Flexible Rail Season Tickets - 2/3 days per week to be introduced by June 2021

[kristiang85]

That's because the cost of providing capacity just for the peaks is that much more than providing an off-peak service all day. Simple economics.

Oh I know. But if commuters become more savvy, especially with flexible working, and peaks end up being empty though because nobody sees the value in it and they don't have to commute at that time everyday, then the economics change.

 

[Haywain]

I must say I'm quite disappointed. The cost per journey of the flexi ticket for my route is more than double than what I pay for going off peak + Gold card. So looks like I'll just commute off peak then (luckily my work will be OK with that).

It was never going to offer a better deal than that.

 

[AM9]

Oh I know. But if commuters become more savvy, especially with flexible working, and peaks end up being empty though because nobody sees the value in it and they don't have to commute at that time everyday, then the economics change.

That's good because at the moment, season ticket travellers (particularly those with annual seasons) are subsidised, partly by the public purse and partly by off-peak travellers.

 

[Cdd89]

As expected it doesn’t appear to be offered on any flows entirely within Greater London (that I could find!). The breakeven point for single zonal fares is such that it was never going to complete.

I wonder if not throwing in weekend travel on the line will prove to be a mistake. It would mean the per day cost can be billed as less and would act as a selling point on top of the small daily discount. Legacy “nominated day” part time seasons do this?

 

[kristiang85]

It was never going to offer a better deal than that.

The annual season tickets I used to buy meant a daily cost of commuting at peak times around 52% of the full peak cost on my route; that's good value. So I would have expected the flexi option to be around 75%, but instead it is 90%.

I don't really see a high take up; it is a carnet with a new name.

 

[AM9]

The annual season tickets I used to buy meant a daily cost of commuting at peak times around 52% of the full peak cost on my route; that's good value. So I would have expected the flexi option to be around 75%, but instead it is 90%.

I don't really see a high take up; it is a carnet with a new name.

In time its price and that of regular season tickets may be incrementally adjusted towards each other until the annual season can be dropped.

 

[Cdd89]

There is a small niche that will get immense value from this, which is those taking more than two single journeys in each direction in a day, but who do this irregularly.

This could be beneficial even if it’s a one off, as a flexi season could be purchased, used heavily for a day, and then 7 passes refunded minus the £10 admin fee.

 

[mmh]

That's good because at the moment, season ticket travellers (particularly those with annual seasons) are subsidised, partly by the public purse and partly by off-peak travellers.

All travellers are subsidised.

 

[Haywain]

From the RDG staff brief, answers to a couple of points raised:

As expected it doesn’t appear to be offered on any flows entirely within Greater London

"Flexi Season tickets are not available for journeys entirely within the London Fare Zones Area"

how could a ticket to Bootle not be valid on Merseyrail?

"Flexi Season tickets are also not available on rail journeys entirely within the Scotrail network, the Transport for Wales network and the MerseyRail travel area."

 

[island]

That's not what operators like TPE are saying:

Right, I had not seen that part previously.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

There is a small niche that will get immense value from this, which is those taking more than two single journeys in each direction in a day, but who do this irregularly.

That niche is so small an ant would have trouble fitting into it.

 

[benk1342]

I don't really see a high take up; it is a carnet with a new name.

It is a carnet with a new name, worse price and less flexibility.

But it's on a smart card - hooray!

 

[8rwg]

I don't believe this has it's own thread yet.

Flexible rail season tickets will be offered

The flexible season tickets can be used for two or three days per week to fit with a phased return to full time office working - and are set to save commuters several hundreds of pounds.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I suspect the following outcomes may result (based on 7day tickets):
- TOCs will see a significant reduction in people paying full price for 7day/week+ season tickets (compared to pre-covid).
- People who were too far away to commute a 5day week may accept longer journeys but only commute a 2day or 3day week.
- People who used to only commute 2/3 days a week by car and baulked at the price of 7day/week+ rail season tickets, may now choose to travel by rail.
- I suspect the price point for a 2of7 ticket will be approximately 45% of a 7day ticket and a 3of7 ticket around 65% of a 7day ticket.

This type of ticket has been requested for many years and it will finally become a reality this year. I'm interested to see how it will be implemented and what price points are offered.

I actually can’t believe how they managed to mess this up.
The new ticket works out worse value and less flexible than the existing carnets they have on TL/GN, and way way worse value if someone travelled off peak in one direction cos they chose to get rid of the peak time carnets. Smh

 

[mmh]

There is a small niche that will get immense value from this, which is those taking more than two single journeys in each direction in a day, but who do this irregularly.

This could be beneficial even if it’s a one off, as a flexi season could be purchased, used heavily for a day, and then 7 passes refunded minus the £10 admin fee.

I do that, but I'm unsure this will be better value than daily tickets which allow break of journey. Unfortunately nothing about flexi seasons on the TFW website as yet.

 

[8rwg]

Strikes me as a gimmick, and it'd be better to just reduce commuter-line Anytime fares to maybe about 50-66% of what they currently are.

100%

they’re trying to encourage people back with gimmicks like this new ticket - but happy to raise the price above inflation in March....

 

[Kite159]

I've found a flexible season ticket but the price must be a mistake. Not saying which two stations out in public in case it gets corrected

£142 compared to £77 for an anytime day return. Weekly is £138

 

[8rwg]

I work in a ticket office. I’m sure the info is online somewhere but it’ll be on smart card only

 

[Wallsendmag]

Yes, you aren't limited to getting one per 28 days.

Be very careful with this ,the advice is to only buy a second after you've all of the existing day passes.

I work in a ticket office. I’m sure the info is online somewhere but it’ll be on smart card only

Not always, both barcode and Smartcard had to be enabled for 90% of the flows

 

[Haywain]

Unfortunately nothing about flexi seasons on the TFW website as yet.

That will be because:

Flexi Season tickets are also not available on rail journeys entirely within ... the Transport for Wales network

 

[8rwg]

Be very careful with this ,the advice is to only buy a second after you've all of the existing day passes.


Not always, both barcode and Smartcard had to be enabled for 90% of the flows

Yes - I believe some vendors will offer it as a mobile ticket too - just no paper :/

 

[mmh]

That will be because:

"Flexi Season tickets are also not available on rail journeys entirely within ... the Transport for Wales network"

That's annoying. At least it means the "Multiflex" e-carnet thing won't be going away, but I was hoping to avoid using that. I much prefer using a smartcard to a phone.

 

[AM9]

All travellers are subsidised.

It depends on which line and service, but all annual seasons are particularly heavily subsidised usually to around the cost of an off-peak ticket for the same route.

 

[Meerkat]

I am rather surprised that so many people expected the flexi ticket to be cheap, and that people try to work out what the price will be by what is ‘good value’.
How much subsidy do commuters want?! It seems they want the full bulk discount without buying in bulk.

 

[Blurb]

When purchasing a flexible season ticket it’s still necessary to consider split ticketing to get best value (might be stating the obvious here). The same split ticket opportunities seem to exist and the savings from these may well exceed those from the flexible season ticket itself.

 

[Alex C.]

Looking at Twitter, Reddit and the stories now emerging from news outlets I've yet to see a positive comment about the tickets - I'm not quite sure how the DfT expected them to go down...

 

[Starmill]

You are reading it correctly. Perhaps this will start to get people realising just how cheap an annual season ticket is.

Or rather how cheap in relative terms to other types of tickets for the same journey.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes - I believe some vendors will offer it as a mobile ticket too - just no paper :/

Given the hassle people have had with paper carnets, I'm glad it is not. The only way to do paper tickets of that kind properly is to have stamping machines, which would be a huge cost for a minority of users.

I am rather surprised that so many people expected the flexi ticket to be cheap, and that people try to work out what the price will be by what is ‘good value’.
How much subsidy do commuters want?! It seems they want the full bulk discount without buying in bulk.

It is a different type of buying in bulk, but it is still buying in bulk.

 

[35B]

I am rather surprised that so many people expected the flexi ticket to be cheap, and that people try to work out what the price will be by what is ‘good value’.
How much subsidy do commuters want?! It seems they want the full bulk discount without buying in bulk.

When season tickets are such a large cost for many people, the surprise would be if they didn't.

 

[benk1342]

I am rather surprised that so many people expected the flexi ticket to be cheap, and that people try to work out what the price will be by what is ‘good value’.
How much subsidy do commuters want?! It seems they want the full bulk discount without buying in bulk.

All I wanted was for it not to be MORE EXPENSIVE than the carnets which have now been withdrawn. This is a bit ridiculous.

 

[Starmill]

That's good because at the moment, season ticket travellers (particularly those with annual seasons) are subsidised, partly by the public purse and partly by off-peak travellers.

This rather assumes that there are some reasonable cost savings to be had in the near future. I'm of the view that such cost savings are absolutely paramount, but the industry doesn't appear to have made much of a start in the 15 or so months we've already had and they will probably practically be very challenging to realise.