Deaths on the line

[ComUtoR]

The Highways Agency has set up patrols on our motorways with the express purpose of clearing up accidents and getting the traffic moving quickly. Why do we insist on different standards for our railways?

But is doesn't get the traffic moving quickly.

I live in one of the worst traffic blackspots in the country. There was yet another serious crash last week. The motorway was closed for a couple of hours and there was a 7 mile tailback even after the lanes were closed off and traffic allowed to flow. Those lanes were blocked for 2 days.

Today on my way home there was an 8 mile tailback due to another incident. I have been home for at least 5hrs and there is still a tailback.

On a single or double line how do you suggest we keep traffic flowing ? Trains do get diverted and on larger layouts its possible to run traffic past.

There are plenty of on call staff who deal with these incidents. Sometimes it just takes time.

 

[Minilad]

The M6 though the Birmingham area was closed pretty much all day recently. A fatality occurred around 4am and the investigation and clear up took well into the afternoon. It then stayed shut while resurfacing took place.
The Macclesfield fatality today was made worse by the fact the Crewe - Manchester line is shut for engineering works so no diversionary route was available.
A fatality will always take as long as is needed for the authorities to do the investigation and clean up properly and thoroughly. These things shouldn't be rushed just because the me me me generation thinks they are more important

 

[Antman]

The M6 though the Birmingham area was closed pretty much all day recently. A fatality occurred around 4am and the investigation and clear up took well into the afternoon. It then stayed shut while resurfacing took place.
The Macclesfield fatality today was made worse by the fact the Crewe - Manchester line is shut for engineering works so no diversionary route was available.
A fatality will always take as long as is needed for the authorities to do the investigation and clean up properly and thoroughly. These things shouldn't be rushed just because the me me me generation thinks they are more important

No the me me me generation don't think they are more important but people need to get somewhere and if they are delayed they are obviously going to be asking why whether it be an incident on the road or railway.

 

[furnessvale]

Having unfortunately been an eye witness to such an event about 15 years ago where someone on the platform I was waiting on hopped off the edge in front of a train doing 80mph (as BTP later told me) I can attest to the fact that the clean up isn't always as simple as some people might assume. Grim.

I don't know if that refers to me but I make no assumptions.

I served a total of 22 years in Home Office and BTP forces and dealt directly with a number of such incidents on rail and elsewhere.

My comments are based on first hand experience of exactly what is required for all concerned.

 

[robbeech]

And another this evening at Meadowhall. I think i had only passed through there half an hour before this. I can only assume it was a XC northbound service that hit the person as it is the one on RTT that has funny results.

Rob

 

[SB48188]

I don't know if that refers to me but I make no assumptions.

I served a total of 22 years in Home Office and BTP forces and dealt directly with a number of such incidents on rail and elsewhere.

My comments are based on first hand experience of exactly what is required for all concerned.

No, not aimed at you at, sorry if it came across that way. It was more of a statement that generally, I would imagine that most members of the public are unaware of just how catastrophic the effects can be - I certainly was until I was unfortunate enough to see it happen in front of me. I'm sure with your BTP experience you are well aware.

 

[furnessvale]

No, not aimed at you at, sorry if it came across that way. It was more of a statement that generally, I would imagine that most members of the public are unaware of just how catastrophic the effects can be - I certainly was until I was unfortunate enough to see it happen in front of me. I'm sure with your BTP experience you are well aware.

Thanks.

 

[321446]

It will take as long as it takes. Someone is dead.

The why's or wherefores are neither here nor there.

Put simply, if a train breaks there are prescribed procedures to recover the service. Admittedly, not always perfectly implemented or carried out, but we get there.

Somebody steps in front of a train travelling at 90mph..... Sorry, but this, despite laid down practices, will be a moveable feast. Same if someone wraps themself around a lampost on a side road or motorway.

Annoying? Sure. Preventable? No. Sadly. It will happen. Repeatedly.

All anyone can do is try to understand why it's happened and empathise. And if at all possible take the following to heart. Sorry, but it's something VERY close to my heart. I've amended others words, but please read this. Thank-you. Scoggy.

Something happened the other day that has affected a friend and colleague of mine. I'm posting this to any of you who are feeling horrible or sad or lonely or desperate or if you know anyone who's been a bit out of sorts or not themselves.

Many people think that suicide or an attempt is a selfish move because the person just does not care about the people left behind. I can tell you that when a person gets to that point, they truly believe that their loved ones will be much better off with them gone. This is mental illness not selfishness.

Depression is a terrible disease and seems relentless. A lot of us have been close to that edge, or dealt with family members in a crisis, and some have lost friends and loved ones. Let's look out for each other and stop sweeping mental illness under the rug.
May I ask my family and friends wherever you might be, to kindly support all those who have family problems, health struggles, job issues, worries of any kind and just need to know that someone cares.

Because someone does care about you.

I do.

 

[LBSCR Times]

Just how long a delay do YOU believe is acceptable?

On third rail land, the BTP always say a minimum of 90 minutes if it is declared non-suspicious.

 

[73101]

It will take as long as it takes. Someone is dead.

The why's or wherefores are neither here nor there.

Put simply, if a train breaks there are prescribed procedures to recover the service. Admittedly, not always perfectly implemented or carried out, but we get there.

Somebody steps in front of a train travelling at 90mph..... Sorry, but this, despite laid down practices, will be a moveable feast. Same if someone wraps themself around a lampost on a side road or motorway.

Annoying? Sure. Preventable? No. Sadly. It will happen. Repeatedly.

All anyone can do is try to understand why it's happened and empathise. And if at all possible take the following to heart. Sorry, but it's something VERY close to my heart. I've amended others words, but please read this. Thank-you. Scoggy.

Something happened the other day that has affected a friend and colleague of mine. I'm posting this to any of you who are feeling horrible or sad or lonely or desperate or if you know anyone who's been a bit out of sorts or not themselves.

Many people think that suicide or an attempt is a selfish move because the person just does not care about the people left behind. I can tell you that when a person gets to that point, they truly believe that their loved ones will be much better off with them gone. This is mental illness not selfishness.

Depression is a terrible disease and seems relentless. A lot of us have been close to that edge, or dealt with family members in a crisis, and some have lost friends and loved ones. Let's look out for each other and stop sweeping mental illness under the rug.
May I ask my family and friends wherever you might be, to kindly support all those who have family problems, health struggles, job issues, worries of any kind and just need to know that someone cares.

Because someone does care about you.

I do.

This ⬆

Having suffered myself, the feeling you get is that you have no choice....yes you know what will happen, and want it quickly......but it is far preferable to the agony of living.

Im better now, but can vividly recall my memories.

The only way I can describe it to non suicidal people is this.......

Imagine you were involved in an accident in the middle of nowhere.....in agony and dying.....no chance of staying alive, but the agony is terrible.

Then you find a loaded gun next to you ......

 

[Deepgreen]

It will take as long as it takes. Someone is dead.

The why's or wherefores are neither here nor there.

Put simply, if a train breaks there are prescribed procedures to recover the service. Admittedly, not always perfectly implemented or carried out, but we get there.

Somebody steps in front of a train travelling at 90mph..... Sorry, but this, despite laid down practices, will be a moveable feast. Same if someone wraps themself around a lampost on a side road or motorway.

Annoying? Sure. Preventable? No. Sadly. It will happen. Repeatedly.

All anyone can do is try to understand why it's happened and empathise. And if at all possible take the following to heart. Sorry, but it's something VERY close to my heart. I've amended others words, but please read this. Thank-you. Scoggy.

Something happened the other day that has affected a friend and colleague of mine. I'm posting this to any of you who are feeling horrible or sad or lonely or desperate or if you know anyone who's been a bit out of sorts or not themselves.

Many people think that suicide or an attempt is a selfish move because the person just does not care about the people left behind. I can tell you that when a person gets to that point, they truly believe that their loved ones will be much better off with them gone. This is mental illness not selfishness.

Depression is a terrible disease and seems relentless. A lot of us have been close to that edge, or dealt with family members in a crisis, and some have lost friends and loved ones. Let's look out for each other and stop sweeping mental illness under the rug.
May I ask my family and friends wherever you might be, to kindly support all those who have family problems, health struggles, job issues, worries of any kind and just need to know that someone cares.

Because someone does care about you.

I do.

Very well said. It's hard to do in the thick of it, but next time a journey is delayed by a fatality, try to think yourself lucky that you are neither the dead person (along with everything they will have gone through before the fateful moment), nor someone affected directly by it.

 

[ScouserGirl]

It will take as long as it takes. Someone is dead.

The why's or wherefores are neither here nor there.

Put simply, if a train breaks there are prescribed procedures to recover the service. Admittedly, not always perfectly implemented or carried out, but we get there.

Somebody steps in front of a train travelling at 90mph..... Sorry, but this, despite laid down practices, will be a moveable feast. Same if someone wraps themself around a lampost on a side road or motorway.

Annoying? Sure. Preventable? No. Sadly. It will happen. Repeatedly.

All anyone can do is try to understand why it's happened and empathise. And if at all possible take the following to heart. Sorry, but it's something VERY close to my heart. I've amended others words, but please read this. Thank-you. Scoggy.

Something happened the other day that has affected a friend and colleague of mine. I'm posting this to any of you who are feeling horrible or sad or lonely or desperate or if you know anyone who's been a bit out of sorts or not themselves.

Many people think that suicide or an attempt is a selfish move because the person just does not care about the people left behind. I can tell you that when a person gets to that point, they truly believe that their loved ones will be much better off with them gone. This is mental illness not selfishness.

Depression is a terrible disease and seems relentless. A lot of us have been close to that edge, or dealt with family members in a crisis, and some have lost friends and loved ones. Let's look out for each other and stop sweeping mental illness under the rug.
May I ask my family and friends wherever you might be, to kindly support all those who have family problems, health struggles, job issues, worries of any kind and just need to know that someone cares.

Because someone does care about you.

I do.

Very well said!!

 

[TheManWho]

It will take as long as it takes. Someone is dead.

The why's or wherefores are neither here nor there.

Put simply, if a train breaks there are prescribed procedures to recover the service. Admittedly, not always perfectly implemented or carried out, but we get there.

Somebody steps in front of a train travelling at 90mph..... Sorry, but this, despite laid down practices, will be a moveable feast. Same if someone wraps themself around a lampost on a side road or motorway.

Annoying? Sure. Preventable? No. Sadly. It will happen. Repeatedly.

All anyone can do is try to understand why it's happened and empathise. And if at all possible take the following to heart. Sorry, but it's something VERY close to my heart. I've amended others words, but please read this. Thank-you. Scoggy.

Something happened the other day that has affected a friend and colleague of mine. I'm posting this to any of you who are feeling horrible or sad or lonely or desperate or if you know anyone who's been a bit out of sorts or not themselves.

Many people think that suicide or an attempt is a selfish move because the person just does not care about the people left behind. I can tell you that when a person gets to that point, they truly believe that their loved ones will be much better off with them gone. This is mental illness not selfishness.

Depression is a terrible disease and seems relentless. A lot of us have been close to that edge, or dealt with family members in a crisis, and some have lost friends and loved ones. Let's look out for each other and stop sweeping mental illness under the rug.
May I ask my family and friends wherever you might be, to kindly support all those who have family problems, health struggles, job issues, worries of any kind and just need to know that someone cares.

Because someone does care about you.

I do.

I couldn't agree with this more, I think we may know the same person involved in the incident you outlined and it truly is an awful turn of events

All those who say "it's unacceptable the lines are closed for so long" need to remember the numbers of lives affected by such incidents. In the grand scheme of things and hour or twos inconvenience is nothing compared to the sad events that lead a person to be convinced the best thing for them to do is end their lives and jump in front of a speeding train and all those involved in the recovery of such a terribly sad event.

 

[Antman]

I couldn't agree with this more, I think we may know the same person involved in the incident you outlined and it truly is an awful turn of events

All those who say "it's unacceptable the lines are closed for so long" need to remember the numbers of lives affected by such incidents. In the grand scheme of things and hour or twos inconvenience is nothing compared to the sad events that lead a person to be convinced the best thing for them to do is end their lives and jump in front of a speeding train and all those involved in the recovery of such a terribly sad event.

That maybe so but I've heard of people missing funerals, weddings and such like because of such incidents so their anger is understandable. There really is no right or wrong answer.

 

[infobleep]

It is due because passengers paid for a service and they didn't receive it. That's the risk any business runs when providing a service.

You seem to be thinking along the lines of "but why should the TOC/NR pay, it wasn't their fault!" but neither was it the passenger's fault!! The TOC still took their money, though.

Seriously, this point was never better explored than in the Fawlty Tower's episode "Waldorf Salad", probably the definite essay on Customer Service yet written
Indeed, there's an exchange between John Cleese and the wonderful Bruce Boa which is pretty much verbatim this whole concept. #OrderTenTaxis,I'llPayFor'em!

Trying putting that argument to the TOCs who operate under the older franchise agreement, whereby they don't pay out. Personally I don't agree with the payments but then I'd have payments to passengers along the lines of those given between railway companies and network rail. So similar formula. Might not work in practice of course.

 

[fowler9]

That maybe so but I've heard of people missing funerals, weddings and such like because of such incidents so their anger is understandable. There really is no right or wrong answer.

I get your point but if I am travelling to a wedding or a funeral I tend to allow a bit more than a couple of hours at least if travelling over a decent distance. I am sure this would not always work though.

 

[ScouserGirl]

I get your point but if I am travelling to a wedding or a funeral I tend to allow a bit more than a couple of hours at least if travelling over a decent distance. I am sure this would not always work though.

If I was going to a wedding or a funeral I would travel the day before as I know what the rail network is like as anything unexpected can happen when you travel by rail.

 

[al78]

That maybe so but I've heard of people missing funerals, weddings and such like because of such incidents so their anger is understandable. There really is no right or wrong answer.

This is the problem, it is difficult not to get frustrated when delayed if an important (to the person delayed) commitment needs to be made. Especially in the case of those who work for sociopathic bosses who won't accept ANY excuse for lateness. I fully appreciate the need for empathy and understanding in a situation such as a fatality, but I also understand that occasionally people are under a lot of pressure to be somewhere at a specific time, and in such circumstances tempers can fray, that is an unfortunate consequence of being a human driven by emotion which frequently overrides rational thought.

It is like when drivers moan about cyclists holding them up on the road, the delay is at most 10 seconds yet they make it sound like the end of the world.

 

[DelayRepay]

A news report about the rail industry's partnership with Samaritans has appeared on the BBC News site: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35610677