First Greater Glasgow

[SarahDFIG]

With First's buses I've found recently that you either end up freezing or burning. There's no inbetween. As for the leaking it's been a mix of bad window repairs or from the ceiling of the bus. There's been times bus drivers have mentioned it to the depot and they won't even give them another bus from the depot

If there is an issue with an vehicle it will be removed from service. The only time it will not be removed is if the driver doesn't report it

 

[awsnews]

With First's buses I've found recently that you either end up freezing or burning. There's no inbetween. As for the leaking it's been a mix of bad window repairs or from the ceiling of the bus. There's been times bus drivers have mentioned it to the depot and they won't even give them another bus from the depot

If it is coming from the roof then it is quite likely to be condensation, especially with adl bodies as they seem to be adept at creating thermal bridging which makes the problem worse. It is particularly noticeable on Dumbarton's E300s on cold mornings, especially as the bus starts to get busy.

 

[Busman84]

With First's buses I've found recently that you either end up freezing or burning. There's no inbetween. As for the leaking it's been a mix of bad window repairs or from the ceiling of the bus. There's been times bus drivers have mentioned it to the depot and they won't even give them another bus from the depot

Plenty of cabs also were bad for rainwater getting in too. I would say most windscreens replaces rainwater got in and sat in the sill. This affected demisters if you did not use something to soak up the water

 

[lastbus]

If there is an issue with an vehicle it will be removed from service. The only time it will not be removed is if the driver doesn't report it

Not necessarily

 

[SarahDFIG]

Not necessarily

It will be removed from service if it causes any risk to anyone. Failure to do so can result in an visit to the TC if reported. As mentioned above with vehicles leaking etc, I have seen it once or twice with an vehicle taken off due to leaking water but 9/10 they will remain in service. Unfortunately customer service at First doesn't exist especially with FG. I have been around the company long enough to witness it plenty of times.

 

[SarahDFIG]

Lots of questions being raised this week in regards to the X1 express service being axed. Personally I am 100% with the passengers as FIG have pulled the plug on the service so they don't need to replace the fleet on this service with E6 vehicles and blaming it on competition from ScotRail and congestion on the M74. Sorry but the peak services are packed and I don't know what congestion they are talking about on the M74 as the traffic is fine at peak between Junction 5 at Hamilton and Junction 4 onto the 73 .... First have said they have looked at all ways to make the route profitable but are unable to continue. The biggest reason it's being removed will be the fact the buses are returning to depot at night with the vaults near empty with most passengers opting for M-Tickets or concession holders. The biggest killer for First I would say is the monthly/yearly bus tickets. Yes offers good value for money but if these tickets were scrapped we would see more profit. Why not re-route the X1 to serve either Glasgow Fort or better still re-reroute the express bus so it serves the city centre where it would easily fill the bus. Yes it would add on journey times but most people would love the idea of the express vehicles serving the city centre rather than having to walk all the way upto the bus station or catch another bus up. Right now FG are looking for any excuse to cut bus numbers to cascade old stock and in the long run it will cost them. I don't believe for an fact the X1 is running at a loss, the buses during the day 100% but the peak runnings will be making money defo. Will another company step in and take over the X1 - My money would be on Stuarts of Carluke.

 

[Gingerbus1991]

Lots of questions being raised this week in regards to the X1 express service being axed. Personally I am 100% with the passengers as FIG have pulled the plug on the service so they don't need to replace the fleet on this service with E6 vehicles and blaming it on competition from ScotRail and congestion on the M74. Sorry but the peak services are packed and I don't know what congestion they are talking about on the M74 as the traffic is fine at peak between Junction 5 at Hamilton and Junction 4 onto the 73 .... First have said they have looked at all ways to make the route profitable but are unable to continue. The biggest reason it's being removed will be the fact the buses are returning to depot at night with the vaults near empty with most passengers opting for M-Tickets or concession holders. The biggest killer for First I would say is the monthly/yearly bus tickets. Yes offers good value for money but if these tickets were scrapped we would see more profit. Why not re-route the X1 to serve either Glasgow Fort or better still re-reroute the express bus so it serves the city centre where it would easily fill the bus. Yes it would add on journey times but most people would love the idea of the express vehicles serving the city centre rather than having to walk all the way upto the bus station or catch another bus up. Right now FG are looking for any excuse to cut bus numbers to cascade old stock and in the long run it will cost them. I don't believe for an fact the X1 is running at a loss, the buses during the day 100% but the peak runnings will be making money defo. Will another company step in and take over the X1 - My money would be on Stuarts of Carluke.

Stuart's of Carluke cerrtainly wont be able to run a service any better than First.

 

[overthewater]

First can't do anything else because it would require an extra bus, it's why it no longer via George Sq or other parts of the city. The X1 could also be tried a different route with Hamilton? IE hourly circular each way to try and cut down on the running time within hamilton? First are right the certain runs off peak are dreadful quilt but surly there could have made the 226 every 12mins until 9am? its been well recorded the overcrowding on the x1.

My money would still be on Stagecoach rather than Stuarts.

 

[lastbus]

Lots of questions being raised this week in regards to the X1 express service being axed. Personally I am 100% with the passengers as FIG have pulled the plug on the service so they don't need to replace the fleet on this service with E6 vehicles and blaming it on competition from ScotRail and congestion on the M74. Sorry but the peak services are packed and I don't know what congestion they are talking about on the M74 as the traffic is fine at peak between Junction 5 at Hamilton and Junction 4 onto the 73 .... First have said they have looked at all ways to make the route profitable but are unable to continue. The biggest reason it's being removed will be the fact the buses are returning to depot at night with the vaults near empty with most passengers opting for M-Tickets or concession holders. The biggest killer for First I would say is the monthly/yearly bus tickets. Yes offers good value for money but if these tickets were scrapped we would see more profit. Why not re-route the X1 to serve either Glasgow Fort or better still re-reroute the express bus so it serves the city centre where it would easily fill the bus. Yes it would add on journey times but most people would love the idea of the express vehicles serving the city centre rather than having to walk all the way upto the bus station or catch another bus up. Right now FG are looking for any excuse to cut bus numbers to cascade old stock and in the long run it will cost them. I don't believe for an fact the X1 is running at a loss, the buses during the day 100% but the peak runnings will be making money defo. Will another company step in and take over the X1 - My money would be on Stuarts of Carluke.

The X1 is 100% not making money. To say they are taking it off so they don’t need to make 4 buses Euro 6 is laughable. If it was about euro 6 they could have just re routed it via Dobbies Loan. If no one goes on SPT will surely need to subsidise it.

 

[smtglasgow]

Can’t see SPT stepping in – they’re as skint as everyone else. Unless First have a change of heart or someone else starts a peak time bus (I reckon 2 journeys in each peak could be profitable) that’s the end of fast buses to and from the Hamilton estates. The idea that *anyone* would change from the new 225 to a 255 or 267 is laughable. Scotrail are the big winner out of this, but the trains are already rammed.

 

[PaulMc7]

Out of the motorways through Glasgow I'd argue that the M74 is the best one for handling congestion. Can be a bit busy from the Rutherglen junction to Polmadie but it's mainly okay. It's the roads going onto it that can be problematic but that applies to any motorway. I think the problem with the X1 is how much of the journey is in Hamilton. Could it not even just run to the bus station and link with the 225 that way? Another idea for it I thought of was through the fort too but the other one I had was to stay on the M74, come off at Polmadie then run alongside the 267 up to Buchanan Bus Station. Yes it would need new buses but if it remained that would happen anyway. They've really messed up this one. I'm surprised the backlash to the 19A being only part replaced too hasn't been as bad. Seen a few grumbles on Twitter but nothing as bad as I thought would happen.

Whitelaws could maybe be a shout for a new bus into Glasgow city centre if they have the buses for it. Even just for peaks. First have really only left 2 options as far as buses go.

1 of which absolutely nobody will do and that's the 255/263/267 or the other would be 225 onto a 201/266 then an X11 into Glasgow

 

[overthewater]

SPT IS a no go, Hamilton still has express coach service....

 

[PaulMc7]

Seen one of the transferred buses from Livingston on an X85 today too which was interesting. Learned too that the 87/88/89 can literally be anything. Seen 3 88s in a row with different types of buses 1 of which being a 75 branded decker

 

[lastbus]

SPT IS a no go, Hamilton still has express coach service....

Not from hillhouse/high earnock it doesn’t and it’s not regular at peaks to take the capacity the X1 did

 

[overthewater]

That should still make it no go for SPT, if people can still made a connection.

 

[PaulMc7]

Not from hillhouse/high earnock it doesn’t and it’s not regular at peaks to take the capacity the X1 did

Not only that the first X74 is 7:55am from Hamilton bus station and the next is 9:15am so it's a non-starter for everyone. The first one is also not due at Buchanan Bus Station til 8:40am if it's on time

Even out of the city centre there's 1 bus at an hour at 15 past the hour. Nowhere near enough to take the X1 capacity

 

[JumpinTrainz]

It just goes to show that travel is changing. Most people nowadays have a car. You only have to look at the motorways in the morning. Even going back 10 years ago there are more cars on the roads! Not to mention there has been a lot of investment into the railways with electrification works being introduced on various lines. The perfect example of that would be the E-G, Cumbernauld and the Whifflet line which has allowed for better services all round the east end and more coaches to increase capacity.

Using buses as a mode of transport will dwindle less and less if better plans aren’t brought in to encourage people from their cars on to the buses. By that I mean more bus lanes, restricted access to cars and taxi’s into the City Centre, discounted travel incentives. I mean WiFi, leather seating and plug sockets on buses is a great improvement straight up. Now we just need tougher structures brought in to place to place to combat congestion and the bigger picture - global warming. Councils have to act tougher.

Looking back to years ago routes like the 4 used be so busy. Now they’ve been cut back. Same with the Cumbernauld services. The reality is showing.

 

[PaulMc7]

It just goes to show that travel is changing. Most people nowadays have a car. You only have to look at the motorways in the morning. Even going back 10 years ago there are more cars on the roads! Not to mention there has been a lot of investment into the railways with electrification works being introduced on various lines. The perfect example of that would be the E-G, Cumbernauld and the Whifflet line which has allowed for better services all round the east end and more coaches to increase capacity.

Using buses as a mode of transport will dwindle less and less if better plans aren’t brought in to encourage people from their cars on to the buses. By that I mean more bus lanes, restricted access to cars and taxi’s into the City Centre, discounted travel incentives. I mean WiFi, leather seating and plug sockets on buses is a great improvement straight up. Now we just need tougher structures brought in to place to place to combat congestion and the bigger picture - global warming. Councils have to act tougher.

Looking back to years ago routes like the 4 used be so busy. Now they’ve been cut back. Same with the Cumbernauld services. The reality is showing.

Wholeheartly agree with all of this. It's crazy how many cars there are even around where I stay and I'd say there's probably only a handful of areas in Glasgow with better bus services than mine's. The train is also covered by 4 trains an hour too which are all extremely busy at peaks. The car is the most expensive method of travel yet used more than ever and that's down to public transport companies being very poor and the council failing to deal with the sheer volume of cars

 

[overthewater]

People cant take the bus to their work. Why would you use the bus for any other reason why you have just spent a mint on getting a car for your work.

 

[PaulMc7]

People cant take the bus to their work. Why would you use the bus for any other reason why you have just spent a mint on getting a car for your work.

I think that's what people are getting at tbh. The whole idea is so that people don't buy them in the first place. I've never wanted to drive purely because it would be wasted money to me especially since the buses are so good near me. An outright ban on cars and limits to taxis would be the way to start for me then people who work in the city centre would have to switch.

Special permits for delivery vehicles and people who need their car for their job would obviously be needed but the number of cars would be reduced massively

 

[JumpinTrainz]

People cant take the bus to their work. Why would you use the bus for any other reason why you have just spent a mint on getting a car for your work.

Look at London for an example. Glasgow not being anywhere near as big as London albeit but many there don’t drive for the simple purpose - the transport links mean they don’t have to and it’s the easiest mode of transport around the city in many cases (not always can I just add)!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It just goes to show that travel is changing. Most people nowadays have a car. You only have to look at the motorways in the morning. Even going back 10 years ago there are more cars on the roads! Not to mention there has been a lot of investment into the railways with electrification works being introduced on various lines. The perfect example of that would be the E-G, Cumbernauld and the Whifflet line which has allowed for better services all round the east end and more coaches to increase capacity.

Using buses as a mode of transport will dwindle less and less if better plans aren’t brought in to encourage people from their cars on to the buses. By that I mean more bus lanes, restricted access to cars and taxi’s into the City Centre, discounted travel incentives. I mean WiFi, leather seating and plug sockets on buses is a great improvement straight up. Now we just need tougher structures brought in to place to place to combat congestion and the bigger picture - global warming. Councils have to act tougher.

Looking back to years ago routes like the 4 used be so busy. Now they’ve been cut back. Same with the Cumbernauld services. The reality is showing.

What do we expect?

Glasgow has pursued a car centric policy. Look at all the motorway extensions and development over the last 20 years. Then you have plentiful parking - how many city centre streets have no bus priority but DO have a row of roadside parking spaces?

Also, the LEZ applies to demand Euro VI from 2018 (phased over 5 years) to buses but not to other vehicles until 2022 and for cars it’s Euro IV. So by December, 40% of bus journeys must meet 2015 standards but a car only 2004 standard by 2022.

You’d think that politicians don’t want to upset car drivers... and you’d be right!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Look at London for an example. Glasgow not being anywhere near as big as London albeit but many there don’t drive for the simple purpose - the transport links mean they don’t have to and it’s the easiest mode of transport around the city in many cases (not always can I just add)!

You do realise that London subsidises it’s buses by about £700m a year?

To put that into perspective, Scotland (not Glasgow) between 2006 and 2016 paid out £2.6bn.

 

[PaulMc7]

You do realise that London subsidises it’s buses by about £700m a year?

To put that into perspective, Scotland (not Glasgow) between 2006 and 2016 paid out £2.6bn.

Given the fact London is double the size of Scotland it wouldn't need as much. It really does need something though. Would say around 150/200 million each year for Glasgow alone granted for that to happen the UK government would need to give the Scottish government far more money so other areas aren't losing out or Scotland needs to go independent

 

[ScotRail158725]

Given the fact London is double the size of Scotland

think you mean Glasgow lol, pretty sure London doesnt even reach 1/10 the size of scotland

 

[PaulMc7]

think you mean Glasgow lol, pretty sure London doesnt even reach 1/10 the size of scotland

Meant in terms of population lol. Most recent info I could find for London population was 8.7 million mid 2016. Still over 3 million more than Scotland's population

 

[andy257]

people from robroyston can get mcgills 72 every hour on a sunday into city centre,or later can get first 8a into barmulloch at ryehill road then service 57 into city centre

 

[PaulMc7]

people from robroyston can get mcgills 72 every hour on a sunday into city centre,or later can get first 8a into barmulloch at ryehill road then service 57 into city centre

72 doesn't run on a Sunday and if you needed it early on a Sunday the 8A isn't really good enough as it is unless SPT added 2/3 journeys into it for First to run. The 8A has also been extremely quiet for as long as I can remember. Also means there would be 1 bus an hour from the city centre through Royston and Provanmill unless they improve that part of the 19 too

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Given the fact London is double the size of Scotland it wouldn't need as much. It really does need something though. Would say around 150/200 million each year for Glasgow alone granted for that to happen the UK government would need to give the Scottish government far more money so other areas aren't losing out or Scotland needs to go independent

Well, seeing as Scotland as a whole pays <£250m pa, that sort of sum is unlikely.

Also, there’s a greater population density and people use buses for shorter journeys in London. The costs to support something similar in Glasgow would be higher.

 

[PaulMc7]

Well, seeing as Scotland as a whole pays <£250m pa, that sort of sum is unlikely.

Also, there’s a greater population density and people use buses for shorter journeys in London. The costs to support something similar in Glasgow would be higher.

Yeah definitely and that's why I think we will be stuck with the same car favouring city for quite some time yet