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[Fantasy] How Would You Start A Bus War In <Insert City Here>?

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TheGrandWazoo

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Knutsford to Macc did operate as a commercial service under both High Peak and GHA and after GHA went bust while it was contracted the subsidy value for that section is very low.

Though not commercially viable evidently and that’s on an existing corridor with a half decent service pattern.

Going back to the OP, think the reasons why it isn’t viable are as I outlined and don’t really see a commercially viable proposal any time soon
 
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northwichcat

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Though not commercially viable evidently and that’s on an existing corridor with a half decent service pattern.

I fail to see how it's a half decent service pattern when the gaps between services at peak times are over 2 hours and the services which do operate pre-11am and post-3pm can have all seats occupied and the buses go all around the houses when most of the patronage is on a fairly direct route. A regular direct service (which includes Radbrooke Hall and Macclesfield Hospital) probably could be viable commercially but it would create a headache for the council over what to do about the little villages.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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I fail to see how it's a half decent service pattern when the gaps between services at peak times are over 2 hours and the services which do operate pre-11am and post-3pm can have all seats occupied and the buses go all around the houses when most of the patronage is on a fairly direct route. A regular direct service (which includes Radbrooke Hall and Macclesfield Hospital) probably could be viable commercially but it would create a headache for the council over what to do about the little villages.

Half decent relative to the one between Knutsford and Warrington!
 

Ayman Ilham

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I'd have Ilham Travel LTD start local/interurban operations in North West Wales (under the brand "Network Bangor") to compete with Arriva mostly. Take the Wright Solars off Rosso and refurbish to modern standard, much like TrentBarton with free WiFi, USB, high-back seats (mixed moquette/leather), attractive route branding, etc. For new buses, Enviro 200 MMC or Optare Metrocity would do the job brilliantly! I would put out new routes as well as improve and restore routes lost following the demise of Express Motors. Some routes would be like this:
1 - Bangor to Porthmadog via Caernarfon, Penygroes & Criccieth - E400 MMC / Wright Solar - every 30 minutes
6 - Bangor to Betws-y-Coed via Bethesda & Capel Curig - Wright Solar / Optare Metrocity - hourly
7 - Bangor to Bala via Caernarfon & Porthmadog - Wright Solar / Optare Metrocity - two hourly
40 - Llandygai to Parc Menai via MaesG, City Centre & Ysbyty Gwynedd - E200 MMC - every 15 minutes
42 - Garth Pier to Llanfairpwll via City Centre, Holyhead Road & Menai Bridge - E200 MMC - every 15 minutes
X42 - Bangor to Holyhead via Menai Bridge, A55 & Valley (Anglesey Airport) - Wright Solar - hourly
85/86 - Bangor to Llanberis (duplicate of Arriva) - Wright Solar / Optare Metrocity - every 30 minutes
All can be integrated with my X55 coach service from Manchester via Chester, St Asaph & Llandudno Junction!
 

Deerfold

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I`d start up in Halifax,looking at providing links not currently on offer but could become popular

- Service 502 Halifax - Illingworth - Bradshaw - Denholme - Cullingworth - Harden - Long Lee - Keighley
Re-introducing this link that seems to be brought up every year or 2,plus would provide Harden with a direct bus to Keighley,Operating Hourly using 2 vehicles

- Services 505/6: Halifax Bus Stn - Calderdale Royal Infirmary - Kings Cross - Thumb Hall - Pellon - Halifax (506 in reverse)
Both services operating Half Hourly,providing direct links from the Pellon & Thumb Hall area to the Hospital & links Kings Cross to the ASDA Superstore at Thumb Hall using 4 Vehicles

- Services 543 Halifax Bus Stn - Siddal - Exley - Southowram
Linking local villages together that currently dont have a direct link despite being fairly close together,Operating Hourly using 1 vehicle

- Service 544 Calderdale Royal Infirmary - Copley - Sowerby Br - Luddenden - Midgley - Mytholmroyd - Hebden Bridge
Providing a bus to the Royal Infirmary from parts of the Calder Valley that dont currently,as well as providing a service from the Midgley area into Hebden Br,Operating Hourly using 2 Vehicles

Using Minibuses (say Solos or Mellor) due to both some of the roads the routes would be operating on plus to help keep costs down,plus offer discount fares on sections that compete against others,such as £1 from Pellon or Illingworth into Halifax to pouch some customers.

Would be interesting, but years of withdrawals and unreliable buses seem to have put people off buses in Calderdale. I used to be a regular on the 505/6 between King Cross and Pellon and the 502.

I'm not sure it'd be easy to get people back.

On the other hand, between Illingworth and Halifax you're competing against 2 companies running several frequent services.

Between Pellon and Halifax the frequencies have been slowly dropping for years.

Assuming you mean Thrum Hall?
 

carlberry

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I'd have Ilham Travel LTD start local/interurban operations in North West Wales (under the brand "Network Bangor") to compete with Arriva mostly. Take the Wright Solars off Rosso and refurbish to modern standard, much like TrentBarton with free WiFi, USB, high-back seats (mixed moquette/leather), attractive route branding, etc. For new buses, Enviro 200 MMC or Optare Metrocity would do the job brilliantly! I would put out new routes as well as improve and restore routes lost following the demise of Express Motors. Some routes would be like this:
1 - Bangor to Porthmadog via Caernarfon, Penygroes & Criccieth - E400 MMC / Wright Solar - every 30 minutes
6 - Bangor to Betws-y-Coed via Bethesda & Capel Curig - Wright Solar / Optare Metrocity - hourly
7 - Bangor to Bala via Caernarfon & Porthmadog - Wright Solar / Optare Metrocity - two hourly
40 - Llandygai to Parc Menai via MaesG, City Centre & Ysbyty Gwynedd - E200 MMC - every 15 minutes
42 - Garth Pier to Llanfairpwll via City Centre, Holyhead Road & Menai Bridge - E200 MMC - every 15 minutes
X42 - Bangor to Holyhead via Menai Bridge, A55 & Valley (Anglesey Airport) - Wright Solar - hourly
85/86 - Bangor to Llanberis (duplicate of Arriva) - Wright Solar / Optare Metrocity - every 30 minutes
All can be integrated with my X55 coach service from Manchester via Chester, St Asaph & Llandudno Junction!
I'd suggest this wouldn't cause a bus war, just a trip to a bankruptcy hearing! North Wales has a recent history of operators that haven't been able to make services pay (especially competing ones) even using some less than honest tactics. Bethesda to Capel Curig didn't even warrant a bus service at various times recently!
 

TheGrandWazoo

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I'd suggest this wouldn't cause a bus war, just a trip to a bankruptcy hearing! North Wales has a recent history of operators that haven't been able to make services pay (especially competing ones) even using some less than honest tactics. Bethesda to Capel Curig didn't even warrant a bus service at various times recently!

Padarn Bus was the most obvious example recently though KMP and Express made a reasonable fist of it but that was in better days than today’s climate (which is what you mean by citing recent). The demise of Huw’s being the latest example.

You’re absolutely right on the service south of Bethesda though it’s not stopping the WG from having a TC service which is absolute lunacy IMHO.

Not convinced by Porthmadog to Bala either. There’s not many houses there and Capel Celyn might struggle to provide much trade!!!
 

carlberry

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Padarn Bus was the most obvious example recently though KMP and Express made a reasonable fist of it but that was in better days than today’s climate (which is what you mean by citing recent). The demise of Huw’s being the latest example.

You’re absolutely right on the service south of Bethesda though it’s not stopping the WG from having a TC service which is absolute lunacy IMHO.

Not convinced by Porthmadog to Bala either. There’s not many houses there and Capel Celyn might struggle to provide much trade!!!
Oddly Caernarfon to Llanberis has just come up as a service that's free (and making the BBC news as one of the councillors wants to set up a Gwynedd Corporation bus company!)
 

Aictos

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I can think of two places where I would look into launching operations both serving different markets both in type and locality.

1. Introduce Peterborough Bus Company Platinum branding to Peterborough for the Citi 1 and Citi2/3 (The Citi 2/3 interwork anyway) with double decker buses with leather seats, power sockets and free wifi on a 15 to 20 minute frequency and offer a choice of tickets from singles, returns, day explorers, weekly seasons, monthly seasons, 6 monthly seasons and yearly seasons.

This would then give Stagecoach as the main operator in the area a well heeled wake up call!

2. Introduce a local service for Hertfordshire with hourly buses from Hertford to Luton via Hatfield and Hertford to Stevenage via Watton at Stone between 6am and 9pm Monday to Sunday with wifi/power sockets fitted buses and Next Stop information as used in London and by NXWM Platinum routes.
 

Mutant Lemming

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I always thought that Widnes to Warrington services were fairly poor considering their respective sizes and proximity to each other. Maybe the historical divide between the Chemics and the Wires had something to do with it.
 

Mutant Lemming

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I can think of two places where I would look into launching operations both serving different markets both in type and locality.



2. Introduce a local service for Hertfordshire with hourly buses from Hertford to Luton via Hatfield and Hertford to Stevenage via Watton at Stone between 6am and 9pm Monday to Sunday with wifi/power sockets fitted buses and Next Stop information as used in London and by NXWM Platinum routes.

There just isn't the cross county demand - why would you catch a bus between any of those places for work or leisure when they all have excellent rail links into London ? The only slight possibility is if it were to serve Luton airport and then only for people working there. Uno have recently cut their late weekday evening service between Luton and Hatfield because there just wasn't anyone travelling on it.
 

Aictos

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There just isn't the cross county demand - why would you catch a bus between any of those places for work or leisure when they all have excellent rail links into London ? The only slight possibility is if it were to serve Luton airport and then only for people working there. Uno have recently cut their late weekday evening service between Luton and Hatfield because there just wasn't anyone travelling on it.

Simply because the bus service in Hertford is infrequent (This was in 2014 so not sure if any changes have happened), not everybody wants to go to London and also Hatfield is only 10 minutes away by road yet if you want to travel between the two you have to either go via Alexandra Palace or via Stevenage both of which would take much longer then a direct bus between the two.

Of course there was (again not sure if it still runs) the 724 Heathrow to Harlow service but this is a more local service working on a hourly clockface timetable throughout the entire week.
 

Yorks185

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Would be interesting, but years of withdrawals and unreliable buses seem to have put people off buses in Calderdale. I used to be a regular on the 505/6 between King Cross and Pellon and the 502.

I'm not sure it'd be easy to get people back.

On the other hand, between Illingworth and Halifax you're competing against 2 companies running several frequent services.

Between Pellon and Halifax the frequencies have been slowly dropping for years.

Assuming you mean Thrum Hall?

I Agree it would be difficult to try & regain lost passengers,but over time i do think by providing a reliable service & not chopping & changing it fairly frequently (i think both Tiger & First have been guilty of this over the years) then people would start to trust & use the services (as a kick start,do some decent promotional stuff such as Social media,display in Halifax Town Cnt & maybe an old fashioned leaflet drop off along the routes)

For Illingworth,a way to avoid trying to go head to head with the more frequent services is for the route to turn off Keighley Rd & use the full length of Shay Lane into Holmfield & onto Bradshaw (parts of Shay Lane currently not served),plus this could work out slightly quicker

BIB: Yep,slight typo on my part
 

James101

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Time machine time, I’d like to have seen Arriva’s venture into the Potteries managed differently. Rather than half heartedly adopting the Wardle name, go for the full Arriva brand. Focus efforts on competing commercially to Crewe (85, 20) and Uttoxeter (32) where they could build on established season ticket markets at either end. Work on winning contract work in the Alsager and Biddulph areas to link to their network in Congleton and onto Macclesfield. Bolster appeal in the Stoke-on-Trent area with additional core services, their 41 & 42 of the time plus the 16 to leek would be a good commercial base plus the piecemeal subsidised work out into the Staffordshire countryside.

This would form an unbroken Arriva brand presence from North Wales, Manchester, Cheshire, Staffordshire, Shropshire, Derbyshire & beyond.
 

Mutant Lemming

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Time machine time, I’d like to have seen Arriva’s venture into the Potteries managed differently. Rather than half heartedly adopting the Wardle name, go for the full Arriva brand. Focus efforts on competing commercially to Crewe (85, 20) and Uttoxeter (32) where they could build on established season ticket markets at either end. Work on winning contract work in the Alsager and Biddulph areas to link to their network in Congleton and onto Macclesfield. Bolster appeal in the Stoke-on-Trent area with additional core services, their 41 & 42 of the time plus the 16 to leek would be a good commercial base plus the piecemeal subsidised work out into the Staffordshire countryside.

This would form an unbroken Arriva brand presence from North Wales, Manchester, Cheshire, Staffordshire, Shropshire, Derbyshire & beyond.

My time machine would go back further to North Western or PMT rather than the German state.
 

Ayman Ilham

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Introducing ITL CityConnectCymru, express coach services across Wales to put TrawsCymru to shame, making use of easily accessible B8RLE Panthers and B11R Elite Interdecks with free WiFi, USB and plug sockets, comfy seats, toilets, etc:
cX1: Newport - Cardiff - Swansea - Carmarthen - Haverfordwest - St Davids
cX2: Bangor - Caernarfon - Porthmadog - Machynlleth - Aberystwyth - Lampeter - Carmarthen - Swansea
cX3: Bangor - Llandudno Junction - Colwyn Bay - St Asaph - Mold - Wrexham
cX4: Wrexham - Oswestry - Welshpool - Newtown - Llandrindod Wells - Brecon - Merthyr Tydfil - Pontypridd - Cardiff
This network also makes sure all 6 cities in Wales are well connected; cX1 and cX3 are hourly, while cX2 and cX4 are every 2 hours.
 
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Deerfold

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Introducing ITL CityConnectCymru, express coach services across Wales to put TrawsCymru to shame, making use of easily accessible B8RLE Panthers and B11R Elite Interdecks with free WiFi, USB and plug sockets, comfy seats, toilets, etc:
cX1: Newport - Cardiff - Swansea - Carmarthen - Haverfordwest - St Davids
cX2: Bangor - Caernarfon - Porthmadog - Machynlleth - Aberystwyth - Lampeter - Carmarthen - Swansea
cX3: Bangor - Llandudno Junction - Colwyn Bay - St Asaph - Mold - Wrexham
cX4: Wrexham - Oswestry - Welshpool - Newtown - Llandrindod Wells - Brecon - Merthyr Tydfil - Pontypridd - Cardiff
This network also makes sure all 6 cities in Wales are well connected; cX1 and cX3 are hourly, while cX2 and cX4 are every 2 hours.

I think you'd struggle to do that with 15 buses.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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I think you'd struggle to do that with 15 buses.

Very true. If you take the cX1 and split it into chunks and some fag packet calculations

Newport to Swansea (using NX672 times) = 90 mins
Swansea to Carmarthen (using NX528 times) = 50 mins
Carmarthen to Haverfordwest (30 Miles) = 60 mins at least (?)
Haverfordwest to St Davids (using 411 times) = 40 mins

So that’s 4 hours driving with no recovery so even with a very modest 30 mins, that’s 9 for an hourly service.
 

Mutant Lemming

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Introducing ITL CityConnectCymru, express coach services across Wales to put TrawsCymru to shame, making use of easily accessible B8RLE Panthers and B11R Elite Interdecks with free WiFi, USB and plug sockets, comfy seats, toilets, etc:
cX1: Newport - Cardiff - Swansea - Carmarthen - Haverfordwest - St Davids
cX2: Bangor - Caernarfon - Porthmadog - Machynlleth - Aberystwyth - Lampeter - Carmarthen - Swansea
cX3: Bangor - Llandudno Junction - Colwyn Bay - St Asaph - Mold - Wrexham
cX4: Wrexham - Oswestry - Welshpool - Newtown - Llandrindod Wells - Brecon - Merthyr Tydfil - Pontypridd - Cardiff
This network also makes sure all 6 cities in Wales are well connected; cX1 and cX3 are hourly, while cX2 and cX4 are every 2 hours.

Would hazard a guess that the citizens of Wrexham, Bangor, Llandudno and most of North Wales would much prefer a direct link to Liverpool or Manchester.
 

Ayman Ilham

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Would hazard a guess that the citizens of Wrexham, Bangor, Llandudno and most of North Wales would much prefer a direct link to Liverpool or Manchester.
I also got that covered ;) using Plaxton Elite coaches, I would have two alternating services connecting North Wales to Liverpool and Manchester! X53 and X55, both of which would run Bangor - Llanfairfechan(X53)/Penmaenmawr(X55) - Llandudno Junction - Colwyn Bay - St Asaph - Chester making maximum use of the A55 dual carriageway, with the X53 continuing almost nonstop to Liverpool ONE and the X55 nonstop to Manchester Airport then Shudehill! Each service would be hourly, making Bangor - St Asaph - Chester every 30 minutes! If this combines with the cX3 (operated by B8RLE Panther) to Wrexham, this would make Bangor to St Asaph every 20 minutes! And who says I have to use 15 coaches? I'd say about 50 (15x B9R, 15x B8RLE, 20x B11RT) would do for all these routes!
 

tbtc

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In the original post.

I guess that is why others are questioning your plan

Aye, I thought that a nominal limit would encourage people to be creative with resources, rather than duplicate *every* busy service, or list a large number of services, it'd mean finding weak spots in existing town/city networks - e.g. there might be a large student population who are more likely to use the train station (for weekends away, trips back to their parents' house etc) but the local bus network doesn't have a link from the University side of town to the train station...

...or maybe a place where the retail "gravity" has shifted but some main bus routes are still left serving the quieter end of town rather than where the new shops are... (e.g. as Sheffield City Centre has blossomed on The Moor and withered around Waingate, it's taken time for bus routes to adapt)

...or a place with an out-of-town "destination" that lacks a proper service...

...or a new housing estate that isn't yet on the bus map...

...or an evening route that diverts via the "pub crawl" side of town, rather than going along the shopping streets when the shops are closed...

...or a return of a popular old route that has a certain resonance with people (e.g. I've had a couple of people ask me in Sheffield City Centre where to catch the "60" - once a service that ran every couple of minutes in the morning rush hour as far as the University/Hallamshire Hospital (before the tram took a chunk of that market, and the Hallamshire lost some key functions) - the kind of route that people knew about even if didn't go to their side of town

Or maybe some creative thinking based on potential changes in demand that your local operators aren't anticipating.

Would you go for the upmarket passengers or pile'em'high with a MagicBus style service?

Fifteen vehicles also sounded like the top limit of what one operator might use in the first wave of an attack on a different town/city (e.g. the days of First operating the 56 from Edinburgh to Ballingary or the 11 from Kilmarnock to Irvine, the days of Stagecoach operating MagicBus in Glasgow).
 

Typhoon

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Aye, I thought that a nominal limit would encourage people to be creative with resources, rather than duplicate *every* busy service, or list a large number of services, it'd mean finding weak spots in existing town/city networks - e.g. there might be a large student population who are more likely to use the train station (for weekends away, trips back to their parents' house etc) but the local bus network doesn't have a link from the University side of town to the train station.
True. I used to live in south Birmingham. I could redesign the whole network, come up with twenty to thirty routes, lots of detail but of little interest to the majority. Requirement of 200 vehicles. Just not practical.

Perhaps more important, your thread, your rules.
 

tbtc

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True. I used to live in south Birmingham. I could redesign the whole network, come up with twenty to thirty routes, lots of detail but of little interest to the majority. Requirement of 200 vehicles. Just not practical.

Perhaps more important, your thread, your rules.

Talking of Birmingham - it's a city without the kind of cross-city services that we have in Sheffield.

Are there any cross-city routes that you think would be viable? Or does the road network in the centre (and the pedestrianisation of New Street etc) encourage services that dip a toe into the city centre but don't cross it? For example, Nottingham's pedestrianisation and ring road seem to suit the kind of network that NCT have, where buses don't run cross-city.

Birmingham also has a central train station (a few!) and cross-city trains to the Queen Elizabeth Hospital/ University area, so that's one obvious idea for a cross-city bus rendered unnecessary. Any missing links in the NatEx network though?
 

TheGrandWazoo

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And who says I have to use 15 coaches? I'd say about 50 (15x B9R, 15x B8RLE, 20x B11RT) would do for all these routes!

Because that was what the original poster specified, as has been mentioned - the full-ish quote was!

I thought I'd expand it to a general comment...

...if you were starting a bus war in any particular town/city, how would you do it?

Let's say...

  • you have a fleet capable of meeting a daily PVR of fifteen buses
  • you are trying to hit the dominant operator in the pocket/ make as much money for yourself (rather than recreate esoteric links)
  • up to you if you want to go for old liveries and old route numbers (that might play well with the "twirlies" but mean nothing to the under-forties) or directly copy current routes/ numbers

Think you're also guilty of the esoteric links!
 

Typhoon

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Talking of Birmingham - it's a city without the kind of cross-city services that we have in Sheffield.

Are there any cross-city routes that you think would be viable? Or does the road network in the centre (and the pedestrianisation of New Street etc) encourage services that dip a toe into the city centre but don't cross it? For example, Nottingham's pedestrianisation and ring road seem to suit the kind of network that NCT have, where buses don't run cross-city.

Birmingham also has a central train station (a few!) and cross-city trains to the Queen Elizabeth Hospital/ University area, so that's one obvious idea for a cross-city bus rendered unnecessary. Any missing links in the NatEx network though?
There did used to be cross city buses (5/6/7* - Edgbaston/ Bearwood area to Perry Common, 15/16/17 - Whittington Oval to Hampstead, 90/91/92 - Stratford Road area, Hall Green boundary and Robin Hood probably, to somewhere in the north of the city) that I semi remember but these were broken up. When I first lived in Birmingham, these routes had conductors. Later on, when Timesaver (limited stop) buses were introduced, there was a Coventry - Airport - City - Halesowen route, possibly 900 but the west of the city leg didn't appear to be too successful and was dropped, may have been the 900.
What I think did for these routes was when the Midland Red routes were taken over. For instance, Birmingham covered the Stratford Road to the city boundary but the Midland Red routes went on to Shirley and beyond (probably Solihull). After the transport executive took over the Midland Red routes in the conurbation, they merged routes so those living beyond the Birmingham boundary had more frequent buses and lower fares. Similarly, I think the Whittington Oval route was merged with a route to Kingshurst or Chelmsley Wood; Hagley Road (5/6/7) was already covered by former Midland Red routes to Stourbridge, Dudley, Wolverhampton, and others. If they had remained as through routes, they would have been very long, running in urban traffic. All of this happened before New Street was pedestrianised. Certainly, the road network in the centre has something to do with it but, at one time, there was the free Centrebus that took you round the city centre meaning you could get from any one stop to another.

Rail - the cross city line was (is?) very busy - serves Five Ways - and the line through Snow Hill from Stourbridge to Shirley or Solihull is also really a cross city line. The Travelcard system also encouraged rail travel.

One possible destination might have been the airport, but there are already links from the city centre as well as the north and south - and it is some way from the city. All in all, I don't think there would be enough take up otherwise one of the smaller operators would have taken it up.

* - there were slight variations. All buses to Perry Common (I think it went that far) were numbered 7, in the other direction buses either terminated at Sandon Road or Portland Road (one was the 5 and the other the 6). Both served Five Ways and Broad Street, where there were (are?) lots of offices. The other routes were similar. Some of this is hazy as I scrape my memory banks.
 

Deerfold

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For example, Nottingham's pedestrianisation and ring road seem to suit the kind of network that NCT have, where buses don't run cross-city.

That's why NCT don't run cross-city (largely).

There were loads of cross city routes in the mid 90s when I lived there. Ones I used to use include:

12 Beeston to West Bridgford
25 Bilborough to Carlton (every 5 minutes)
70 Hucknall to Clifton (!)
 

Ayman Ilham

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Aye, I thought that a nominal limit would encourage people to be creative with resources, rather than duplicate *every* busy service, or list a large number of services, it'd mean finding weak spots in existing town/city networks - e.g. there might be a large student population who are more likely to use the train station (for weekends away, trips back to their parents' house etc) but the local bus network doesn't have a link from the University side of town to the train station...

...or maybe a place where the retail "gravity" has shifted but some main bus routes are still left serving the quieter end of town rather than where the new shops are... (e.g. as Sheffield City Centre has blossomed on The Moor and withered around Waingate, it's taken time for bus routes to adapt)

...or a place with an out-of-town "destination" that lacks a proper service...

...or a new housing estate that isn't yet on the bus map...

...or an evening route that diverts via the "pub crawl" side of town, rather than going along the shopping streets when the shops are closed...

...or a return of a popular old route that has a certain resonance with people (e.g. I've had a couple of people ask me in Sheffield City Centre where to catch the "60" - once a service that ran every couple of minutes in the morning rush hour as far as the University/Hallamshire Hospital (before the tram took a chunk of that market, and the Hallamshire lost some key functions) - the kind of route that people knew about even if didn't go to their side of town

Or maybe some creative thinking based on potential changes in demand that your local operators aren't anticipating.

Would you go for the upmarket passengers or pile'em'high with a MagicBus style service?

Fifteen vehicles also sounded like the top limit of what one operator might use in the first wave of an attack on a different town/city (e.g. the days of First operating the 56 from Edinburgh to Ballingary or the 11 from Kilmarnock to Irvine, the days of Stagecoach operating MagicBus in Glasgow).
Oh I see, sorry about that, didn't notice there was a limit :lol: In that case, I'll just stick to the X53 and X55 idea providing better links between North Wales and Liverpool/Manchester, since that alone could be done with about 15 coaches, as well as provide more convenience for the many North Walians travelling to/from Liverpool and Manchester. It would be much cheaper to use refurbished 2nd hand coaches as opposed to brand new ones, so I would probably have a fleet of Plaxton Paragons and/or Van Hool T9s fully modernised with new livery, leather seats, free WiFi and USB charging. If the routes become successful, I would upgrade to Plaxton Elites or Panther LEs.

As I mentioned earlier, each route is hourly and alternate between each other in order to provide a half-hourly service between Bangor and Chester, providing a new connections to the City of St Asaph (which is also quicker than going via Rhyl like NatEx and the trains, as it would make more use of the A55 and can quickly get back on it thank to St Asaph being located just off the expressway), as well as easily rivalling (if not beating) the train in terms of speed and frequency, as well as providing a cheaper alternative.

After Chester, the X53 would continue nonstop to Liverpool via the M53, which would provide a direct connection from North Wales to Liverpool that is non-existant with the train (you either change at Chester for a slow Merseyrail service or at Crewe taking the long way round, either way is very inconvenient) and is not efficient with NatEx (only one service a day and too slow considering it stops at every town on the coast and the price is locked at a rather hefty one way fare). The X55 would run nonstop to Manchester Airport, then straight to Shudehill, providing both a direct airport connection AND a city connection for shoppers. This would again rival the train service and be faster due to being more direct (less winding round like the train service does) and less stops.
 

Ianno87

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Cambridge: Introduce a 5 minute interval service between the City Centre, Railway Station and Addenbrooke's Hospital campus, calling all stops. Possibly extending to Babraham Road Park & Ride. £1 single, £8-10 weekly ticket. Basically undercut Stagecoach on their busiest corridor and flood it with buses (though Stagecoach would probably retaliate..)

Go Whippets clearly saw my idea:

https://twitter.com/GoWhippet/status/1096147570169180160?s=20

Out first fully branded bus for the new Pedigree route starting on Monday, up to 8 buses per hour rail station to Addenbrooke's and direct links to the shops and the city centre.

Stagecoach have already had a pre-emptive steike with introducing £1 single tickets on the same corridor...
 
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