• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Creation of class 230 DEMUs from ex-LU D78s by Vivarail

Status
Not open for further replies.
G

Greybeard33

Established Member
Joined
18 Feb 2012
Messages
4,273
Location
Greater Manchester
superkev said:
Not read the whole thread but I can't help thinking good idea but wrong train and wrong engine.
Better to me to create a true bi mode by fitting an engine/ gens under the driving trailers of the soon to be spare I believe 313 or sim types.
Lots of space for engine, al body too,75mph, and air rather than rubber springs.
k
Click to expand...
What are the planned release dates for the 313s, 314s and 315s?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

E

edwin_m

Veteran Member
Joined
21 Apr 2013
Messages
24,939
Location
Nottingham
Greybeard33 said:
What are the planned release dates for the 313s, 314s and 315s?
Click to expand...

I think you've hit the nail on the head there. If extra units are to cover the gap created by delay to electrification then they are needed now, and indeed there is a risk that the D78 prototype won't have enough time to demonstrate reliable operation before the Northern bidders make their decisions on whether to use it. The first 315s to be released (by Crossrail stock) must be a couple of years off, with 313s sometime later as the Moorgate stock hasn't even been ordered yet. I don't recall if the first or second tranche of AT200 is supposed to displace the 314s.
 
Mikey C

Mikey C

Established Member
Joined
11 Feb 2013
Messages
6,859
edwin_m said:
I think you've hit the nail on the head there. If extra units are to cover the gap created by delay to electrification then they are needed now, and indeed there is a risk that the D78 prototype won't have enough time to demonstrate reliable operation before the Northern bidders make their decisions on whether to use it. The first 315s to be released (by Crossrail stock) must be a couple of years off, with 313s sometime later as the Moorgate stock hasn't even been ordered yet. I don't recall if the first or second tranche of AT200 is supposed to displace the 314s.
Click to expand...

Isn't the other factor that all the PEP type trains can operate under overhead power lines, and hence can be transferred to newly electrified lines, whereas the D78 are 3rd/4th rail only DC units, so are useless for the majority of the country unless dieselised
 
E

edwin_m

Veteran Member
Joined
21 Apr 2013
Messages
24,939
Location
Nottingham
Mikey C said:
Isn't the other factor that all the PEP type trains can operate under overhead power lines, and hence can be transferred to newly electrified lines, whereas the D78 are 3rd/4th rail only DC units, so are useless for the majority of the country unless dieselised
Click to expand...

Perhaps so, but I think we'll have a surplus of older but serviceable 25kV units especially if the Welsh go for new build or tram-train. There's also the possibility of keeping the 25kV equipment and running them as bi-modes.
 
asylumxl

asylumxl

Established Member
Joined
12 Feb 2009
Messages
4,260
Location
Hiding in your shadow
Paul Sidorczuk said:
To lighten the mood on this thread, can someone with the "paintbox" skills produce an image of a D78 in Northern Rail livery.
Click to expand...

TsH7cdd.jpg


A rough approximation. It's past midnight so excuse the lazy masking.
 
S

SpacePhoenix

Established Member
Joined
18 Mar 2014
Messages
5,492
For the purposes of the crash regs and the emissions regs will these be classed as new trains?
 
D365

D365

Veteran Member
Joined
29 Jun 2012
Messages
11,479
Paul Sidorczuk said:
To lighten the mood on this thread, can someone with the "paintbox" skills produce an image of a D78 in Northern Rail livery.
Click to expand...

What, you don't appreciate the PEP talk? ;)


A good quick photoshop nonetheless!
 
G

Greybeard33

Established Member
Joined
18 Feb 2012
Messages
4,273
Location
Greater Manchester
SpacePhoenix said:
For the purposes of the crash regs and the emissions regs will these be classed as new trains?
Click to expand...
A new engine in an old train has to meet the latest emissions requirements. Vivarail has stated that the automotive diesel engines it has selected will be compliant.

For crashworthiness, it seems that the D78 stock has "grandfather rights", so that only the D-train modifications have to comply with the latest requirements. See the Modern Railways article on the Vivarail website: http://www.vivarail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Modern-Railways-Dec-2014.pdf
 
P

paulclass43

Member
Joined
10 Jul 2012
Messages
50
I will personally take a cutters torch to them if they are introduced in Hull.

A little extreme perhaps. But I will.
 
Xenophon PCDGS

Xenophon PCDGS

Veteran Member
Joined
17 Apr 2011
Messages
32,438
Location
A semi-rural part of north-west England
How about Vivarail eventually taking all Angel Trains Class 142 Pacers and doing a similar internal and bodyshell refurbishment, fitting all the required underbody and traction items.....and then offering them to those charged with the running of the London Underground where the D78's once ran.
 
C

Camden

Established Member
Joined
30 Dec 2014
Messages
1,949
Paul Sidorczuk said:
How about Vivarail eventually taking all Angel Trains Class 142 Pacers and doing a similar internal and bodyshell refurbishment, fitting all the required underbody and traction items.....and then offering them to those charged with the running of the London Underground where the D78's once ran.
Click to expand...

They don't have the required emergency exits at either end sorry! :p
 
B

Bantamzen

Established Member
Joined
4 Dec 2013
Messages
9,751
Location
Baildon, West Yorkshire
Paul Sidorczuk said:
How about Vivarail eventually taking all Angel Trains Class 142 Pacers and doing a similar internal and bodyshell refurbishment, fitting all the required underbody and traction items.....and then offering them to those charged with the running of the London Underground where the D78's once ran.
Click to expand...

And don't forget the 141s rusting away in Iran. Vivarail could get those for a steal...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top