East Midlands Parkway - Pointless?

[RichmondCommu]

In some ways the failure of this station, and poor take-up of parkway stations generally is a warning from history: the eastern extension of HS2 neatly sidesteps the communities of the east Midlands with its parkway location at Toton.

I concur. Thankfully the DfT have at least got plenty of time to correct their initial mistake and I dare say we will see direct HS2 services from Derby and Nottingham to London.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

I think Aylesbury Vale Parkway has to be one of the most pointless stations built - it cost over £10 million, is a whopping 4 minutes away from the town centre station and is surrounded by unoccupied new houses. I'm sorry, but who would want to live on the Berryfields development? It's on a floodplain with noisy overhead electric power lines running right across it, on a busy A road, next to the railway line (plus binliners running to Calvert 3 times a day), as well as being right next to the Rabans Lane tip and sewage plant. Lovely. Aylesbury never gets busy - there are way too many new empty car parks so the council are discounting them now at peak times - what's the point in having park and ride facilities for a small town which is absolutely terrible for shopping.

Last year, only 81000 people used it, compared to over 1 million users at Aylesbury.

Pointless.

I think AVP can be a station to judge in fifteen to twenty years time. It's part of a wider redevelopment, isn't it? I mean the area might be a lot more desirable to commuters when the line gets connected to Milton Keynes.

 

[aylesbury2]

I think AVP can be a station to judge in fifteen to twenty years time. It's part of a wider redevelopment, isn't it? I mean the area might be a lot more desirable to commuters when the line gets connected to Milton Keynes.

Yes, but the development went up quite a long time ago and many houses in the area are unoccupied still, as I've said before it's in a very bad location in an area with no local amenities unless you go to the centre of Aylesbury. I've spoken to local estate agents who say the area is very unpopular with many empty homes and it's mainly help to buy houses sold there.

 

[Yew]

In some ways the failure of this station, and poor take-up of parkway stations generally is a warning from history: the eastern extension of HS2 neatly sidesteps the communities of the east Midlands with its parkway location at Toton.

I am hoping, that all services terminating at Nottingham/derby would be extended to Toton.. Otherwise adding an extra change in, I dont think going via HS2 would make sense from mansfield, especially with an electrified HS2 and 'nottingham in 90'

 

[talltim]

Odd name for it IMO though.

Parkway is normally code for 'nowhere near' So presumably East Midlands Parkway is nowhere near the East Midlands.

 

[aylesbury2]

I think Stratford-upon-Avon Parkway should be added to the list. I've been through it plenty of of times during peak hours, and during an approximate 5 minute stop, a handful of people, if any, have gotten on or off - the car park looks bare too.

 

[7griffinjack]

Taxi drivers very quickly realised after it's opening that it wasn't worth their while to wait there but Megabus takes a few South Humberside passengers who would otherwise use TPE.

South Humberside..?! That hasn't existed for 18 years!

 

[Deerfold]

South Humberside..?! That hasn't existed for 18 years!

And so you get things like "South Humberside Community Radio - Serving North Lincolnshire"



http://www.shcr.co.uk/

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Parkways are either hugely successful (think Bristol !) , or not good performers (Alfreton and Mansfield perhaps) , certainly Ashchurch - though of course service dependant as well as local geography and economy.

Aylesbury Vale is a bit of a brave one - but the housing development did not happen to schedule - perhaps it will come good as houses etc get built , though old North London Railways had a franchise commitment to explore an Aylesbury - Milton Keynes service. Work done , and showed a single 153 car would have been ample capacity. Mind you , this was 1996 .....

 

[edwin_m]

Alfreton and Mansfield, now just plain Alfreton, seems to do all right with a fair number boarding or alighting on every train I've been on that stops there. Maybe fewer than East Midlands Parkway but it's still enough to stop the Liverpool-Norwich there as well as the Nottingham-Leeds, unlike nearby Langley Mill and the future Ilkeston station.

I guess the new Chiltern Milton Keynes service will also call at Aylesbury Vale Parkway.

 

[ashworth]

Alfreton and Mansfield, now just plain Alfreton, seems to do all right with a fair number boarding or alighting on every train I've been on that stops there. Maybe fewer than East Midlands Parkway but it's still enough to stop the Liverpool-Norwich there as well as the Nottingham-Leeds, unlike nearby Langley Mill and the future Ilkeston station.

Way back in the 1980's I used to use Alfreton station on a fairly regular basis to travel to and from Sheffield. I agree that is still fairly well used today, but nowhere near as busy as it was 20-30 years ago.
In those days the car park was free and Day Return fares to both Nottingham and Sheffield were extremely cheap from Alfreton in comparison to the prices charged now.
If you arrived at the station mid morning, especially on a Saturday leading up to Christmas you would find the car park full to capacity and have to park with dozens of others on waste ground beyond the car park, and there would be lengthy queues outside the door for buying tickets mainly for Nottingham but also quite a number for Sheffield.

Then fares went up considerably, car parking charges were introduced and people used buses into Nottingham instead. The car park, not being so well used, went through a period of looking very neglected and there was damage to cars and even cars being stolen from the car park. I stopped using Alfreton during this time and although I understand it is safe to park there again now I've never really gained confidence in leaving my car there for a whole day especially picking it up after dark in winter.

Lower fares and free parking worked in the past would it work again here and at East Midlands Parkway where parking is far more secure.

 

[bunnahabhain]

Way back in the 1980's I used to use Alfreton station on a fairly regular basis to travel to and from Sheffield. I agree that is still fairly well used today, but nowhere near as busy as it was 20-30 years ago.
In those days the car park was free and Day Return fares to both Nottingham and Sheffield were extremely cheap from Alfreton in comparison to the prices charged now.
If you arrived at the station mid morning, especially on a Saturday leading up to Christmas you would find the car park full to capacity and have to park with dozens of others on waste ground beyond the car park, and there would be lengthy queues outside the door for buying tickets mainly for Nottingham but also quite a number for Sheffield.

Then fares went up considerably, car parking charges were introduced and people used buses into Nottingham instead. The car park, not being so well used, went through a period of looking very neglected and there was damage to cars and even cars being stolen from the car park. I stopped using Alfreton during this time and although I understand it is safe to park there again now I've never really gained confidence in leaving my car there for a whole day especially picking it up after dark in winter.

Lower fares and free parking worked in the past would it work again here and at East Midlands Parkway where parking is far more secure.

The Robin Hood Line will also have taken away a lot of custom that would have otherwise used Alfreton & Mansfield Parkway on a more long distance basis.

Personally I'd call Sutton Parkway a successful station, it may not have huge figures but at peak times you can have upwards of 30-40 people boarding or alighting there.

 

[Tetchytyke]

North London Railways had a franchise commitment to explore an Aylesbury - Milton Keynes service. Work done , and showed a single 153 car would have been ample capacity. Mind you , this was 1996 .....

I doubt that much has changed. For all this talk on the thread of dual carriageways or new railway lines to Milton Keynes, I'm not convinced that anyone actually wants to go to Milton Keynes. Better links to MK aren't suddenly going to improve Aylesbury which, for the most part, is a dump.

Vale Parkway is a station nobody needs serving a housing development nobody lives in. I hope that changes, but for now the development is very unattractive because there's bugger all there and there's no centre to the development. Fairford Leys worked a lot better because they tried to build a community feel, rather than thousands of little boxes (all made of ticky tacky).

Aylesbury has better links to Oxford than most of the rest of Buckinghamshire: the 280 may take two hours, but at least it runs frequently and until very late in the evening. Buses from places like High Wycombe westwards are non existent. Buses in Hemel, a bigger town, pretty much stop at 7pm.

It might have been different if the Government had followed through with the plan for the A41 to be the motorway to Oxford, but other than a two-mile stretch of motorway at Tring (now downgraded) they didn't.

 

[Yew]

I also don't think the car parking charges help. People are not going to pay such high prices to park, even with the reduced Park and ride Tickets, to travel local journeys into Nottingham, Derby or Leicester. There's a huge car park which is rarely much more than a quarter full. Why not just charge a nominal fee of £1 or even try making it free.

It would probably fill up with airport passengers...

 

[cle]

I doubt that much has changed. For all this talk on the thread of dual carriageways or new railway lines to Milton Keynes, I'm not convinced that anyone actually wants to go to Milton Keynes. Better links to MK aren't suddenly going to improve Aylesbury which, for the most part, is a dump.

Vale Parkway is a station nobody needs serving a housing development nobody lives in. I hope that changes, but for now the development is very unattractive because there's bugger all there and there's no centre to the development. Fairford Leys worked a lot better because they tried to build a community feel, rather than thousands of little boxes (all made of ticky tacky).

Aylesbury has better links to Oxford than most of the rest of Buckinghamshire: the 280 may take two hours, but at least it runs frequently and until very late in the evening. Buses from places like High Wycombe westwards are non existent. Buses in Hemel, a bigger town, pretty much stop at 7pm.

It might have been different if the Government had followed through with the plan for the A41 to be the motorway to Oxford, but other than a two-mile stretch of motorway at Tring (now downgraded) they didn't.

They're both dumps yes, but MK has a lot of jobs and a huge shopping centre, not to mention a lot of leisure and events.

Aylesbury to Oxford will soon be much quicker - a quick change at High Wycombe (the future MK train, no less) and then along to Bicester and Oxford - and more jobs and amenities at those places.

There would also be via Winslow which might be about the same length, so if you missed the MK train southbound to High Wycombe, it could be the next best bet. And Winslow will have 2tph to Bicester and Oxford also.

 

[Deerfold]

It would probably fill up with airport passengers...

And how are they going to get to the airport?

 

[nottinghamcity]

And how are they going to get to the airport?

In reality the infrastructure was in place to link rail to EMA long before East Midlands Parkway, and are still the most sensible. Long Eaton for Nottingham Skylink to AP, and Derby/Leicester for Derby Skylink. EMD could never compete with the frequency of rail and bus services at these other routes. But that was understood. EMD was never intended to serve the airport.

 

[aylesbury2]

They're both dumps yes, but MK has a lot of jobs and a huge shopping centre, not to mention a lot of leisure and events.

Aylesbury to Oxford will soon be much quicker - a quick change at High Wycombe (the future MK train, no less) and then along to Bicester and Oxford - and more jobs and amenities at those places.

There would also be via Winslow which might be about the same length, so if you missed the MK train southbound to High Wycombe, it could be the next best bet. And Winslow will have 2tph to Bicester and Oxford also.

Is it known how much time trains from Aylesbury to Oxford via Winslow will take, and will they be direct or require a change at Winslow? It's possible to travel from Aylesbury to Oxford via Princes Risborough and Banbury but it involved 3 changes and a journey time of just under 2 hours, so comparable to the 280 but more expensive and much more complicated.

 

[Deerfold]

In reality the infrastructure was in place to link rail to EMA long before East Midlands Parkway, and are still the most sensible. Long Eaton for Nottingham Skylink to AP, and Derby/Leicester for Derby Skylink. EMD could never compete with the frequency of rail and bus services at these other routes. But that was understood. EMD was never intended to serve the airport.

Indeed - I was asking the question as to how all these airport passengers who would fill up the suggested free parking at EMD would then get to the airport.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Then fares went up considerably, car parking charges were introduced and people used buses into Nottingham instead. The car park, not being so well used, went through a period of looking very neglected and there was damage to cars and even cars being stolen from the car park. I stopped using Alfreton during this time and although I understand it is safe to park there again now I've never really gained confidence in leaving my car there for a whole day especially picking it up after dark in winter.

In all fairness Alfreton is not the most salubrious of East Midland’s towns I'm not entirely surprised that cars were being damaged and indeed stolen. In fact sadly I would expect the same from many of the other towns that straddle the Derbyshire / Notts border. It's a sign of the times I'm afraid and Langley Mill is no better!

 

[nottinghamcity]

I didn't realise that the airport so explicitly warned against the use of EMD. From their website:
quote:
East Midlands Parkway
It is possible to connect at East Midlands Parkway for journeys to and from destinations outside the East Midlands region, however this station is not served by bus. We recommend you use Derby or Long Eaton train stations if you want to connect to East Midlands Airport by bus.

 

[fishquinn]

Actually I use East Midlands Parkway a lot and it is a pretty nice station. I think its main purpose is to serve the motorway and airport. I think that it is a very useful station because kit saves driving into Nottingham itself and paying for the tram or an outrageous amount of parking.

 

[edwin_m]

I didn't realise that the airport so explicitly warned against the use of EMD. From their website:
quote:
East Midlands Parkway
It is possible to connect at East Midlands Parkway for journeys to and from destinations outside the East Midlands region, however this station is not served by bus. We recommend you use Derby or Long Eaton train stations if you want to connect to East Midlands Airport by bus.

That's a very sensible bit of advice, probably prompted by the Airport's green policies and the support they have given to bus connections. Environmentally speaking it may be a drop in the ocean compared to aviation emissions, but at least it's a start.

 

[burns20]

East Midlands Parkway is to gain 9 buses a day on route 865 from Clifton to Sutton Bonington after a major revision of subsidised bus services across Nottinghamshire

 

[stut]

The £6 flat fare shared taxi shuttle service from EMD to EMA is pretty decent. Used it in the past, will probably use it again.

 

[HowardGWR]

The £6 flat fare shared taxi shuttle service from EMD to EMA is pretty decent. Used it in the past, will probably use it again.

Is that right? So if you are the only one who turns up, it still only costs £6? That's what I call entrepreneurial (had to look up spelling!).

 

[user15681]

Can't be as pointless as Thanet Parkway, which received funding this week despite Manston Airport closing!

 

[mister-sparky]

Can't be as pointless as Thanet Parkway, which received funding this week despite Manston Airport closing!

But isn't the massive house building right next to it still going to happen? And they're proposing to turn the airport into housing.

 

[Scotty]

The £6 flat fare shared taxi shuttle service from EMD to EMA is pretty decent. Used it in the past, will probably use it again.

I get a train to Nottingham, then £8 return on the Skylink bus.

 

[stut]

Good, but that would take about an extra hour for me...