GOT CAUGHT USING 11-15 OYSTER. HELP!!

[Fermiboson]

2) Nobody will be interested in taking into account medical issues arising as a result of getting caught - only pre-existing conditions.

Also slightly off topic, but courts do take it as a mitigating circumstance (the reasoning being that the suffering of the defendant already forms part of the punishment/deterrent). You are right that TfL probably won't care, though.

 

[WesternLancer]

UPDATE: my sibling has recieved a letter from tfl in which they are stating that he/she willingly gave her oyster to me. but this is untrue.
he/she is 12 years old and genuinely had no idea i took it.
they want to hear their side of the story to then decide to revoke their oyster. any advice? i am panicking

I think this is why early on in the thread people advised you to discuss it with family IIRC

 

[Fermiboson]

I don't think that's correct. Why would they bother revoking it if you could just immediately apply for another one?

If withdrawn I believe TfL would then inform the person if/when they would be able to regain the pass.

They would revoke to invalidate the existing physical pass that had been misused, and the eligible person can then apply for a new pass. But I do agree there is no absolute obligation on the part of TfL to allow that.

 

[r4miii]

More experienced members will be along shortly, but as I understand, TfL policy will be to revoke Oysters misused in such a manner. This is not a massive deal, and they won't prosecute your sibling or anything drastic. Your sibling will be able to ask for a reissue of the 11-15 card as they are still eligible no matter what happens. An honest answer by them stating they were not aware of your misuse should be fine.

they said we can apply for one though. and we did , and in the letter their now saying we wont be refunded for the amount we paid. so i do not see why they gave us the green light to say it hasn't been blocked.

also what is my sibling actually meant to say? i do not think it will be sufficient for them to apologise and state honestly they did not know

i did though

I think this is why early on in the thread people advised you to discuss it with family IIRC

 

[skyhigh]

They would revoke to invalidate the existing physical pass that had been misused, and the eligible person can then apply for a new pass. But I do agree there is no absolute obligation on the part of TfL to allow that.

The T&C's of the pass make it clear that if the pass is withdrawn due to misuse, they will either ban the user from getting another or apply a 'sanction' and only reissue a pass when that has expired.

they said we can apply for one though. and we did , and in the letter their now saying we wont be refunded for the amount we paid. so i do not see why they gave us the green light to say it hasn't been blocked.

I suspect they have discovered some kind of evidence that makes them believe both of you were using the pass at various times, i.e. it was being shared rather than you having taken it.

 

[r4miii]

I don't think that's correct. Why would they bother revoking it if you could just immediately apply for another one?

If withdrawn I believe TfL would then inform the person if/when they would be able to regain the pass.

they told us we can apply for it. which we did. now they sent a letter saying you wont be refunded and need to hear anything you need to say so we think to revoke your card or not

 

[Fermiboson]

they said we can apply for one though. and we did , and in the letter their now saying we wont be refunded for the amount we paid. so i do not see why they gave us the green light to say it hasn't been blocked.

also what is my sibling actually meant to say? i do not think it will be sufficient for them to apologise and state honestly they did not know

It may be useful for forum members to see the (redacted as usual) letter from TfL. I can't imagine that they would be attemping to pursue any consequences for your sibling.

They asked your sibling for what they knew, and what they knew was that they didn't know. So all one can say is that they didn't know. They asked for honesty, and that is (assuming) the honest story, so it very much is sufficient.

It may also be useful to sit down for a bit, take a drink and clear your head.

 

[r4miii]

The T&C's of the pass make it clear that if the pass is withdrawn due to misuse, they will either ban the user from getting another or apply a 'sanction' and only reissue a pass when that has expired.

I suspect they have discovered some kind of evidence that makes them believe both of you were using the pass at various times, i.e. it was being shared rather than you having taken it.

regardless if i used it, my sibling doesnt know when i would have taken it either way. i dont know if im making sense

 

[skyhigh]

they told us we can apply for it. which we did. now they sent a letter saying you wont be refunded and need to hear anything you need to say so we think to revoke your card or not

How did they tell you? Was it in writing or verbally?

 

[r4miii]

It may be useful for forum members to see the (redacted as usual) letter from TfL. I can't imagine that they would be attemping to pursue any consequences for your sibling.

They asked your sibling for what they knew, and what they knew was that they didn't know. So all one can say is that they didn't know. They asked for honesty, and that is (assuming) the honest story, so it very much is sufficient.

It may also be useful to sit down for a bit, take a drink and clear your head.

but will it be enough for them to just say they didnt know?
i will attach the letter very shortly

 

[skyhigh]

but will it be enough for them to just say they didnt know?
i will attach the letter very shortly

Realistically that's all that can be said.

 

[Fermiboson]

but will it be enough for them to just say they didnt know?
i will attach the letter very shortly

To put it another way, what else can they say? Promise to put it in a high security safe with a one time pad only they have access to?

There was no misconduct on the part of your sibling, so their reply should truthfully state that there was no misconduct on their part. I don't know if an additional letter from you would do anything; indeed I doubt they would read it at all. But there is, quite literally, nothing your sibling can honestly tell TfL except: 1. apology for not properly securing the pass and 2. state that they had no knowledge of misconduct, and had not engaged in any misconduct themselves.

 

[r4miii]

j

To put it another way, what else can they say? Promise to put it in a high security safe with a one time pad only they have access to?

There was no misconduct on the part of your sibling, so their reply should truthfully state that there was no misconduct on their part. I don't know if an additional letter from you would do anything; indeed I doubt they would read it at all. But there is, quite literally, nothing your sibling can honestly tell TfL except: 1. apology for not properly securing the pass and 2. state that they had no knowledge of misconduct, and had not engaged in any misconduct themselves.

agreed. do you suggest they get help with the letter? they are 12 so not sure if it will be well constructed but then again it should be as real as possible

 

[skyhigh]

j

agreed. do you suggest they get help with the letter? they are 12 so not sure if it will be well constructed but then again it should be as real as possible

Are your parents/guardians aware of what is happening?

I would suggest that a suitable letter from them would probably have the most sway with TfL.

 

[AlterEgo]

j

agreed. do you suggest they get help with the letter? they are 12 so not sure if it will be well constructed but then again it should be as real as possible

Your sibling should not respond to the letter, but rather their parent or guardian.

DO NOT get your 12 year old sibling to respond to correspondence which is potentially alleging a criminal offence.

 

[r4miii]

Are your parents/guardians aware of what is happening?

I would suggest that a suitable letter from them would probably have the most sway with TfL.

i was told the letter would be sent to my parents as they opened their oyster account. but they didnt send it to them. shall i ask iAP

Your sibling should not respond to the letter, but rather their parent or guardian.

DO NOT get your 12 year old sibling to respond to correspondence which is potentially alleging a criminal offence.

I see, they have not made it clear in the letter. Once again should it be typed

 

[skyhigh]

i was told the letter would be sent to my parents as they opened their oyster account. but they didnt send it to them. shall i ask iAP

What's iAP?

Do you parents know any of what is happening?

 

[AlterEgo]

Also slightly off topic, but courts do take it as a mitigating circumstance (the reasoning being that the suffering of the defendant already forms part of the punishment/deterrent). You are right that TfL probably won't care, though.

It will make no difference to the level of fine for a strict liability Bylaw offence in question here, which is based on the OP's income, and the endless pettifogging in the thread about the OP's mental health conditions hasn't really been helpful.

I see, they have not made it clear in the letter. Once again should it be typed

Their parent or guardian should type the letter if they can.

You should certainly not respond on your sibling's behalf unless you are their legal guardian, nor should your sibling respond themselves.

 

[r4miii]

It will make no difference to the level of fine for a strict liability Bylaw offence in question here, which is based on the OP's income, and the endless pettifogging in the thread about the OP's mental health conditions hasn't really been helpful.


Their parent or guardian should type the letter if they can.

You should certainly not respond on your sibling's behalf unless you are their legal guardian, nor should your sibling respond themselves.

sorry i made a mistake, it is for parent and guarding.

i certainly would never respond on my siblings behalf and that is incorrect

It will make no difference to the level of fine for a strict liability Bylaw offence in question here, which is based on the OP's income, and the endless pettifogging in the thread about the OP's mental health conditions hasn't really been helpful.


Their parent or guardian should type the letter if they can.

You should certainly not respond on your sibling's behalf unless you are their legal guardian, nor should your sibling respond themselves.

what if i dont have a job? how will they determine the fine.
also any idea roughly how long they will reply to my letter in

What's iAP?

Do you parents know any of what is happening?

iAP is the people who tfl fowards the case to

 

[skyhigh]

iAP is the people who tfl fowards the case to

No, don't ask them for advice.

Do I take it your parents don't know the situation?

 

[r4miii]

No, don't ask them for advice.

Do I take it your parents don't know the situation?

they do. my parents said they will write the following... well type up;

-my sibling was not aware of it
-my sibling and they apologise the oyster was not kept in a more secure place
-they discussed with us the seriousness of this situation, and can assure them it will never happen again

what else can they say

 

[AlterEgo]

they do. my parents said they will write the following... well type up;

-my sibling was not aware of it
-my sibling and they apologise the oyster was not kept in a more secure place
-they discussed with us the seriousness of this situation, and can assure them it will never happen again

what else can they say

That is probably the best thing they could say, although nobody would really expect an Oyster to be kept in a "secure" place. They generally live in wallets and purses at home, not under lock and key, because nobody expects their own family to steal or misuse their passes. They should also close with a request for the pass to be returned or reissued if that is what they want.

 

[r4miii]

That is probably the best thing they could say, although nobody would really expect an Oyster to be kept in a "secure" place. They generally live in wallets and purses at home, not under lock and key, because nobody expects their own family to steal or misuse their passes. They should also close with a request for the pass to be returned or reissued if that is what they want.

what would the best wording for that be? sorry my parents have not got the knowledge of top level english haha

 

[AlterEgo]

what would the best wording for that be? sorry my parents have not got the knowledge of top level english haha

Ask them to draft a response, and post it here - and then members can suggest any amendments.

 

[r4miii]

Ask them to draft a response, and post it here - and then members can suggest any amendments.

will do thanks

heres the letter they sent. do i need to cover anything else

 

[simonw]

will do thanks

heres the letter they sent. do i need to cover anything else

So your sibling hasn't received a letter, your parents have received a letter - it's addressed to them not your sibling and it is for the parents to answer.

 

[JBuchananGB]

It is surely inappropriate that the offender who stole the photo card should be the one preparing the response to explain the theft!

 

[r4miii]

So your sibling hasn't received a letter, your parents have received a letter - it's addressed to them not your sibling and it is for the parents to answer.

yes i said i realised i made a mistake about thinking it was to my sibling

It is surely inappropriate that the offender who stole the photo card should be the one preparing the response to explain the theft!

what...?

 

[AlterEgo]

It is surely inappropriate that the offender who stole the photo card should be the one preparing the response to explain the theft!

Of course it is, which is why the parent or guardian needs to write back.

 

[r4miii]

will update you over the next few days with draft

DRAFT, opinions?



Dear Transport for London,

I am writing to address an incident involving the misuse of my younger **** Oyster card. I recently received a letter from the IAP regarding this matter and I appreciate the opportunity to provide my input.

I want to express my sincere apologies for the misuse of the Oyster card by our elder ****. It was never our intention for such an incident to occur, and we deeply regret any inconvenience or concern it may have caused.

At the time, my elder ****, who typically relies on her bank card for TFL payments, fell victim to a scam, rendering her unable to use her bank card for transportation expenses. Consequently, resorting to using ****** Oyster card, albeit without our knowledge or consent.

Since the incident, we have taken significant steps to address the situation and prevent its recurrence. We have engaged in thorough discussions with both of our ****, emphasising the severe repercussions of misusing someone else's Oyster card. Furthermore, I have personally purchased a specialised cardholder for my younger ****** to securely store all *** cards, including ** Oyster card, to prevent any future mishaps occurring to *** maybe next time.

I want to reassure you that we do not condone or tolerate the misuse of transportation cards under any circumstances. We fullythe TFL system and adhee to its regulations. Rest asured, we have taken this incident seriously, and I can confidently affirm that such misconduct will never recur.

I humbly request your understanding and leniency in this matter. I kindly ask that you refrain from revoking my younger **** Oyster card privileges, as I assure you that *** was not complicit in this incident, and both of my *** have learned valuable lessons from this experience. Main use of the card from *** would be to go to and from school and home. We used to have car share arranged for ***** unfortunately it was straining our financial capability. Hence TfL transport would be *** only mode of transport.

I appreciate your consideration of our circumstances.

Warm regards