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Fire at Vauxhall station
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ChiefPlanner
Established Member
Well it will not be the first time that a rail grinder has caused a fire - if that is the case in this instance. ...
Well done to Network Rail staff. They were able to do the repairs today and now all the lines are open.
However the earlier shuttle between Hampton Court and Surbiton appears not to be running now. Still it's good news for passengers tomorrow.
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However the earlier shuttle between Hampton Court and Surbiton appears not to be running now. Still it's good news for passengers tomorrow.
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bb21
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If such a mechanism existed, I am not aware of it.
It doesn't do that in disruption mode. That is exactly what the disruption mode was designed to prevent.
Doesn't stop lots of people asking "Are these the only six trains running tonight?" at 1800 or "Where has the 1916 gone? There is nothing between 1912 and 2003."
There is no perfect solution unfortunately, you leave them on the board and the limited space soon gets taken up by all the "Delayed" services.
RichmondCommu
Established Member
As a commuter all I can say is thank God for the District!
The trains to Hampton Court are running to and from Surbiton. They are just being shown on the National Rail Enquiries App online departure boards as cancelled.
Perhaps there wasn't time to update it. It does display correctly at Surbiton station at least.
I wonder if the Darwin link being available would have helped at all today.
For some reason it's still switched off. Last I heard it would be switched on mid April. Not sure what the latest date is. Perhaps it's no longer known.
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Perhaps there wasn't time to update it. It does display correctly at Surbiton station at least.
I wonder if the Darwin link being available would have helped at all today.
For some reason it's still switched off. Last I heard it would be switched on mid April. Not sure what the latest date is. Perhaps it's no longer known.
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Back slaps all round to the same company that made its customers' lives a right pain today by setting fire to its own property. (Same company that receives billions of taxpayer revenue).
mbreckers
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Searle
Established Member
The CIS system keeps crashing when linked to Darwin, so it probably would have made things worse today!
Why doesn't that come as a surprise from the Daily Mail readers!
DarloRich
Veteran Member
not sure you quite understand what happened here...........
Deepgreen
Established Member
Perhaps you could tell us then? The BBC news article to which we have been directed here simply says that it is "suspected" that the "passing" (I am assuming that it was actually working at the site) rail grinder's sparks caused the fire. Assuming it did for a moment, and also assuming that grinding sparks would not be enough to set fire to signal cables alone (i.e. without an accelerant of more easily combustible materials around the cables), then it appears that NR did exactly that - set fire to its own property/materials, causing very major disruption. It now appears that the signal cable damage was not so severe as to require longer-term repair work, but the day's disruption was enormous. Given the lack of serious damage to the cabling, then the only thing that seems to have been done is to put out the fire (done by others) and check for damage. NR may or may not deserve praise for this.
If this is not accurate, could you provide the facts, please?
Deepgreen
Established Member
Could not agree more. Society plunges ever further into the pit of irresponsibility. Free newspapers certainly help to fuel the problem.
I think it very likely that the rail grinder crew would have been completely unaware of the platform construction at that point and certainly at night-time unable to see the rubbish under it. So little blame could be attached to them. It is clear that there was extremely limited clearance under that part of the platform because of all the woodwork; how practicable would it have been to remove the rubbish? I suspect some of the rubbish had been under there since BR days and would be nicely dried out after decades of shelter from the rain!
Those that have drawn comparisons with Kings Cross and Bradford: well, it was uncleared rubbish set alight at Bradford, so that's a factor in common, but at Bradford it was a much larger area, on a slope, inside a stand with a roof, and with many people present. So the comparison is somewhat weak, in my opinion.
I hope NR will check other wood platforms to see that there are no traps for rubbish underneath them, and clear any that have problems.
Those that have drawn comparisons with Kings Cross and Bradford: well, it was uncleared rubbish set alight at Bradford, so that's a factor in common, but at Bradford it was a much larger area, on a slope, inside a stand with a roof, and with many people present. So the comparison is somewhat weak, in my opinion.
I hope NR will check other wood platforms to see that there are no traps for rubbish underneath them, and clear any that have problems.
SpacePhoenix
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Is there a fixed schedule for litter picking (trackside) in station areas at all anywhere in the country?
DarloRich
Veteran Member
how easy do you think getting access to the approach to Waterloo is for heavy engineering. Now have a think how easy that access would be for picking up litter How do you think you or other passengers ( like FOH above) would feel if trains were cancelled as the line was blocked for "rubbish collection". Do you think SWT would agree to that?
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Most sunday mornings as the service is designed to run on half the infrastructure... so the other half can be (lightly) maintained.
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tsr
Established Member
It's regularly done, mainly overnight, at and on the approaches to London Victoria, which is probably one of the only comparable stations in the region really.
(Unfortunately some passengers still manage to leave the place looking like a tip within a very short time afterwards so I do sometimes wonder if they could just park the trains outside and convert the platform lines to giant rubbish skips. It's clearly what they want.)
You're being ridiculous, nobody suggested cancelling trains for litter picking to take place :roll:
Quite straightforward I would think. There are 8 tracks at this point. If it can't be arranged to close some of these and reroute around these between 2300 and 0500 on a rota basis for minor maintenance then good old skills have been completely lost.
Suggesting that such work can't be done without cancellations is just ludicrous.
The truth is, however, that such minor maintenance does indeed seem to have been given up, presumably to save money so it can be squandered elsewhere. Weeds are allowed to grow right at the running line. There was a weed (turning into a bush) which I steadily watched grow through the ballast on a DC line over the months until it was getting clouted by the collector shoes of every passing train.
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Actually, technically, they sometimes do.
Litter clearance takes place within T3 possessions, quite often alongside other worksites ot more substantial work.
Possessions do alter the train service.
Ergo, a service altering possession with litter clearance can cause cancelled trains.
DarloRich
Veteran Member
looking at the pictures of the damaged platform structure simply walking along with a bin bag in the "quiet time" picking up the visible waste wouldn't really do the job. Of course, I am sure you will know best,
yes we can blame Mrs Thatcher for not completing her own vision. If she had her way then all the platforms and tracks out of Waterloo would have been ripped up and replaced by a road and it would be a Motorway from Waterloo to Exeter!
Deepgreen
Established Member
It seems we are back at the point where, to paraphrase many previous posts on different threads, nothing can ever be done - it's just too difficult.
We (the railway as a whole, and NR in particular in many instances) can't clear rubbish, we can't clear weeds, we can't repair platform equipment that is close to the edge (see my Redhill platform train indicator ranting in the Redhill station thread!), we can't remove NR's own scrap materials, we can't remove graffiti, we can't paint anything close to the track that needs it...and so on.
Depressing - and costly, as was proved yesterday.
We (the railway as a whole, and NR in particular in many instances) can't clear rubbish, we can't clear weeds, we can't repair platform equipment that is close to the edge (see my Redhill platform train indicator ranting in the Redhill station thread!), we can't remove NR's own scrap materials, we can't remove graffiti, we can't paint anything close to the track that needs it...and so on.
Depressing - and costly, as was proved yesterday.
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DarloRich
Veteran Member
that simply isn't true. Whilst those sort of jobs cant be done quite as easily as many of you suggest with proper planning they can ( and are) be done.
However it is important to note, which many posters seem unable to do, that we don't live in 1957. The available windows for works, the pool of man power, HSEA regulations, the commercial challenges associated with the privatised system and the much more intensively used railway are very different than in the past.
Litter picking/maintenance seems to be handled ok on roads, with rolling lane closures using multiple vehicles.
It's a culture thing. The railways appear (to a layman) to not care about litter. Now a platform's been toasted it'll be a hot topic for a few months no doubt. Although we presumably need a period of debate about who dropped the litter and how the cost of tidying up should be split, depending on what ticket the litter dropper held :cry:.
It's a culture thing. The railways appear (to a layman) to not care about litter. Now a platform's been toasted it'll be a hot topic for a few months no doubt. Although we presumably need a period of debate about who dropped the litter and how the cost of tidying up should be split, depending on what ticket the litter dropper held :cry:.
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