DLR B23 Stock (CAF Inneo)

[Taunton]

Probably the biggest issue will be seeing the platform mirrors or monitors, but this is such an obvious point that DLR is bound to have thought about it and have a fix.

Not necessarily - the official report into the Bank DLR passenger trap/drag incident showed the monitors had been misaligned for months and no concern was shown by either train operators or DLR management about it.

 

[507 001]

There’s something very ‘Paris Metro’ about them.

 

[TRAX]

There’s something very ‘Paris Metro’ about them.

Not for long, Paris transport is now becoming blue

 

[Snow1964]

There is small status update in TfL Board Finance report (page 50)

3 trains now testing, 1 awaiting delivery to testing, another in final stage of manufacturing

DLR Rolling Stock
Rolling stock delivery
The manufacture of the new rolling stock in Spain is continuing to plan with three completed trains in the testing phase, one train awaiting delivery to the testing area and another in the final stages of manufacture, before delivery of the first two trains to Beckton in early 2023.
Beckton depot and network infrastructure
At Beckton depot, work on the northern sidings and sub-station continues. Pre- possession works are being progressed to deliver the end state northern sidings and power, which will be commissioned in late 2022.
Housing Infrastructure Funding (HIF)
Having previously completed the acquisition of land at Beckton next to the depot, the planning application for the new site south of the existing depot that will house the additional HIF trains has now been submitted. This will allow works on the land to begin later in the year.

https://board.tfl.gov.uk/documents/g681/Public%20reports%20pack%20Thursday%2006-Oct-2022%2010.00%20Finance%20Committee.pdf?T=10

 

[Thirteen]

Slightly off-topic but I wonder if the B07s and B09s might end up getting refurbished and repainted when the CAF stock is introduced as they're coming to their mid life cycle and TfL probably want the rolling stock to have the same livery and interiors.

 

[321over360]

Slightly off-topic but I wonder if the B07s and B09s might end up getting refurbished and repainted when the CAF stock is introduced as they're coming to their mid life cycle and TfL probably want the rolling stock to have the same livery and interiors.

Given that's what happened to the older stock when the B2Ks came along as they were updated to the same features as the then newer B2K had such as the automated announcements, the side displays fitted (pre B2K never had them]. However I would love to see the back of the awful livery currently used on the DLR, the original livery was much nicer

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Given that's what happened to the older stock when the B2Ks came along as they were updated to the same features as the then newer B2K had such as the automated announcements, the side displays fitted (pre B2K never had them]. However I would love to see the back of the awful livery currently used on the DLR, the original livery was much nicer

I'm no fan of the current livery, but the original screams 1980s to me. As much as I like "retro" liveries much of the time, I'm not sure it's the best look for a system that is still somewhat futuristic in many ways despite being in its 30s!

 

[Thirteen]

The original DLR livery is quite British Rail like IMO I'm sure it wouldn't be too difficult for them to refresh the B07s and B09s at least with new seating covers and the new livery.

 

[321over360]

The original DLR livery is quite British Rail like IMO I'm sure it wouldn't be too difficult for them to refresh the B07s and B09s at least with new seating covers and the new livery.

The original one felt more Docklands related though cos it was predominantly a blue livery (ie the colour of water) unlike the present Red Livery which makes it feel like a fake London bus due to the red being the predominant colour so seeing the back of this current abomination on all trains, as the new livery seems much more relevant (it has the line colour on it) than the existing

 

[Snow1964]

Some more updates taken from TfL Board programmes and Investment committee.

Seems the option for the 11 extra trains funded by Housing Infrastructure fund have not yet happened

8.5 DLUHC have not yet paid any of our submitted claims in respect of the rolling stock, and so we have not yet exercised our option with CAF to purchase the additional 11 trains. While this presents limited immediate financial risks to TfL as costs are recoverable from DLUHC, this presents significant challenges for programme delivery and threatens planned housing delivery, particularly in the Royal Docks where we are having to inform developers of capacity constraints on the DLR network which might require conditions limiting development. The matter is discussed further in the paper on Part 2 of the agenda.

4 trains now built, will be 12 by end of Financial year (31 March) out of the 43 confirmed orders (33 replacement + 10 expansion)

4.1 Through CAF, we completed manufacture and static testing of the first train three months ahead of programme, and have now completed manufacture of the first four trains. We expect to complete manufacture of 12 trains by the end of the financial year.
4.2 The first two trains commenced dynamic testing on the manufacturer’s test track in Spain three months ahead of programme. This involves type tests of the onboard systems followed by 20,000km fault free endurance testing to prove reliability. This testing is forecast to conclude by the end of 2022 and the trains will then be delivered to the UK for network testing.
4.3 There have been some issues with the integration of the Thales on board signalling software which have been successfully mitigated to date. Significant risk remains in this area of the programme, however, with limited remaining mitigations and so this remains a key area of focus for the RSRP

https://board.tfl.gov.uk/documents/s18776/pic-202210196-item12a-part1-DLR%20RSRP.pdf

 

[Dstock7080]

First new train is due to be delivered to London “next month”.
Software updates to existing trains will allow multiple operation of current fleet.

 

[MCR247]

Does that mean allowing the Olympic units to run with the older ones?

 

[100andthirty]

Does that mean allowing the Olympic units to run with the older ones?

I would very much doubt it. The older trains are due for scrap when the new ones arrive, so I can't see anyone spending money to make the B2007s compatible with the older ones - assuming that what you meant.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I would very much doubt it. The older trains are due for scrap when the new ones arrive, so I can't see anyone spending money to make the B2007s compatible with the older ones - assuming that what you meant.

That's my thinking as well - particularly since one of the B90s went for scrap last week - I'm afraid I can't remember which one it was now or where I saw the detail...

 

[DanNCL]

Software updates to existing trains will allow multiple operation of current fleet.

Does that mean allowing the Olympic units to run with the older ones?

I would very much doubt it. The older trains are due for scrap when the new ones arrive, so I can't see anyone spending money to make the B2007s compatible with the older ones - assuming that what you meant.

If it's as simple as a few software updates then it makes sense, even if only used for a couple of years.

It's been done with Flexity LRVs similar to these before - the Flexity Swift LRVs delivered to Frankfurt over the last 10-15 years had software updates to make them compatible with 1990s Duewag LRVs.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I would very much doubt it. The older trains are due for scrap when the new ones arrive, so I can't see anyone spending money to make the B2007s compatible with the older ones - assuming that what you meant.

What else would it mean then? It can't mean multiple operation of one with another train of the same type, as that's already done and has been for years - first doubles, then triples.
S-T

 

[Thirteen]

Have to admit, I have never seen B90s or B92s ever coupled with the B07s.

 

[Techniquest]

That's my thinking as well - particularly since one of the B90s went for scrap last week - I'm afraid I can't remember which one it was now or where I saw the detail...

Good chance it was 37, I believe that one was used as a depot 'Christmas tree' for a long time. I never knowingly had that one, although my record keeping at the time was lousy!

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Good chance it was 37, I believe that one was used as a depot 'Christmas tree' for a long time. I never knowingly had that one, although my record keeping at the time was lousy!

Ah, yes... 37.... that rings a bell.

Can't remember if it went to Sims or Booth's though...

 

[MCR247]

I would very much doubt it. The older trains are due for scrap when the new ones arrive, so I can't see anyone spending money to make the B2007s compatible with the older ones - assuming that what you meant.

I’d thought it was just the oldest of the old that were being replaced. What else could that comment mean? It would make things easier flexibility wise if they only had to deal with two types for diagramming: full length sets and single ones

 

[popeter45]

i think all they mean with this software update is to made the older stock aware of the new stock for signaling purposes, e.g. train length and identification values

 

[bluegoblin7]

Ah, yes... 37.... that rings a bell.

Can't remember if it went to Sims or Booth's though...

It was not 37, which is alive and well and in regular service.

39 and 98 have both been scrapped, at Booth’s in Rotherham.

88 is the other long term stopped unit, and will no doubt follow in due course.

 

[Techniquest]

It was not 37, which is alive and well and in regular service.

39 and 98 have both been scrapped, at Booth’s in Rotherham.

88 is the other long term stopped unit, and will no doubt follow in due course.

Really? Interesting. I shall have to keep an eye out for it and 66, the only two I want down there now.

EDIT: Oops, I mis-remembered my DLR notes. It was 39 I was thinking of, not 37, having looked at my book. 66 remains my only want down there now, been like that since September 2021.

 

[D15]

Anyone out there have an idea how the new units will be numbered ? 200 series maybe ?

 

[Chris M]

I don't recall ever seeing anything anywhere about how they will be numbered, but based on past practice numbers starting at 156, 160 or 201 would seem likely.

 

[BecontreeD]

I've seen a picture somewhere and if definitively had 201 on the front.

 

[theking]

201 on the test train

 

[D15]

Thanks for the replies. Had not noticed the number on the front of the test train in that photograph ! Appointment at Specsavers booked !

 

[BecontreeD]

They are on way arrive Beckton depot tomorrow apperently.

 

[TheManWho]

The first two parts of unit 201 are at Beckton depot, with the remaining parts arriving on Monday

The next unit is due to arrive in February

The vehicle will remain in Beckton depot whilst CAF work on the vehicles