Trams rolling stock replacement programme
Our rolling stock replacement programme will replace the life-expired Bombardier CR4000 trams, which are becoming less reliable and have one of the lowest states of good repair categorisations across our fleets. Following detailed consideration of the options, it was decided that the best value-for-money option to address these problems was to replace the CR4000 trams.
The programme is likely to start procurement activities in late 2023. However, the full funding for replacement trams, alongside other rolling stock, has not yet been established.
To be fair to the CR4000, they did start testing from the end of 1998. Replacements could be ordered around the start of next year if TfL can arrange the budget for them so, delivery wouldn't be until 2025-26. The original fleet would therefore do approximately 28 years. If replacements aren't ordered until the end of 2024 or into 2025 because budget cannot be found, they may do 30 years.23 years to be considered life expired?! Doesn’t bode well for our M5000s!
To be fair to the CR4000, they did start testing from the end of 1998. Replacements could be ordered around the start of next year if TfL can arrange the budget for them so, delivery wouldn't be until 2025-26. The original fleet would therefore do approximately 28 years. If replacements aren't ordered until the end of 2024 or into 2025 because budget cannot be found, they may do 30 years.
Of course, you're right that even that isn't terribly impressive, but I agree that given the current state of the M5000 fleet, by the time they reach 26-28 years of age, they may very well be uneconomic to maintain and should also go.
Wondering how the K4000s built a slightly earlier are getting on in Cologne? They, AIUI, only differ from the CR4000s in details. And IIRC there was another batch of essentially the same trams built for somewhere else (Sweden? Netherlands?) at about the same time. Are these up up for replacement?
I assume that TfL will opt for something off the shelf with the tram replacement like they did with the Variobahns which were ordered in 2011 and were in service within eight months which is incredibly fast.To be fair to the CR4000, they did start testing from the end of 1998. Replacements could be ordered around the start of next year if TfL can arrange the budget for them so, delivery wouldn't be until 2025-26. The original fleet would therefore do approximately 28 years. If replacements aren't ordered until the end of 2024 or into 2025 because budget cannot be found, they may do 30 years.
Of course, you're right that even that isn't terribly impressive, but I agree that given the current state of the M5000 fleet, by the time they reach 26-28 years of age, they may very well be uneconomic to maintain and should also go.
I guess it might be cheaper to buy an existing design, but if the length is slightly longer, would difference in price be less than cost of platform extensions.In regards to the M5000s, I would assume that any replacement would need to be bespoke rather than off the shelf.
Metrolink was designed around the Stadtbahn-B, and there are quite a few high floor networks in Germany that use the same specification. The M5000 is closely based on the vehicle used for the high floor routes in Koeln (where the Croydon vehicle was based on the similar design for Koeln low-floor routes).In regards to the M5000s, I would assume that any replacement would need to be bespoke rather than off the shelf.
Some platform extensions will be much more tricky. The most obvious example is East Croydon where little or any extension is possible (particularly for the middle platform) without affecting the curves and junctions each end.I guess it might be cheaper to buy an existing design, but if the length is slightly longer, would difference in price be less than cost of platform extensions.
In very rough terms for each new tram, there are are 2 platforms. So if saved say £20k per tram by going standard, rather than bespoke, have £10k for each platform. (values are examples, not actuals)
I guess it might be cheaper to buy an existing design, but if the length is slightly longer, would difference in price be less than cost of platform extensions.
In very rough terms for each new tram, there are are 2 platforms. So if saved say £20k per tram by going standard, rather than bespoke, have £10k for each platform. (values are examples, not actuals)
The first 3 were increadibly quick because they were originally for Bergen, Norway. Stadler built them early to use spare factory space and as such sent them to London with enough time in the Bergen contract to build replacement ones.I assume that TfL will opt for something off the shelf with the tram replacement like they did with the Variobahns which were ordered in 2011 and were in service within eight months which is incredibly fast.
I doubt they'd go the Variobahns, I think the TINA is more likely if TfL choose Stadler.Stadler still makes the Variobahn, I'd expect TfL to buy more of them.
The first 3 were increadibly quick because they were originally for Bergen, Norway. Stadler built them early to use spare factory space and as such sent them to London with enough time in the Bergen contract to build replacement ones.
I doubt they'd go the Variobahns, I think the TINA is more likely if TfL choose Stadler.
why???By all accounts the staff dislike the Variobahn intensely…
why???
Trams don't generally last as long as trains, t68s were about 20, t69s just 15. the super tram ones in sheffield are the exception, but that's probably because they're German!23 years to be considered life expired?! Doesn’t bode well for our M5000s!
The T69s and T68s were built by AnsaldoBreda... not famed for their quality.Trams don't generally last as long as trains, t68s were about 20, t69s just 15. the super tram ones in sheffield are the exception, but that's probably because they're German!
Trams don't generally last as long as trains, t68s were about 20, t69s just 15. the super tram ones in sheffield are the exception, but that's probably because they're German!
35 years?!That’s news to me considering we’re expecting a 35 year life for our M5000s.
The only reason the T68s went when they did is TfGM didn’t want to pay to maintain the two separate fleets, and therefore refused to put them through midlife overhauls.
Full replacement ordered in 2020: https://www.urban-transport-magazin...nfirms-large-order-of-new-low-floor-tramways/Wondering how the K4000s built a slightly earlier are getting on in Cologne? They, AIUI, only differ from the CR4000s in details.