Great Western Electrification Progress

[jyte]

There's a big taxi rank and stuff on an access road above p12-14, so I would assume there?

There's a height restriction on the entrance to that, so unless they're using coaches they won't fit.

Then again, they probably are. When I think of 'busses' I think of full sized double decker London ones!

 

[spark001uk]

There's a height restriction on the entrance to that, so unless they're using coaches they won't fit.

Then again, they probably are. When I think of 'busses' I think of full sized double decker London ones!

They probably will be using coaches yes. Quite nice ones iirc, if they use the same company as when the Reading to Oxford blockade was on when I went on one.

 

[itfcfan]

There's a big taxi rank and stuff on an access road above p12-14, so I would assume there?

It's quite tight turning even a taxi/minicab there, so I think it's unlikely that area could be used for coaches/buses.

 

[jyte]

It's quite tight turning even a taxi/minicab there, so I think it's unlikely that area could be used for coaches/buses.

They could run them down into the back of the station by Praed street.

Pic if anyone doesn't know what I mean.

 

[alxndr]

There's piling completed/in progress all the way from South Marston through Swindon station. Not sure if it's all the way through, can't say I paid all that much attention, but certainly to at least Rushy Platt (97m, roughly the end of the Up Relief). There's also some masts up around Rushy Platt.

There's also masts up on Dauntsey bank (87m -ish I think) but I can't remember how far they stretch in either direction.

Piling has happened at Christian Malford too (89m 25c), and I think also some masts, but again I can't be certain on that, for how far they stretch.

Piling, at least, also at Newbury/Newbury Racecourse.

Now that there's a clearer way of telling what's been reported and what hasn't I'll try and pay more attention when I'm out and about. I've also had the standard railway neighbour warning of masts being erected in Swindon (from the Dockle Farmhouse to the designer outlet, which is roughly 75m 63c—77m 50c) over the up and coming months, but I think my partner's thrown out the letter so I don't known specific dates or certain mileages, and haven't yet seen any signs of it.

Also, small spelling mistake on Bourton crossovers. Might be able to confirm the state of Bourton later if no one's got there first.

 

[Sean Emmett]

There has also been piling in the Keynsham area and IIRC works to lower track under various bridges were due to take place during the April platform works at Bath. Is this still going ahead?

 

[D1009]

They could run them down into the back of the station by Praed street.

Pic if anyone doesn't know what I mean.

That would involve reversing from Praed Street which would cause traffic congestion, but I suppose nothing different from other large vehicles manouevring there.

 

[HowardGWR]

There has also been piling in the Keynsham area and IIRC works to lower track under various bridges were due to take place during the April platform works at Bath. Is this still going ahead?

Now that is interesting (see bold). If so, that would mean that there is no loss of commitment to 'finishing the job'. So it seems they 'have the tools', ie the go-ahead, if you follow my Churchillian reference.

 

[Melancholia]

Sorry for going slightly off topic, but how do rail replacement buses access Paddington Station; where do they park?

Previous replacement buses/coaches picked up/dropped off passengers on London Street.

 

[Mikey C]

They could run them down into the back of the station by Praed street.

Pic if anyone doesn't know what I mean.

There's something really weird about that photo on front left!

I imagine that entrance is kept clear for emergency use?

 

[Chris125]

Please excuse my ignorance so don't all shout back as I am not a railway or electrical engineer. Am I wrong or has no attempt been made to pre-assemble much of the steel work to the top of the masts before installation or is this not physically possible ? I would have thought that some stretches needed very similar installations leaving only bespoke formats around stations and bridges. Just seems a way of avoiding constant visits to the same place to pile, then put the masts up then visit again to put up the hangers ( or whatever the technical term is) before adding the wiring. Thanks.

There is a lot of logistics involved, I doubt putting up masts with more steelwork attacked would be worthwhile as they would be more awkward and fragile to transport.

 

[SwindonBert]

There's piling completed/in progress all the way from South Marston through Swindon station. Not sure if it's all the way through, can't say I paid all that much attention, but certainly to at least Rushy Platt (97m, roughly the end of the Up Relief). There's also some masts up around Rushy Platt.

There's also masts up on Dauntsey bank (87m -ish I think) but I can't remember how far they stretch in either direction.

Piling has happened at Christian Malford too (89m 25c), and I think also some masts, but again I can't be certain on that, for how far they stretch.

Piling, at least, also at Newbury/Newbury Racecourse.

Now that there's a clearer way of telling what's been reported and what hasn't I'll try and pay more attention when I'm out and about. I've also had the standard railway neighbour warning of masts being erected in Swindon (from the Dockle Farmhouse to the designer outlet, which is roughly 75m 63c—77m 50c) over the up and coming months, but I think my partner's thrown out the letter so I don't known specific dates or certain mileages, and haven't yet seen any signs of it.

Also, small spelling mistake on Bourton crossovers. Might be able to confirm the state of Bourton later if no one's got there first.

Closing the line at Swindon 27 to 29 May and 10 to 11 June, so guess this will happen then

 

[Peter Mugridge]

There's something really weird about that photo on front left!

I imagine that entrance is kept clear for emergency use?

There's lots of mashed images like that on Streetview, just not normally that obvious!


As to the entrance - yes, it is the main emergency access to the concourse, also used for maintenance access.

 

[steverailer]

Please excuse my ignorance so don't all shout back as I am not a railway or electrical engineer. Am I wrong or has no attempt been made to pre-assemble much of the steel work to the top of the masts before installation or is this not physically possible ? I would have thought that some stretches needed very similar installations leaving only bespoke formats around stations and bridges. Just seems a way of avoiding constant visits to the same place to pile, then put the masts up then visit again to put up the hangers ( or whatever the technical term is) before adding the wiring. Thanks.

Various reasons, difficult to get them to the location, and weight are the main 2. A fully dressed mono boom for a standard 4 track location would weigh iro 15 tons. The ones around Didcot would have been iro 22ton. Getting a crane in and set in the right location to lift that weight would need a hell of a lot of planning, plus another would be needed at the loading point as the current method of forklift loading wouldn't work. Add in ballancing the built up boom on a trailer would be difficult as the drop tubes can extend upto 2m below the boom.

Much easier to lift it up in pieces as the crane operators can assess the crane location on the night to get within the lifting radius (lighter the load the bigger the range you have so can adjust for catch pits, services ect) To lift fully assembled would need a specific visit and plan for each location before any lifting has even taken place.

Another point is that you would only need the big cranes in for the mono's and some mid point's, the rest can be done with the normal rail cranes. These take much less time to set up at each location. An example is in a normal Saturday night on the Didcot section the usual planning was 2 mono booms for the big crane and 5 Q booms for the normal crane. This was mainly down to the set up and de rig times required for the lift weight.

In total hours terms per loaction each mono boom probably requires about an entire shift to complete from piling to completly dressed ready for wire.

 

[swt_passenger]

Please excuse my ignorance so don't all shout back as I am not a railway or electrical engineer. Am I wrong or has no attempt been made to pre-assemble much of the steel work to the top of the masts before installation or is this not physically possible ?

To add to previous replies, the masts that support the cantilevers come pre-installed with the brackets that the cantilevers are 'hooked' onto, and they allow for a certain amount of flexibility in vertical positioning. Sketch below is from the Furrer and Frey series 1 pamphlet. https://www.furrerfrey.ch/en/systems/Series-1.html

Likewise the masts at the end of tension lengths that need back stays (where the spring tensioners are fitted) are installed with all the additional brackets in place on the side facing along the track.

So there is some degree of prefabrication going on.

 

[NickBucks]

Thank you fellow posters for the responses to my query.

 

[alxndr]

Looks like the majority of masts are up from Knighton (69m) to just past where the A420 goes underneath the railway (73m 60c) east of South Marston, although there are a few missing.

From that point there were some piles in place, although I could see a few from the road that were still waiting to go in.

Closing the line at Swindon 27 to 29 May and 10 to 11 June, so guess this will happen then

Could well be. I thought it was sooner than that though, there was a list of about 7 dates, and I know one was the end of February. Doesn't necessarily mean they'll be able to do it, or complete it in those periods though.

 

[swt_passenger]

Now that is interesting (see bold). If so, that would mean that there is no loss of commitment to 'finishing the job'. So it seems they 'have the tools', ie the go-ahead, if you follow my Churchillian reference.

It has seemed so for a while, IMHO. There are plenty of posts about work continuing in areas where electrification has already been summarily cancelled by the prophets of doom...

 

[HowardGWR]

It has seemed so for a while, IMHO. There are plenty of posts about work continuing in areas where electrification has already been summarily cancelled by the prophets of doom...

I just imagine that if one looks at the phasing, it really can't be faulted, ignoring the cost overrun and longer time to complete. It would always be sensible to rewire the line to Swindon before stretching further and Newbury too, given the opportunity to give commuters the new 387 stock. It would have included Oxford, but it's just sensible to await the station rebuild (and even the possible extension to Cowley, if that means civils work). As there is now an alternative route to London, Chiltern and GW can run via the GC when the Didcot to Oxford wiring update demands possessions.

Going forward from Swindon, the Cardiff line was always the best to begin first, given that Bristol can be reached with bi-modes and these are the two biggest long distance markets.

With the rebuilding of Bristol TM and re-quadrupling of Filton Bank, it was always sensible to await those completions before re-wiring them, same as Oxford.

Finally, the Bath route can again benefit from bi-modes until wiring is completed on that stretch and the Badminton route is then available for all-electric diversions from Bristol, as indeed is ones via Bath able to use the Westbury route if need be. Only Chippenham needs some special treatment, presumably express buses, both east to Swindon and west to Bath?

Meanwhile the 387s and 345s introductions have enabled the other areas to benefit from 15x and 14x replacements by 16xs.

I can't see a logical error here, and I don't see the programme faltering now, as the benefits are there, awaiting realisation.

See any mistakes in thinking in the above, anyone?

 

[PhilipW]

One logical error to the above (in my humble opinion at least) is not agreeing to extend the electrification the relatively easy 14 miles from Newbury to Bedwyn resulting in that residents of Kintbury, Hungerford and Bedwyn with now have to take a diesel shuttle to Newbury and change there.

 

[coppercapped]

One logical error to the above (in my humble opinion at least) is not agreeing to extend the electrification the relatively easy 14 miles from Newbury to Bedwyn resulting in that residents of Kintbury, Hungerford and Bedwyn with now have to take a diesel shuttle to Newbury and change there.

But they won't, according to informed sources there will continue to be a through service. That's why GWR is leasing more bi-modes from Eversholt which placed an order for a further 7 sets in August 2016. These will also be used to maintain an Oxford service until the wires are up to Oxford.

 

[HowardGWR]

But they won't, according to informed sources there will continue to be a through service. That's why GWR is leasing more bi-modes from Eversholt which placed an order for a further 7 sets in August 2016. These will also be used to maintain an Oxford service until the wires are up to Oxford.

Besides which, that is an extra issue to this thread which is about progress of what has been agreed.

 

[PhilipW]

But they won't, according to informed sources there will continue to be a through service. That's why GWR is leasing more bi-modes from Eversholt which placed an order for a further 7 sets in August 2016. These will also be used to maintain an Oxford service until the wires are up to Oxford.

True, some West of England semi-fast services will stop at those three stations but I very much doubt that it will be a regular frequency service as today.

With three extra stops, I guess it will add on 10 mins journey time for West of England passengers.

 

[coppercapped]

True, some West of England semi-fast services will stop at those three stations but I very much doubt that it will be a regular frequency service as today.

With three extra stops, I guess it will add on 10 mins journey time for West of England passengers.

If you don't believe what I wrote, then try reading this.

 

[Mikey C]

If you don't believe what I wrote, then try reading this.

The trains are longer than the current turbo fleet and the services to and from Bedwyn will require a small extension of a siding in Bedwyn to be able to operate.

The siding extension requires the diversion of an existing footpath and the rail company and Network Rail are seeking views from Great Bedwyn Parish Council before approaching Wiltshire Council for planning approval.

Six years of wrangling later...

 

[450.emu]

They could run them down into the back of the station by Praed street.

Pic if anyone doesn't know what I mean.

Is that Cousin It from The Addams Family standing next to the security contractor on the left? Trying to figure out the large clump of hair in the photo

 

[PhilipW]

If you don't believe what I wrote, then try reading this.

Thanks for that. I had not seen it before. Good.

Personally I would have thought that electrifying the extra 14 miles would have been a better long term prospect than buying a new fleet of Bi-Modes. Obviously the powers that be think otherwise. So be it.

 

[jyte]

Thanks for that. I had not seen it before. Good.

Personally I would have thought that electrifying the extra 14 miles would have been a better long term prospect than buying a new fleet of Bi-Modes. Obviously the powers that be think otherwise. So be it.

What are the new Bi-Modes?

Has GWR stumped for Porterbrooke's 319 Flex option, are they IEPs or are they a whole new class of train we haven't heard about?

Regarded the 'extra 14 miles', I would be really interested in seeing a Benefit:Cost ratio for extension to Westbury, Frome, the Mendip quarries and Bath for a diversionary route. I suspect the reason they stopped at Newbury is right now it doesn't make any sense to continue, especially at the current inflated prices.

 

[Domh245]

What are the new Bi-Modes?

Has GWR stumped for Porterbrooke's 319 Flex option, are they IEPs or are they a whole new class of train we haven't heard about?

Regarded the 'extra 14 miles', I would be really interested in seeing a Benefit:Cost ratio for extension to Westbury, Frome, the Mendip quarries and Bath for a diversionary route. I suspect the reason they stopped at Newbury is right now it doesn't make any sense to continue, especially at the current inflated prices.

They're the 802s I think. One batch to replace HSTs on services to the South West, and then another for the aforementioned services.

 

[coppercapped]

What are the new Bi-Modes?

Has GWR stumped for Porterbrooke's 319 Flex option, are they IEPs or are they a whole new class of train we haven't heard about?

Regarded the 'extra 14 miles', I would be really interested in seeing a Benefit:Cost ratio for extension to Westbury, Frome, the Mendip quarries and Bath for a diversionary route. I suspect the reason they stopped at Newbury is right now it doesn't make any sense to continue, especially at the current inflated prices.

A couple of years ago the DfT had such an analysis done, predicated on the basis that Bedwyn would be served by a shuttle from Newbury and the longer distance train service remained as it was, that is it would remain operated by HSTs. It concluded that the cost was excessive for the benefits (increased income, possible lower operating costs) as the number of trains only going as far as Westbury was small and there was no benefit in having an electric diversionary route. The quarrymen in the Mendips were also not going to dispose of their reliable Class 59s. If the line was electrified they might buy new electric traction when the Class 59s reach the end of their economic life, but not before.

In the meantime of course GWR has reached leasing deals with Eversholt for extra batches of Class 802 bi-modes and the cost of electrification has increased considerably. Even if the Class 387s ran a semi-fast service between Paddington and Westbury/Frome, spending shedloads of money electrifying from Newbury to Westbury or Frome for one electric train an hour really doesn't make sense. Of course now the West of England trains are going to be bi-modes they could use the wires, but even then there would be only some two or three trains an hour each way. Until the cost of electrification comes down or the trains need more power than the diesels can supply I can't see that stretch being wired in the foreseeable future.