thing that puts me off and of course the window issue on the Pendolinos.

I've only done short trips - back in the late 90's on Virgin XC from Coventry to Leamington on the HST's and today one trip between Wolves and Telford on a WSR.

A few weeks ago I went from Rugby to International on two Pendolinos - standard seated at Rugby and then from Cov to International standing.

But today I tried First Class for the first time on a three short trips in the West Mids and absolutely loved every second - completely different world to standard class - you get what you pay for - especially as they were really quiet - much better than the AXC Turbostar/Class 22x sardine cans :roll:

Spent a far bit of money today travelling around the west mids - almost £50 - but I was well looked after on the Pendolinos and in the lounges.

Steve.

 

[SuperVoyager]

I wouldent mind if i had to stand all the way from london to glasgow.

 

[Oswyntail]

.....The reason MOST people get the train is to get from one place to another quickly - not to indulge in a bit of sightseeing.

Yes, that is the primary reason. But a significant reason that passengers CHOOSE to travel by rail is the ability to "sightsee". IMHO, after travelling by Pendo once they are less likely to make this choice - despite all the other positives which have been mentioned.

...And to compare it with 'a van', as one poster above did, is ridiculous and I'm sure most reasonable people can see that....

Actually, I think it is quite apt, as I do feel the design is very claustrophobic, and this, for me, detracts severely from the journey quality. The nearest comparison, though, IMHO is with an airliner - same claustrophobic feel, same disregard for windows. Have we perhaps been conditioned too much to the oft touted view that air travel is the quality level to be aimed at? Is the Virgin experience led by this. Personally, I much prefer the IC225 on the East Coast, which also has the tilt profile.

 

[MCR247]

Personally, I much prefer the IC225 on the East Coast, which also has the tilt profile.

No they dont IIRC

 

[devon_metro]

Yes, they do.