CrossCountry Customer Relations

[Bletchleyite]

Would you like to guess what CrossCountry's annual moving average to July 2015 was for right time arrivals? Yeah, did you gues 41.8%? And West Coast? 52.4%. If you consider a 60% chance that you won't be on time somehow squares as good service then that beats me.

52.4% annual average? I find that hard to believe; do you have a reference?

http://www.virgintrains.co.uk/assets/pdf/performance/vt-performance.pdf

suggests a much better performance. Or are you counting 30 seconds late as late?

 

[Minilad]

52.4% annual average? I find that hard to believe; do you have a reference?

http://www.virgintrains.co.uk/assets/pdf/performance/vt-performance.pdf

suggests a much better performance. Or are you counting 30 seconds late as late?

He has helpfully quoted the worst and most unreliable method of recording on time arrivals. Just to make a point. And yes by that method a train could run from Bournemouth all the way to Manchester on time but is held at the last signal before arrival into Manchester for 2 mins and would be considered late

 

[Starmill]

He has helpfully quoted the worst and most unreliable method of recording on time arrivals.

Which also happens to be one of the most relevant to customers, rather than PPM, which nobody really knows the meaning of and most people don't care about.

What people want are trains that are not late. Everyone understands that short delays are inevitable in a certain proportion of cases, but is that proportion 60%? I doubt it!

Niel the figures quoted count late as 60 or more seconds late. I think most people agree that 10 minutes late is late, PPM pass or not.

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/about/performance/

 

[DaleCooper]

Niel the figures quoted count late as 60 or more seconds late. I think most people agree that 10 minutes late is late, PPM pass or not.[/url]

I wouldn't be bothered by a couple of minutes late, in fact I probably wouldn't even notice.

Why did you suddenly jump from 60 seconds to 10 minutes?

 

[Fare-Cop]

I recall a certain booking clerk in the early 1980s at Peterborough being berated by a person waiting to pick up a traveller from Glasgow, who was travelling on that notoriously difficult service to Harwich Parkeston Quay then known as 'The European'.

The waiting gent was incredibly rude and aggressively demanding to know 'Why is this bloody train 10 minutes late?' for the umpteenth time. The travel centre clerk and all those waiting for tickets & information were getting more annoyed as everyone had given this chap all the information that was available and he kept barging past the queue to enquire again. The train had left Nottingham 13 minutes late and was expected 10 late at Peterborough.

Eventually said gent shouted 'I want to know the exact reason it is late right now!'.

The harassed clerk replied 'I'm sorry sir, I don't know what exactly caused the delay, but I am told it has gained a little time and should be here in a few minutes'. This wasn't good enough for the complainant, who continued his rant about 'lousy service, lousy staff etc.'

He was interrupted by a chap in the queue not far from me who stepped forward and asked of the gent 'Do us a favour mate, if you left Glasgow at 11 o'clock this morning in your car, can you tell me within 10 minutes exactly what time you'd get here?' The complainant said 'Well obviously not exactly no, traffic is different, why?' to which the man from the queue replied 'No, but you expect this fellow to be able to and that train driver's got to stop a dozen times to pick up 600 or 700 people including a few ar*@!!%s like you !'

Said gent never did complain further.

 

[Starmill]

I wasn't a couple of minutes late. I wasn't 10 minutes late. I was over 2 hours late. I don't complain about 2 minute or 10 minute delays - and it is just as well, as the figures show they can occur up to 60% of the time!

The point is there is a line to be crossed; I travel regularly on long-distance services and so far this year have been more than an hour late at final destination more times than I can remember. This is the sixth (I think) occasion I've been more than two hours late, and the third time I've had to mess around for ages trying to get someone to order me a taxi because I couldn't complete my journey by rail.

I hope this demonstrates why right time performance is important; if you're relying on a 1 train per hour connection somewhere and you have a 10 minute connection, being 10 minutes late is going to make you an hour late, isn't it? That is why right-time performance is important, and it is also a big reason why I am so very often delayed. Of course, on this particular occasion the delay to the individual service was about 45 minutes so that wasn't a factor at play. Another thing that often happens is huge 'artificial delays' that are caused by TOC ONLY tickets, where your train is cancelled but alternative trains are available that will get you to your destination with minimal delay, but because they are operated by some other company (a factor which is totally arbitrary and effectively down to random chance) you are not permitted to use them.

As it happens the case has been resolved by Virgin Trains, but they note it is entirely as a 'gesture of goodwill' on their part. As far as I can tell the evidence in light of the NRCoC is fairly clear that XC were liable for this claim, as they caused the delay that delayed my journey.

 

[DaleCooper]

I don't complain about 2 minute or 10 minute delays - and it is just as well, as the figures show they can occur up to 60% of the time!

Wait a minute! You say you don't complain about 2 or 10 minute delays but you use statistics based on those delays as evidence of poor performance. If that's not having your cake and eating it I don't know what is. Clearly you will never be satisfied so I suggest you find an alternative form of transport.

It would be interesting to see how many journeys by air or coach arrive within 10 minutes of schedule.

 

[Starmill]

Did you read the rest of the post? My point was clear; if my journey is delayed by 2 minutes or 10 minutes, I'm not going to be fussed, just like everyone pretty much. But if a train is 10 minutes late which means my journey is half an hour, or an hour late, then that is significant, isn't it? I add to this the fact that CrossCountry and West Coast in particular have a serious problem with arrivals that are not late.

 

[DaleCooper]

Did you read the rest of the post? My point was clear; if my journey is delayed by 2 minutes or 10 minutes, I'm not going to be fussed, just like everyone pretty much. But if a train is 10 minutes late which means my journey is half an hour, or an hour late, then that is significant, isn't it? I add to this the fact that CrossCountry and West Coast in particular have a serious problem with arrivals that are not late.

You obviously didn't read (or more likely didn't understand) mine.

Now you're also complaining that "CrossCountry and West Coast in particular have a serious problem with arrivals that are not late."

I add to this the fact that CrossCountry and West Coast in particular have a serious problem with arrivals that are not late.

What planet are you on?

 

[Starmill]

Are you just being daft on purpose now? It's not that difficult to understand. If you have a situation where more than half of your trains are late, you are having a problem getting any trains to arrive 'not late' i.e. trains that are on time or early.

 

[father_jack]

From NRCOC-

43. Help from Train Companies if you are stranded.

If disruption caused by circumstances within the control of a Train Company or a Rail Service Company leaves you stranded before you have reached your destination printed on or stored on your ticket, and the Train Company whose trains you are entitled to use is unable to get you to that destination by other means, ANY Train Company which is in a position to help will, if it reasonably can, either arrange to get you to that destination, or provide overnight accommodation for you.

 

[34D]

I understand that a good trick to getting compensation is to purchase a single ticket from big station to a local station that only has an hourly service (one that leaves just the minimum connection time) then wait for the compensation to roll in.

One doesn't have to actually travel to said station, just have a ticket to it.

This is NOT recommended

 

[najaB]

Another thing that often happens is huge 'artificial delays' that are caused by TOC ONLY tickets, where your train is cancelled but alternative trains are available that will get you to your destination with minimal delay, but because they are operated by some other company (a factor which is totally arbitrary and effectively down to random chance) you are not permitted to use them.

If you want flexibility then buy a flexible ticket. I agree that you didn't chose to arrive late - it was out of your control - but you chose to buy a ticket that was cheaper, under the condition that it was only valid on a single company's service. Also, I think you'll find that the operator(s) on a given route is not down to 'random chance' but is actually quite predictable (look at a timetable).

 

[DaleCooper]

I have difficulty decipherig your barely intelligible comments, for example you are saying that the following phrases are synonymous:

have a serious problem with arrivals that are not late.

having a problem getting any trains to arrive 'not late' i.e. trains that are on time or early.

The first says that trains that arrive on time or early cause problems (i.e the problem arises after arrival), the second says that it is difficult to get the trains to arrive on time or early (i.e. the problem arises before arrival).

Don't accuse me of being daft when you can't write clear English.

 

[Minilad]

Three words. Playing. The. System

 

[Starmill]

I understand that a good trick to getting compensation is to purchase a single ticket from big station to a local station that only has an hourly service (one that leaves just the minimum connection time) then wait for the compensation to roll in.

One doesn't have to actually travel to said station, just have a ticket to it.

This is NOT recommended

You do have to wait and travel to the destination you claim for. My understanding is that to not do so, but still fill in the Delay Repay from, would constiute fraud.

Occasionally I will be in a situation where I really really don't want to wait for 58 minutes, and will get a bus, lift, or taxi at my own expense and then write to the TOC explaining that I had to abandon this leg of my journey and cover it at my own cost because 58 minutes was too long to wait. If you do this some TOCs will offer at least some compensation as a 'gesture of goodwill', which I think is quite a fair approach on both sides.

 

[ainsworth74]

This thread has gone off-topic and is locked.