EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[TheKnightWho]

Out of EU/EEA immigration is going to rise anyway, so they ain't gonna get what they wished for.

Pretty much. "Economics isn't everything" - but people tend to care more about having a job, food and leisure time than they do about abstract notions involving nation when things really begin to bite.

 

[northwichcat]

To add a bit of humour to the thread

 

[EM2]

If the UK doesn't Article 50 (due to mass rioting and popular demand over summer leading to another referendum and a libdem landslide in an election), can the rest of the EU kick us out?

No.
Nothing can force the UK to 'press the Article 50 notification button', and nothing can force the EU to negotiate until it is pressed. It is entirely a matter for a Member State to decide whether to make the notification and, if so, when. In turn, there is no obligation on the EU to enter into negotiations until the notification is made. There is therefore a stalemate. If this were game of chess, a draw would now be offered.

 

[ExRes]

A win for democracy? We'll get a PM that we didn't vote for and that's democracy?

I seem to remember that there were plenty of Labour supporters saying it was alright when Brown took over from Blair

 

[Geezertronic]

Well the FTSE 100 closed at 6,138.69 which is -199.41 down, but up on the week. Ironically it has still been higher than before Cameron announced the EU Referendum date in February when it went as low as 5536.97 (which was not as low as it went today)

http://www.bloomberg.com/quote/UKX:IND

 

[EM2]

I seem to remember that there were plenty of Labour supporters saying it was alright when Brown took over from Blair

The same as Conservatives were when Major took over from Thatcher.

 

[northwichcat]

I seem to remember that there were plenty of Labour supporters saying it was alright when Brown took over from Blair

Which backfired on Labour. If they'd called an Autumn 2007 election they would probably have won and could have remained in power until up to Autumn 2012. However, he had to call an election 18 months after a recession (due to 5 years being the maximum term) which resulted in a hung parliament.

 

[DarloRich]

I know very well what I voted for... However we've yet to start procedures to leave the EU - that is the point I am making

want to bet that Daves last act as PM is to press send on the email marked: Article 50 Declaration and start the clock as he rides off into the Panamanian sunet

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

want to bet that Daves last act as PM is to press send on the email marked: Article 50 Declaration and start the clock as he rides off into the Panamanian sunet

I was hoping it would be to appoint me as the next PM whereupon I would issue laws dissolving Southern, ban any more D stock from being withdrawn and remove the Anti-Pacer bill

 

[Geezertronic]

want to bet that Daves last act as PM is to press send on the email marked: Article 50 Declaration and start the clock as he rides off into the Panamanian sunet

That would be rather Liam Byrne-esque

 

[northwichcat]

remove the Anti-Pacer bill

There is no anti-Pacer bill - 3 franchise agreements have wording in them regarding Pacers. The December 2019 deadline (for all franchises) requires all trains (Pacers and non-Pacers) to be accessible and not dump toilet waste on to the tracks, changing that would anger disability groups.

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

There is no anti-Pacer bill - 3 franchise agreements have wording in them regarding Pacers. The December 2019 deadline (for all franchises) requires all trains (Pacers and non-Pacers) to be accessible and not dump toilet waste on to the tracks, changing that would anger disability groups.

I'd appoint you as DPM

 

[VauxhallandI]

Suffering ! you talk as if he's just had a terminal diagnosis, he was on the losing side of a political referendum, hardly suffering, get a grip.

Why not have a go at the poster who thinks all Leave voters should be branded or is it only the winning side you feel the need to have a go at.

Yes because I really meant that we should actually brand people didn't I?

 

[TheKnightWho]

Yes because I really meant that we should actually brand people didn't I?

Don't worry - Railops just has one giant persecution complex.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

I seem to remember that there were plenty of Labour supporters saying it was alright when Brown took over from Blair

Funny that, I must be old-fashioned as I vote for my local candidate and the Party, not for the Party Leader...as I think it used to be and should be. So, in my mind, I think Brown was right and so would Cameron's successor, if s/he did not call a GE.

 

[TheEdge]

What he said was that he would go to the European Council next week to'explain the decision the British people have taken' and has said it should be up to the next prime minister to decide when to activate Article 50.

I honestly think this will be ignored. I think Cameron was not expecting a Leave vote at all so said his "Article 50" line to sound real. Now its happened I think he is stalling for time to give a few months to really re-evaluate the position of the UK and if the Leave will really happen.

I think we will see either a second referendum as this one was so close or a "thanks for your opinion general public but no thanks, we'll stay"

 

[DarloRich]

I honestly think this will be ignored. I think Cameron was not expecting a Leave vote at all so said his "Article 50" line to sound real. Now its happened I think he is stalling for time to give a few months to really re-evaluate the position of the UK and if the Leave will really happen.

I think we will see either a second referendum as this one was so close or a "thanks for your opinion general public but no thanks, we'll stay"

they might take the Irish line and say sort out X,Y and Z and we will stay. However I feel the turnout, engagement and interest in the referendum means that we will leave. That is what the majority wanted.

 

[TheKnightWho]

they might take the Irish line and say sort out X,Y and Z and we will stay. However I feel the turnout, engagement and interest in the referendum means that we will leave. That is what the majority wanted.

At the same time, not everyone wanted to leave outright. There also seem to be reports of people casting protest votes because they expected Remain to win, as well as quite a lot of people who have instantly regretted it now that they see that "Project Fear" was Project Reality...

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

I honestly think this will be ignored. I think Cameron was not expecting a Leave vote at all so said his "Article 50" line to sound real. Now its happened I think he is stalling for time to give a few months to really re-evaluate the position of the UK and if the Leave will really happen.

I think we will see either a second referendum as this one was so close or a "thanks for your opinion general public but no thanks, we'll stay"

At which point we should get our concessions

 

[TheEdge]

they might take the Irish line and say sort out X,Y and Z and we will stay. However I feel the turnout, engagement and interest in the referendum means that we will leave. That is what the majority wanted.

Again, I'm just not sure. Even with that it is so so close I think there is too much of a large minority to do it.

 

[Flying Snail]

At the same time, not everyone wanted to leave outright. There also seem to be reports of people casting protest votes because they expected Remain to win, as well as quite a lot of people who have instantly regretted it now that they see that "Project Fear" was Project Reality...

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-06-24/leave-voter-disappointed-and-wishes-to-vote-remain/

Utter morons, that's the problem with democracy every thick fool gets a vote.

There should be an entrance exam at polling stations to weed out the criminally ignorant, 10 simple factual questions about the vote that if you can't answer correctly you aren't allowed in.

 

[ExRes]

Funny that, I must be old-fashioned as I vote for my local candidate and the Party, not for the Party Leader...as I think it used to be and should be. So, in my mind, I think Brown was right and so would Cameron's successor, if s/he did not call a GE.

I think you need to address that to paulweaver, he's the one that seems to think democracy is at risk

 

[Senex]

However I feel the turnout, engagement and interest in the referendum means that we will leave. That is what the majority wanted.

I'm not so sure about that. The turnout was certainly good by British standards, though there were still over a quarter of the electorate who did not vote. As for the engagement and interest, I wasn't conscious of very much of that at all. There was hardly any leafleting or electioneering, and I didn't find that the referendum was a topic of great public conversation. As for the result being what the majority wanted, well yes, if 37% of the electorate does dictate what the people wanted. I do feel that taking such a momentous decision on the basis of a simple majority rather than with something like a two-thirds requirement was not a way to ensure universal acceptance of the result. (And I also feel that where there is devolution, the question of what to do if one part voted very firmly one way and another part voted equally firmly the other way should have been properly considered in advance.)

 

[Dave1987]

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-06-24/leave-voter-disappointed-and-wishes-to-vote-remain/

Utter morons, that's the problem with democracy every thick fool gets a vote.

There should be an entrance exam at polling stations to weed out the criminally ignorant, 10 simple factual questions about the vote that if you can't answer correctly you aren't allowed in.

Tough! You voted to leave, now you have to live with the consequences.

 

[ExRes]

At the same time, not everyone wanted to leave outright. There also seem to be reports of people casting protest votes because they expected Remain to win, as well as quite a lot of people who have instantly regretted it now that they see that "Project Fear" was Project Reality...

More the fool them, if they think the right to vote is some sort of game or joke then they deserve whatever comes their way

Shame for Cameron, of course, that his scaremongering 'Project Fear' obviously didn't worry as many people as he'd hoped, I'm not sure how though as the combined forces of Cameron, Osborne, Blair, Major and Brown should surely have been enough to scare even the most ardent Stephen King fan into submission

 

[anme]

Funny that, I must be old-fashioned as I vote for my local candidate and the Party, not for the Party Leader...as I think it used to be and should be. So, in my mind, I think Brown was right and so would Cameron's successor, if s/he did not call a GE.

In a democracy, it's very important that the electorate get to choose the prime minister, correct? (You might argue the head of state as well, but let's save that for another day)
How should I do this if I only think about the local candidate and party?

 

[Antman]

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-06-24/leave-voter-disappointed-and-wishes-to-vote-remain/

Utter morons, that's the problem with democracy every thick fool gets a vote.

There should be an entrance exam at polling stations to weed out the criminally ignorant, 10 simple factual questions about the vote that if you can't answer correctly you aren't allowed in.

Good grief this takes the biscuit!

Obviously you didn't get the outcome you wanted.

Maybe there should be 10 simple factual questions before anyone can post on here?

Utter morons? Oh the irony :roll:

 

[TheKnightWho]

More the fool them, if they think the right to vote is some sort of game or joke then they deserve whatever comes their way

Shame for Cameron, of course, that his scaremongering 'Project Fear' obviously didn't worry as many people as he'd hoped, I'm not sure how though as the combined forces of Cameron, Osborne, Blair, Major and Brown should surely have been enough to scare even the most ardent Stephen King fan into submission

It's not "Project Fear" when it comes back to bite as it already has. You're just burying your head in the sand.

I have yet to hear anyone say something resoundingly positive about leaving yet, because there isn't any.

 

[ExRes]

I'm not so sure about that. The turnout was certainly good by British standards, though there were still over a quarter of the electorate who did not vote. As for the engagement and interest, I wasn't conscious of very much of that at all. There was hardly any leafleting or electioneering, and I didn't find that the referendum was a topic of great public conversation. As for the result being what the majority wanted, well yes, if 37% of the electorate does dictate what the people wanted. I do feel that taking such a momentous decision on the basis of a simple majority rather than with something like a two-thirds requirement was not a way to ensure universal acceptance of the result. (And I also feel that where there is devolution, the question of what to do if one part voted very firmly one way and another part voted equally firmly the other way should have been properly considered in advance.)

If 28% of the actual electorate cannot be bothered to vote then 37% certainly does dictate the outcome

 

[Butts]

Good grief this takes the biscuit!

Obviously you didn't get the outcome you wanted.

Maybe there should be 10 simple factual questions before anyone can post on here?

Utter morons? Oh the irony :roll:

Would one of them relate to the apparel that is de rigueur for train spotting normally to be found within Oxfam Outlets and other good charity shops?