Class 458/5

[3141]

I found a cached copy. It's an interesting article, although it exaggerates the differences between classes 458 and 460.

 

[swt_passenger]

I found a cached copy. It's an interesting article, although it exaggerates the differences between classes 458 and 460.

I'm still finding it OK via their homepage "latest news" section, which leads to: http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/shortformations.aspx

The above article includes a link to the earlier story about the 458/5 conversion http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/longertrains.aspx

 

[Goldfish62]

I'm still finding it OK via their homepage "latest news" section, which leads to: http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/shortformations.aspx

The above article includes a link to the earlier story about the 458/5 conversion http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/longertrains.aspx

Yes, it's back up now.

 

[hassaanhc]

Probably best if we just did this :P

Short Formations - A project update

At the start of our franchise in 1996, we carried around 108 million passengers every year. Today, we carry more than 222million on what is fundamentally the same railway and one of the very busiest networks in Europe.
We appreciate that as a result of this, many of our services - particularly during our busy morning and evening periods - are often extremely busy and overcrowded. At the moment, the network is completely full and we cannot add additional services as there simply isn’t space on the tracks to run them.
For this reason, we work hard to ensure that our trains run with the maximum number of carriages every day. The vast majority of our services do operate using the maximum number of carriages; however there are times when unfortunately this is not possible and we have to run services with fewer carriages than we would like. On these occasions we fully understand the frustration of our customers for the overcrowding they may experience while travelling with us.
Our customer information team works hard to ensure that customers are kept informed, through our website and through the Alliance Twitter feed, about times when their service may be made up of fewer carriages than normal.

Why do short formed trains happen?
The South West Trains-Network Rail Alliance fleet of trains is one of the most reliable in the country. Like all train operators, there are times when maintenance requirements, or unplanned issues, can result in our services having to operate with fewer coaches than usual.
Our trains are rigorously inspected for the safety of our passengers and staff. If an issue is found which requires urgent attention, we often have no choice but to remove the affected coaches from service to enable any required work to be completed before they can return to operation. However, due to the make-up of trains, it is simply not possible to remove only one coach from a train. For example, it means that while work is on-going, a 12-car train may have to run as an 8-car train.
Running a short formed train is never a decision we take lightly but our research and experience tells us that passengers would prefer the service to run with fewer coaches than to be cancelled entirely.
Our trains are intensively used throughout the year and are subject to an extensive maintenance and repair programme. As well as short-term maintenance work, there can be times that we need to keep a train out of service for slightly longer in order to ensure it will be more reliable when it does go back into service. This helps to prevent train problems while in service which can cause delays and inconvenience for customers.

So, what are we doing about it?
In short, we are spending £275million to pay for 258 more carriages between now and 2018. This will provide a 30% increase in peak time capacity and means we will be offering more trains and more capacity than ever before.
The good news is that the first part of this massive programme is already well underway and passengers will see significant improvements this year.

Phase 1
We are investing £65million to refurbish 108 train carriages, allowing longer trains to run on our suburban routes. This first of these new longer services will start to run this Spring when the first of our newly refurbished Class 456 trains enter service. More trains will be introduced throughout 2015 and we hope to have all 108 newly refurbished carriages to be running by the end of this year.
These new carriages will mean we can run longer trains and reduce the number of times our services run with fewer carriages than we would like.
The new carriages are now arriving at our depots and we look forward to introducing them for passenger use very soon.

Phase 2
In September 2014, we announced a £210million order for 50 brand new trains. The Class 707 Desiro City trains are made up of 5 carriages each and will start to be introduced during 2017, with the last train due to enter service during 2018. These brand new trains will run as 10 car trains during our busy periods, helping to boost capacity on our Suburban network.
Back to top

When Phase 1 and Phase 2 are both completed by mid 2018, we will have boosted capacity by 30% on our busiest services as well as carrying out major infrastructure improvements across the network to support these new trains.
We are working hard, across all parts of the South West Trains-Network Rail Alliance to continuing improving the service we offer our customers and we will continue to do so in the coming months and years.
For further information on the refurbishment of our Class 456 and Class 458/5 trains, please visit: http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/longertrains.aspx

 

[Juniper Driver]

50 brand new Desiro Cities? I thought it was 30.

 

[D365]

50 brand new Desiro Cities? I thought it was 30.

There's an option open for 100 additional carriages.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Does the construction of SWT's cities have to wait for the finish of production of TL's cities or is there a separate production line?

 

[Juniper Driver]

There's an option open for 100 additional carriages.

Ah thanks.

 

[Goldfish62]

Does the construction of SWT's cities have to wait for the finish of production of TL's cities or is there a separate production line?

It was mentioned in Modern Railways recently that construction would take place concurrently.

The first ones are due in service in 2017, with all in service by 2018, so so it sounds like the build will be alongside the second half of the TL batch.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I'm still finding it OK via their homepage "latest news" section, which leads to: http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/shortformations.aspx

The above article includes a link to the earlier story about the 458/5 conversion http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/longertrains.aspx

It's a pared down version of what they posted and took down quickly the other morning. That article was much upfront and acknowledged that SWT currently has no maintenance spares of 458/5s and 458/0s and also mentioned the problems with both them and the 456s.

Obviously someone considered that this was all too honest!

 

[hassaanhc]

I've just managed to find the cached version of the original! . There is a significant amount of extra detail there, and being cynical I'd say someone has got into trouble for it :P.

Short Formations - A project update

Background
At the start of our franchise in 1996, we carried around 108 million passengers every year. Today, we carry more than 222 million on what is fundamentally the same railway and one of the very busiest networks in Europe. We appreciate that as a result of this, many of our services - particularly during our busy morning and evening periods - are often extremely busy and overcrowded. At the moment, the network is completely full and we cannot add additional services as there simply isn’t space on the tracks to run them.

For this reason, we work hard to ensure that our trains run with the maximum number of carriages every day. Our trains are rigorously inspected for the safety of our passengers and staff. If an issue is found which requires urgent attention, we often have no choice but to remove the affected coaches from service to enable any required work to be completed before they can return to operation. However, due to the make-up of trains, it is simply not possible to remove only one coach from a train. For example, it means that while work is on-going, a 12-car train may have to run as an 8-car train.

On these occasions we fully understand your frustration at having to board a short-formed train which may be overcrowded.

Increasing capacity on our trains
To improve our service to you, we have been working on two major projects which are designed to increase the capacity of our Mainline, Suburban and Windsor services. In short, we are spending £275million to pay for 258 more carriages between now and 2018. This will provide a 30% increase in peak time capacity and means we will be offering more trains and more capacity than ever before. Known collectively under the banner of ‘HLOS’ (High-Level Output Specification), the first phases of these projects include:

Phase 1: Lengthening of ‘Class 458’ trains to 10-car services on Reading and Windsor lines by refurbishing 60 carriages of Class 460 trains to be able to join up to 458 units. These refurbished trains are known as ‘Class 458/5’, and are a ‘first of a kind’ project which has created a new train out of two completely different train types. At the same time an extensive interior refurbishment was required in order to bring the trains up to our standards for passenger operation.
Significant investment has also been made to lengthen platforms at a number of stations on these routes, and to upgrade the power supply for reliable 10-car operation.

Above: Phase 1 458/5 reconstruction

Above: Phase 1 Class 458/5 After Reconstruction

Phase 2: Procurement and refurbishment of twenty-four 2-car 456 stock (a total of 48 coaches) in a £15 million refurbishment plan. This aimed to increase capacity of suburban services during peak hours in two ways:
i) Extending existing 455 trains with the refurbished 456 units to form 10-car trains (1x 8-car 455 and 1x 2-car 256)
ii) 8-car operation of 1x4-car 455 and 2x2-car 456 trains coupled together.

Above: Class 456 Exterior Before Refurbishment

Above: Phase 2 Class 456 After Refurbishment

Above: Phase 2 Class 456 Interior Before Refurbishment

Above: Phase 2 Class 456 Interior After Refurbishment

In both phases, it was found that refurbishing existing rolling stock would deliver the quickest and best value for money capacity improvement.
The good news is that the first parts of this massive programme are already well underway and passengers will see significant improvements this year. There have, however, been some delays to the delivery of these projects which are explained below.

Project progress and causes of stock shortages
Phase 1
The initial project plan for the first phase of this capacity improvement programme was to deliver the fully refurbished 458/5 fleet by summer 2014. We regret to report that this has not been achieved, with unforeseen difficulties delaying the completion of this project. The project has experienced the following setbacks:

• Due to the unique and pioneering nature of merging two distinct classes of train, our engineers encountered a more complex design challenge than initially anticipated.
• In order to ensure cross-compatibility of stock types, extensive modification was required to suspension and coupling between carriages. This process encountered unexpectedly long lead-times for critical materials and components.
• During the refurbishment, our engineers discovered serious corrosion issues in the structure of the 460 stock. This required extensive reconditioning in order to meet our safety standards.

As a result, some of the 458/5 stock that we had planned to have available from summer 2014 has not been available. As such there are currently no maintenance spares and so any faults that develop on trains in service result in us having to take carriages out of service for repair. This means we are forced at short notice to run trains in a short formation.

Phase 2
Phase 2 initially had a project plan which specified all 24 Class 456 trains would be in service by December 2014.
This has unfortunately been delayed by the following factors:

• A key supplier went into administration during the project. We found a new supplier for the contract as soon as possible, however this changeover and settling in process inevitably took some time, resulting in delays to the project.
• As with our 458/5 conversions, we had to make suspension and coupling modifications to the 456 stock. This process encountered long supplier lead times for key components and materials.

Revised project completion dates
Phase 1: There are currently 10 class 458/5 units in service, with a further two being commissioned. We will have all 458/5 coaches in service by December 2015.
Phase 2: Will complete with all units in service by October 2015. Seven units are currently available for service, with another two on-test and a further three currently being refurbished. The next pair of units working as an 8-car is expected to enter service in March.

Other reasons for short train formations
Other factors also can result in short-formed trains at very short notice. If a train fault is reported that may affect its safe operation, we will attempt to split the defective coaches from the remainder of the train. This will result in, for example, a 12-car train running as an 8-car train. If splitting the defective coaches is not possible, we will consider splitting a non-defective unit into two short-formed trains.

We do understand that running trains in a short formation can lead to overcrowding, discomfort, and difficulties in boarding or alighting the trains at busy stations. For these reasons, the decision to run a train at a reduced length is not taken lightly, however performance analysis and customer feedback indicates it is strongly preferable to run a short-formed train rather than cancelling one train in order to run another at its full length.

Similarly, our trains are intensively used throughout the year and are subject to an extensive maintenance and repair programme. There may be times that we need to keep a train out of service for longer than planned in order to ensure that when it does go into service it is reliable; if a train breaks down whilst in service it can create significantly more delay and inconvenience to your journey than running a short formation or in the worst case, cancelling a train.

Plans for future capacity and reliability improvements
Government forecasts indicate that the sustained passenger growth on our railway is expected to continue. We have extensive plans in place to meet this need, whilst delivering improvements in performance and reliability. The plans include:

• Over £200m has been invested in developing and building thirty 5-car trains called the Class 707 ‘Desiro City’ to provide additional capacity for c. 24,000 people. These will operate as either 5-car or 10-car units, and will be introduced from July 2017, with all units in service by January 2018.
• Re-engineering of the Class 455 fleet with new traction motors and electrical equipment to improve performance, efficiency and reliability.
• Increased use of London Waterloo International Platforms 20-24, which requires remodelling of the entrances and exists in order to deliver safe passenger flow, along with resignalling and remodelling the track to allow greater operational flexibility and performance. These platforms were designed for a high-speed low frequency service and will require extensive work in order to make them suitable for a commuter railway.
• Lengthening of London Waterloo platforms 1-4 to accommodate 10-car trains. This requires a redesign of the signalling and crossings at the entrance to London Waterloo.

By January 2018, there will be approximately 250 extra vehicles in service as a result of the 707, 458/5 and 456 projects. To cater for these extra vehicles, extra sidings and maintenance facilities are being constructed in Woking, Basingstoke, Farnham and Fratton.

 

[Juniper Driver]

Extra sidings also at Guildford.

458 watch.I was on 8017+8029 today.

 

[Bigfoot]

Extra sidings also at Guildford.

And works at Strawberry Hill!

 

[hassaanhc]

Morning

8 coaches instead of 10 on the:
0615 Waterloo to Waterloo (with 450094 leading)
0723 Windsor to Waterloo
Therefore at least 4 units out again.

Reading is all 8, but with 455s on the 0620 out of Waterloo.

 

[swt_passenger]

By January 2018, there will be approximately 250 extra vehicles in service as a result of the 707, 458/5 and 456 projects. To cater for these extra vehicles, extra sidings and maintenance facilities are being constructed in Woking, Basingstoke, Farnham and Fratton.

With that information published (even if only temporarily available) I wonder how long it will be before people read it as all those classes running to Portsmouth? I'd assume any works at Fratton are more to do with re-balancing the stabling of the 450 fleet.

 

[infobleep]

The 8.36 Guildford to Waterloo this morning was most likely a 455 so they haven't felt the need to have a diagram with a 450 service passing along that line this week. So I'd say that's it for 450 services on the Cobham line.

However the 8.07 Guildhall to Waterloo service was cancelled today due to a train fault, as were some other services this morning. So despite deciding not to use a 450 on the Cobham line, they still don't have enough working stock to run a full service of trains across the network.

 

[Goldfish62]

The 8.36 Guildford to Waterloo this morning was most likely a 455 so they haven't felt the need to have a diagram with a 450 service passing along that line this week. So I'd say that's it for 450 services on the Cobham line.

However the 8.07 Guildhall to Waterloo service was cancelled today due to a train fault, as were some other services this morning. So despite deciding not to use a 450 on the Cobham line, they still don't have enough working stock to run a full service of trains across the network.

There have been up to 4 450s covering for 458/5s today, plus two 455s covering for 458/0s all day.

 

[TEW]

The suburban cancellations seem to be because neither of the 8-455 formations booked out of Guildford Down Sidings came out to play this morning. I can confirm they were both in there last night. RTT has the reason down as a problem at a depot.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

NR took the possession at the weekend, but never requested that the units were cut out, so they were left in there cut in & needless to say with all of the auxiliaries still running the batteries went flat! :roll:

 

[Juniper Driver]

504 and 505 saw them from the Up Epsom Road they'd run up from Surbiton way.Caught up with them as they were going into the depot at Wimbledon @ 1640.Also noticed a DMOS on a low loader @ Wimbledon at the same time.

 

[Domh245]

I'm guessing that the DMOS was the one which caught fire finally going off for repair work.

 

[Juniper Driver]

I'm guessing that the DMOS was the one which caught fire finally going off for repair work.

Ooops it's DMSO apparently.

DMSO-TSOL-TSOL-MSO-DMSO

Never thought about the damaged coach.Good point.

 

[TEW]

NR took the possession at the weekend, but never requested that the units were cut out, so they were left in there cut in & needless to say with all of the auxiliaries still running the batteries went flat! :roll:

You couldn't make it up, could you! :roll:

 

[HarleyDavidson]

I'm saying nothing. Other than it's not the first time & won't be the last!

I know that the AM Peak on the suburban's achieved target.

 

[Matt Taylor]

Just to state the obvious, the driving car on the low loader was leaving the depot and was numbered 458501, looked like 67911 was the coach number but I may be mistaken.

 

[TEW]

The first 2 458/5 units entered service a year ago today. In a year we have gone from 2 to 11 units entering service (including now back out of service 458501). Having the remaining 25 units in service by the end of the year seems optimistic to me.

 

[Emblematic]

The first 2 458/5 units entered service a year ago today. In a year we have gone from 2 to 11 units entering service (including now back out of service 458501). Having the remaining 25 units in service by the end of the year seems optimistic to me.

Alternatively, the glass-half-full view is that in 12 months we have gone:

• from 10 to 35 rebuilt Class 460 carriages in service, 25 more to come
• from 0 to 4 carriages with luggage doors converted to passenger doors, all done
• from 4 to 12 non-corridor cabs rebuilt as corridor cabs, all done

The remaining conversions are trailer, or motor carriage to trailer. There is refurbishment, corrosion rectification, corridor connection updates and new software etc. to apply, but I would say the bulk of the work has been completed. The previously unforeseen issues are now well known and remediation factored in, finishing the remainder by year end should be achievable.

 

[Juniper Driver]

1540 passing time @ Wimbledon saw 503 and 530 passing through the washer (washing) and 502+520 in the yard.

Nice info Emblematic.

 

[RobShipway]

Alternatively, the glass-half-full view is that in 12 months we have gone:

• from 10 to 35 rebuilt Class 460 carriages in service, 25 more to come
• from 0 to 4 carriages with luggage doors converted to passenger doors, all done
• from 4 to 12 non-corridor cabs rebuilt as corridor cabs, all done

The remaining conversions are trailer, or motor carriage to trailer. There is refurbishment, corrosion rectification, corridor connection updates and new software etc. to apply, but I would say the bulk of the work has been completed. The previously unforeseen issues are now well known and remediation factored in, finishing the remainder by year end should be achievable.

I think they are working on the basis, the more they know where the issues are with the class 460/458's, then the faster they will be able to get the job done.

 

[infobleep]

NR took the possession at the weekend, but never requested that the units were cut out, so they were left in there cut in & needless to say with all of the auxiliaries still running the batteries went flat! :roll:

Oops. That's one fault I wouldn't have guessed. That explains why the 8.07 didn't need to be cancelled today.

How long does it take to charge a 455?

 

[hassaanhc]

The first 2 458/5 units entered service a year ago today. In a year we have gone from 2 to 11 units entering service (including now back out of service 458501). Having the remaining 25 units in service by the end of the year seems optimistic to me.

The launch however was the previous week on Friday 7 March 2014 That also had a special non-stop 1305 Waterloo to Windsor & Eton Riverside from Platform 20 which was advertised on the screens, therefore available for the public to use.


South West Trains Class 458 534 by hassaanhc, on Flickr