Deadly train accident in Denmark (02/01/2019)

[MarkyT]

I am still struggling to see how despite a modern unit being involved the death toll is so horrendous.
...
Is it possible the trailer got hit so hard it spun round and the very solid chassis then punctured the side of the train?

I'm pretty sure the trailer itself rather than the load must have been behind the severity of the damage, yes. Empty crates and barrels bouncing around couldn't possibly have caused so much destruction. Mounted on the front wagon behind the engine, parked like other trailers on board with its normal rear wheels (in road haulage mode) towards the front of the train, it was perhaps lifted and pushed sideways by the wind. Lifted sufficiently to clear the wagon sidewall, it may have swung out into the path of the passenger train, pivoting on its fifth wheel coupling which others have said is typically the only means of attachment of trailer to this type of wagon, and which was situated at the rear of the respective rail wagon in the particular formation. With pivot point attachment at the rear of the trailer in the direction or rail movement, slipstream along the train could only have reinforced this swinging movement. The trailer could thus have struck the front of the train at an acute angle, and still being attached to and being propelled by the momentum of the train via the fifth wheel coupling, would have been quickly shorn of its relatively thin and weak end doors, roof and side curtains as the strong steel bed and spine with only a small frontal area now remaining, penetrated the front and side skin of the passenger vehicle with great force and tragic consequences. Eventually the trailer wreckage would have finally broken away from the freight wagon and the debris, still lodged in and protruding from the front of the passenger train, was probably what proceeded to rip open the curtain sides of and cause further damage to the other trailers on board as the remainder of the freight train passed.

What sort of impact speed are we looking at?

Very difficult to judge. A long way out onto the bridge, away from junctions and stations, so probably quite a fast area, at least 100kph+ linespeed I'd guess, unless there were any special weather related restrictions in force. Could have been 200kph+ closing speed unless drivers became aware something was wrong and were able to brake before impact.

Could the death toll be high because of the broken beer bottles becoming missiles once inside the passenger vehicle?

I doubt it. I think it was the strong heavy trailer bed and spine that caused the majority of the damage and casualties.

 

[Groningen]

This storm that went across the Northsea and further east was a heavy one. No warning was issued for high winds. It is also the reason that a containership above the German/Dutch border at Borkum lost 277 containers. Also between Stockholm and north to Uppsala some people will be without power for a week.

 

[YorkshireBear]

The severity of the damage to me looks almost like a sideswipe, could it be that after the initial contact a trailer was thrust round into the side of the carriage?

 

[edwin_m]

I'm pretty sure the trailer itself rather than the load must have been behind the severity of the damage, yes. Empty crates and barrels bouncing around couldn't possibly have caused so much destruction. Mounted on the front wagon behind the engine, parked like other trailers on board with its normal rear wheels (in road haulage mode) towards the front of the train, it was perhaps lifted and pushed sideways by the wind. Lifted sufficiently to clear the wagon sidewall, it may have swung out into the path of the passenger train, pivoting on its fifth wheel coupling which others have said is typically the only means of attachment of trailer to this type of wagon, and which was situated at the rear of the respective rail wagon in the particular formation. With pivot point attachment at the rear of the trailer in the direction or rail movement, slipstream along the train could only have reinforced this swinging movement. The trailer could thus have struck the front of the train at an acute angle, and still being attached to and being propelled by the momentum of the train via the fifth wheel coupling, would have been quickly shorn of its relatively thin and weak end doors, roof and side curtains as the strong steel bed and spine with only a small frontal area now remaining, penetrated the front and side skin of the passenger vehicle with great force and tragic consequences. Eventually the trailer wreckage would have finally broken away from the freight wagon and the debris, still lodged in and protruding from the front of the passenger train, was probably what proceeded to rip open the curtain sides of and cause further damage to the other trailers on board as the remainder of the freight train passed.

Very difficult to judge. A long way out onto the bridge, away from junctions and stations, so probably quite a fast area, at least 100kph+ linespeed I'd guess, unless there were any special weather related restrictions in force. Could have been 200kph+ closing speed unless drivers became aware something was wrong and were able to brake before impact.

I doubt it. I think it was the strong heavy trailer bed and spine that caused the majority of the damage and casualties.

I agree. It was mentioned on another forum that the wind speed was fractionally below that at which freight trains would have been speed restricted.

 

[TRAX]

Does the fact that the IC4 DMUs were built by AnsaldoBreda (knowing their horrid reputation and the whole IC4 scandal, among all their other scandals) help in understanding why the victim toll was so high and why the interior of the train just broke apart as if it has been shaken heavily ?

 

[Jegerpizza]

I ussualy just lurk on this forum. But I felt it appropriate to comment on the matter as a dane my self.
This is the worst train disaster in Denmark for 30 years. The Danish crash investigation team (havarikommissionen) is currently working on the investigation. But have said that is likely that parts from the front trailer of the cargo train that's missing, hit the 2xIC4 trains operating InterCityLyn 210 from Aarhus H to København H. There were 131 passengers spread across the 8 carriages.
Trains on the bridge operate at speeds of 180kmh. However the driver of the IC4, who survived, have said he noted anomalies in the overhead wires and objects on the tracks, which caused him to slow the train, its unclear what speed the train collided with. The driver then noted something coming at him and decided to leave the cab.

Not my picture, it's from TV2.
Looks like the parts/object must have hit the side and slashed the people sitting inside on the left ending fatality.
Please do feel free to ask any questions and I'll try my best to report back from what I've read in the Danish media

 

[MarkyT]

Does the fact that the IC4 DMUs were built by AnsaldoBreda help in understanding why the victim toll was so high and why the interior of the train just broke apart as if it has been shaken heavily ?

I doubt the collision resistance was substandard to specification but the nature of the incident might be almost impossible to mitigate against. The strong steel trailer bed and spine being propelled like a knife into the car body by the full inertia of the whole freight train would probably defeat any practical front end design. The forces involved would be similar to a full head on, at least for a short time until the trailer chassis disintegrated or detached from its fifth wheel coupling, but over a much smaller frontal area and concentrated above the chassis level. The incident has characteristics of the the old underframe rideover damage experienced with UK Mk1 and earlier carriage designs in collisions and derailments. There's recent evidence of how a modern Siemens high speed front end coped with a head on followed by a bridge collision near Ankara in Turkey. In both these cases the damage to the forward vehicle passenger compartment was horrific.

On checking the IC4 story on Wikipedia I realised I hadn't appreciated before just how much trouble DSB and the manufacturer had in getting the new trains delivered and accepted into service. At one point the article suggests that national operator DSB could have been in danger of bankruptcy over the matter, if they'd been forced to scrap the fleet any earlier, as the trains were supposed to be the mainstay of many established longer distance express services throughout the small country. As it is, the fleet is to be withdrawn earlier than envisioned, by 2024. The last deliveries will have completed barely a decade in service by then. At least in Benelux, the completely new high speed service affected by the Fyra debacle had yet to start.

 

[theageofthetra]

I ussualy just lurk on this forum. But I felt it appropriate to comment on the matter as a dane my self.
This is the worst train disaster in Denmark for 30 years. The Danish crash investigation team (havarikommissionen) is currently working on the investigation. But have said that is likely that parts from the front trailer of the cargo train that's missing, hit the 2xIC4 trains operating InterCityLyn 210 from Aarhus H to København H. There were 131 passengers spread across the 8 carriages.
Trains on the bridge operate at speeds of 180kmh. However the driver of the IC4, who survived, have said he noted anomalies in the overhead wires and objects on the tracks, which caused him to slow the train, its unclear what speed the train collided with. The driver then noted something coming at him and decided to leave the cab.

Not my picture, it's from TV2.
Looks like the parts/object must have hit the side and slashed the people sitting inside on the left ending fatality.
Please do feel free to ask any questions and I'll try my best to report back from what I've read in the Danish media

Thanks for your input and sharing that photo. It's quite clear now why the death toll is so high.