December 2017 Timetable

[tsr]

What about Reading?

The Guildford service is useless anyway, operating at the most inconvenient times.

Rarely do I see many people get off the evening one. Quite often I am stood right next to it. Despite this, it also seems the process of emptying it out and sitting in the platform at Guildford takes quite some time.

I can't honestly say I recall ever being there for the morning departure, so can't comment on that. It would be nice if it could leave after the first connection from the Gatwick/Redhill/Reigate area but I reckon that can't be made to be practical, having looked at it in some depth about a year ago.

 

[gavin]

New service

1Y00 04:40 York to London Kings X

Doncaster 05:07
Newark North Gate 05:35
Grantham 05:47
Peterborough 06:10
Kings X 07:00

 

[TEW]

What about Reading?

The Guildford service is useless anyway, operating at the most inconvenient times.

It's not really that inconveniently timed. The morning service provides an earlier service from Guildford to Reading than the first GWR service, and there are normally a fair few people using it. The evening service now runs at a fairly sociable time, arriving Guildford around 1900. It used to be more inconvenient, not arriving until around 2300.

 

[swt_passenger]

I can't honestly say I recall ever being there for the morning departure, so can't comment on that.

In their published consultation XC reckoned it had average passenger numbers of only 29 on the Guildford - Reading leg.

 

[nw1]

It's not really that inconveniently timed. The morning service provides an earlier service from Guildford to Reading than the first GWR service, and there are normally a fair few people using it. The evening service now runs at a fairly sociable time, arriving Guildford around 1900. It used to be more inconvenient, not arriving until around 2300.

Wondering if they could service Guildford - and Portsmouth, which always historically had a couple of CrossCountry services during the 80s and 90s into the Virgin years (with the caveat about the Portsmouth Direct becoming more heavily used with the new First timetable) by diverting a couple of the Newcastle-Southampton trains to Portsmouth during the day? (and I say that as a Southampton resident!)

Not the busier 15:47 or 17:47 out of Southampton but maybe one or two of the lighter-used midday services?

 

[swt_passenger]

Wondering if they could service Guildford - and Portsmouth, which always historically had a couple of CrossCountry services during the 80s and 90s into the Virgin years (with the caveat about the Portsmouth Direct becoming more heavily used with the new First timetable) by diverting a couple of the Newcastle-Southampton trains to Portsmouth during the day? (and I say that as a Southampton resident!)

Would probably need more stock, or fewer extended services overall. The Southampton service needed an increase of only one diagrammed unit per day. It works well because it is 2 hours extra running time every 2 hours, it's been worked out before that it wouldn't work for a Portsmouth extension. I think it would use up 3 hours out and back from Reading, in order to have a decent turnround at Portsmouth.

I reckon you'd have to lose 3 Southamptons to provide 2 Portsmouths if overall numbers of stock in use remained the same.

 

[Starmill]

New service

1Y00 04:40 York to London Kings X

Doncaster 05:07
Newark North Gate 05:35
Grantham 05:47
Peterborough 06:10
Kings X 07:00

That isn't a totally new service. It has existed for many years as the 0535 Newark North Gate to London Kings Cross. It was recently started back from Doncaster to give an earlier Doncaster to London service. Now it is being started back from York to give an earlier York to London service.

It's difficult to see who might be willing to catch a train from York at 0440!

 

[Pumbaa]

You'd be surprised. It's well loaded, even from Donny.

 

[Starmill]

That doesn't surprise me very much, but what about York makes it more likely to yield passengers at that time than Leeds?

I suppose there is a connection from Leeds, but it departs at 0205!

 

[cle]

Pretty much a 24 hour service due to TPE... once (if ever) wired, maybe it could run via Leeds and Wakefield - longer for York people but at that time, why not...

No real need for the Guildford XC service really. Sooner have more and more along the North Downs, and move towards 4tph in future - with a fast regional one which could possibly extend to Oxford and beyond (E/W) now the diveunders at Reading are all sorted...

 

[xotGD]

New service

1Y00 04:40 York to London Kings X

Doncaster 05:07
Newark North Gate 05:35
Grantham 05:47
Peterborough 06:10
Kings X 07:00

Sleepers only, or seated accommodation too?

 

[johntea]

You would have to pay me a VERY good salary in order to be at the station for 4:40am each day then straight off the train at Kings Cross probably straight onto rush hour London Underground and then the same coming back

 

[Ianno87]

You would have to pay me a VERY good salary in order to be at the station for 4:40am each day then straight off the train at Kings Cross probably straight onto rush hour London Underground and then the same coming back

Tube isn't *that* busy at 0700!

 

[mikestone1952]

A number of schedules of new trains seem to have disappeared - notably off-peak Leeds Harrogate.
On the Sheffield-Lincoln route at one point there were empty shunts at Retford, but no corresponding trains. Then they disappeared and a few afternoon Retford-Sheffield trains appeared, but these too have now gone with at least some Lincoln trains now having a March finish date.
;
On the other hand Virgin East Coast semi-fasts will now run on Saturdays.

 

[TheBigD]

Deleted

 

[IanXC]

Grand Central appear to be running a 0504 Wakefield Kirkgate to Kings Cross and 2152 return...

I believe part of the intention here is to remove their current London lodge turns, and to position the units for Crofton depot.

 

[johntea]

Will the 2152 stop at Monkhill? That would be very useful indeed

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Will the 2152 stop at Monkhill? That would be very useful indeed

The 0504 is shown as running via Hare Park and Adwick, calling at Donny (0526/31) and Peterborough (0618/20), into Kings Cross at 0716. (See http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/Y82724/2017-12-13 for example.)

The 2152 runs via the same route (in reverse, obviously ) so does not even pass through Pontefract. It is Peterborough (2243/45) and Donny (2340/42), into Kirkgate at 0003. (See http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/Y82725/2017-12-13 for example.)

Edit - Usual caveat about nothing being confirmed yet, etc.

 

[Starmill]

No Sunday Peterborough calls on services between London and Sunderland for GC then.

 

[Jake.Norman17]

New early morning service announced between york and London

https://www.minsterfm.com/news/local/2356774/new-early-york-to-london-train-planned-for-december/

 

[mikestone1952]

Looks as though electric services between Bolton and Preston start on 12th February - at least that's the date TPE trains are shown via Bolton in open train times.
Northern have the 07.22 Crewe-Bolton and two Bolton-Manchester services shown electric from the timetable change, but as far as I can see no further change in February.
That said only York trains are shown as extended back to Blackpool from 26th March so clearly there is more to come.
;
Retford and Harrogate additionals are also shown from 26th March - I think I checked to see if they were dated when they first disappeared but not 100% certain.

 

[northwichcat]

That said only York trains are shown as extended back to Blackpool from 26th March so clearly there is more to come.

Not necessarily. Northern have already said only a limited diesel service will be able to run between Blackpool and Preston between March and May. The full timetable at Blackpool North won't be restored until the May 2018 timetable change, which will then include a full hourly Liverpool service and a new direct Macclesfield service (instead of the current Hazel Grove and Manchester Victoria services.)

 

[D1009]

The 2152 runs via the same route (in reverse, obviously ) so does not even pass through Pontefract. It is Peterborough (2243/45) and Donny (2340/42), into Kirkgate at 0003. (See http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/Y82725/2017-12-13 for example.)

Edit - Usual caveat about nothing being confirmed yet, etc.

There would be very little demand at that time of night for other calling points, and no doubt rail replacement buses would be required on occasions.

 

[Greybeard33]

Looks as though electric services between Bolton and Preston start on 12th February - at least that's the date TPE trains are shown via Bolton in open train times.
Northern have the 07.22 Crewe-Bolton and two Bolton-Manchester services shown electric from the timetable change, but as far as I can see no further change in February.
That said only York trains are shown as extended back to Blackpool from 26th March so clearly there is more to come.

Liverail is now also showing, from 26 March, some Manchester Airport services restored to Blackpool North. So far only those currently operated by 185s (100mph DMU timings, portion working with Barrow/Windermere services).

Overnight replacement bus services to/from Preston/Bolton/Manchester are scheduled to continue right through to the May timetable change.

All provisional information of course.

 

[xtradj]

The 20:27 Manchester Pic to Birmingham NS which was due to be extended to Reading for Dec 17

Is this now not going ahead?

 

[absolutelymilk]

Will there be increased services between Manchester and Preston in December? (assuming electrification is complete by then)

 

[swt_passenger]

The 20:27 Manchester Pic to Birmingham NS which was due to be extended to Reading for Dec 17

Is this now not going ahead?

Hasn't the general assumption been that none of the proposed list of XC changes, from that consultation) are now happening in December, and are most likely shifted to May? (Some of the discussion has been in other threads through.)

 

[47802]

Not necessarily. Northern have already said only a limited diesel service will be able to run between Blackpool and Preston between March and May. The full timetable at Blackpool North won't be restored until the May 2018 timetable change, which will then include a full hourly Liverpool service and a new direct Macclesfield service (instead of the current Hazel Grove and Manchester Victoria services.)

I assume these will be 319 worked from May, what happens regarding the Man Airport - Blackpool Service from May do these remain diesel worked until 331's are available?

 

[backontrack]

New early morning service announced between york and London

https://www.minsterfm.com/news/local/2356774/new-early-york-to-london-train-planned-for-december/

They'd better call this the Flying Yorkshireman

 

[backontrack]

The plan is to start most of the xx.48 from Victoria back at Oxford Road at xx.38, not loaded in yet so there may be some fine tuning to be made.

Is the extension something to do with Ordsall?