Credit cards on virgin trains

[Failed Unit]

Sat on virgin train at the moment. They announced that the shop no longer takes credit cards. How long has this been happening and any idea why? Seems a bit odd just to save commission. I would have thought following east coast and other retaillers with minimum purchases would have been better. So no cash no refreshments.

I wonder if it is this train only. The announcement implied it was company wide. On a voyager which is still a very poor relation to the pendo for services offered.

 

[merlodlliw]

did they refer to credit cards only? what about debit cards, did you ask. Credit card companies usually charge 2/3% to the retailer, but with giants its usually lower &
a good few hike the price to cover anyhow, even if you pay by cash

 

[Failed Unit]

They stated only cash or cheque. No plastic of any kind.

 

[ukrob]

What exactly was the announcement? Did they say that they are unable/no longer accepting credit cards, or was the message that "Virgin Trains no longer accept cards" ie was the machine broke on your train or is it a new policy?

 

[Geezertronic]

I have heard that announcement usually followed by an announcement that due to a lack of change, £20 notes cannot be accepted

 

[Failed Unit]

What exactly was the announcement? Did they say that they are unable/no longer accepting credit cards, or was the message that "Virgin Trains no longer accept cards" ie was the machine broke on your train or is it a new policy?

can't remember the wording but it implied that it was virgin trains policy rather that a fault on this train. We have a new crew now and I will be on another vt this evening so will know for sure if it is this set or company policy this evening. Judging by the post below it sounds like policy.

 

[Ferret]

It is policy! They have no chip and pin machines in their shops so won't be accepting credit/debit cards.

 

[Failed Unit]

Strange they accept cheques. I would have expected fraud to be higher on them. Very strange for virgin which models itself on been a company that is out with the old and in with the new. Cheques are as yesterday as mk2 coaches.

Thanks ferret. Now I know either buy at the station or hit the cash machine when travelling virgin.

 

[jon0844]

I am not sure it's just down to fraud (you're probably right about cheques) but rather new rules on card acceptance from the banks.

I heard a story where a supermarket lost power and couldn't take cards electronically, so they went back to the old manual method. After a very short time, the bank refused to authorise them by phone and they had to stop taking cards completely.

 

[Failed Unit]

I guess there isn't time to invest and get pay back either.

 

[Ticket Man]

The IRIS system they use on the shops is coupled with a chip and pin machine fixed to the counter. The announcement was probably just because it had failed rather than Virgin not accepting cards. As for this "no plastic" policy that was mentioned earlier, that's a load of offle

 

[western Champion]

Her indoors works onboard for VT and says there are three reasons for no longer accepting cards.

1) VT don't want to invest in chip and pin at this stage in the franchise.

2) Because of no chip and pin there is a high amount of fraud.

3) Numpties insist on paying for a bottle of water for example with a credit card so it costs more, due to credit card company fees, to accept the payment than there is profit in the item being bought.

 

[Greenback]

I'm surprised VT continue to accept cheques. Many larger chains don;t, and it's increasingly difficult to get any sort of bank account with cheque book facilities. The banks want to do away with them by the end of the decade!

 

[Ticket Man]

I think they had chip and pins on-board originally but the terminals are no longer supported any more so when ever one broke it was simply removed, they did the same with their magic terminals used for the avb avantix. now we've just started using thyron blue tooth chip and pins but I don't think they are compatible with iris. just have to wait and see if they hold the franchise or not.

 

[Barn]

3) Numpties insist on paying for a bottle of water for example with a credit card so it costs more, due to credit card company fees, to accept the payment than there is profit in the item being bought.

Two points. First, cash machines don't dispense the right change for bottled water and we've already heard about the problems with £20 notes.

Secondly, cash is by no means exempt from fees. It must be counted, kept safe, transported and paid in to an account. None of this is free.

 

[western Champion]

Two points. First, cash machines don't dispense the right change for bottled water and we've already heard about the problems with £20 notes.

Secondly, cash is by no means exempt from fees. It must be counted, kept safe, transported and paid in to an account. None of this is free.

So withdraw a note, pay for your water and keep the change in your pocket. Simple !

 

[dk1]

This sometimes happens on Virgin trains. Catering staff also have resort to pen & paper when calculating at the same time as advising customers of cash only. The times it has happened to me theu are usually confident the gremlins will go away & the system will function normally within 20 minutes or so & it does.

 

[Pumbaa]

Yes - new VT policy. Came in today (26th) and has been advertised as such since February.

 

[Capybara]

This sometimes happens on Virgin trains. Catering staff also have resort to pen & paper when calculating at the same time as advising customers of cash only. The times it has happened to me theu are usually confident the gremlins will go away & the system will function normally within 20 minutes or so & it does.

Where do they find staff who can calculate using a pen and paper?

 

[Barn]

So withdraw a note, pay for your water and keep the change in your pocket. Simple !

Except a poster just above you said that notes were not always accepted due to a lack of change.

 

[Failed Unit]

As for this "no plastic" policy that was mentioned earlier, that's a load of offle

You need to tell that to the person in the shop on the train I am on now. Not going to name exact on but it is somewhere on London Glasgow service. He says it is cash only.

As said earlier virgin have less than 2 years left so are not going to invest as it will never pay back. Stopping people using credit cards for bottles of water is simple it is called a minimum charge to use plastic.

A very backwards move for an intercity franchise. I wonder if takings will drop as a result. As a majority of customers are on board for less than 2 hours they will be taking food on board now.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

As a majority of customers are on board for less than 2 hours they will be taking food on board now.

I do that anyway because:

1) Most of the stuff they sell on board I can buy off the train at a much lower cost.

2) The choice on the train is very restricted compared to the shops at the stations.

 

[Failed Unit]

The difference in between east and west coast certainly seems to widening. East coast is the premier league. Virgin is the championship if it is a pendo. A voyager service I would rate as div 1. With xc battling relagation from the league? Best not forget about great western which is somewhere between virgin and east coast.

 

[Tom B]

With regards to the lack of chip and pin, I believe that sales authorised without chip and pin are at the risk of the retailer - so if they get a signature and it turns out to be a fraudulent transaction, the bank will not want to know about it.

Minimum charges are a sensible way of doing things IMO - East Coast don't accept cards OR cheques for anything less than a fiver.

As to on train catering myself I only use it when unavoidable. I don't mind paying the premium for buying on board, but the thing which stops me from using them routinely is that they are extremely poor at having sufficient stock - usually blamed on someone else forgetting to load a trolley, or some such nonsense.

 

[Greenback]

With regards to the lack of chip and pin, I believe that sales authorised without chip and pin are at the risk of the retailer - so if they get a signature and it turns out to be a fraudulent transaction, the bank will not want to know about it.

Minimum charges are a sensible way of doing things IMO - East Coast don't accept cards OR cheques for anything less than a fiver.

As to on train catering myself I only use it when unavoidable. I don't mind paying the premium for buying on board, but the thing which stops me from using them routinely is that they are extremely poor at having sufficient stock - usually blamed on someone else forgetting to load a trolley, or some such nonsense.

You are spot on about chip and pin Tom.

I don;t know if revenue will be affected. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I would never use a card to pay for a cup of tea! (or some other small purchase). I'm sure most people would have cash on them, certainly most older folk like myself tend to carry a few quid in readies for 'emergencies'!

 

[Failed Unit]

Even as a younger person I wouldn't dream of using a credit card for under £10. Debit card maybe but not for a cup of tea. Normally a small meal on board is taking you into debit card area.

Tvms however I would never put a note in. So the credit card gets it then even for a £2 fare. That is more for my protection nothing worse than putting a note in a machine and getting it swallowed.

 

[route:oxford]

If you, for example, buy a ticket for the subsequent stage of your journey on board (always sold with a smile)...

Can the revenue protection staff on train give cashback with a debit card?

 

[Greenback]

Yes, I never put notes in TVMs - whenever I did try in the 'old days' they never worked anyway and just got spat back out, so I stopped bothering!

I think that anyone who is around 18 now will be so much more aware of cards than older people. Though I'm only 43, you could never use a card in a pub when I was younger - I think it may have been illegal! Nowadays you can use them almost anywhere, minimum payments not withstanding...

 

[142094]

It is usually expected these days that a place should have a card reader - almost everywhere seems to. Barclaycard introduced the contactless technology on some of their cards, wonder why it couldn't be used on a train (unless the fees are too much for the TOC)?

Think XC are the same these days as well, been on a few recently where the announcement has said no cards accepted.

 

[Ferret]

I believe the Advent of 'COLIN' on board XC trains will lead to credit and debit cards being accepted again.