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GWR Class 769 information. (Units no longer with GWR - Off Lease March 23)

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aleggatta

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Because like pdeaves points out, if they are now tri-modes, then they were bi-modes as they left the factory, which is clearly nonsense and contradicts Porterbrook's marketing that they're being turned into bi-modes in the basic 769 form!

Just because you can work something backwards doesn’t mean it’s necessary to, they have three discrete modes of operating, each with its own driving characteristics with its own training requirements. It is still a valid description simply by being the chosen brand by the person supplying the product, Technicality doesn’t come into it. You could quite easily say that all trains have one mode, wheels rolling on a rail, but then you could also say every train has 2 modes, wheels rolling one way and wheels rolling the other. It makes absolutely no difference whether you choose to fight the corner ‘dual voltage bi mode’ or ‘tri mode’.

apologies if this comes across as me being an arse, I just get annoyed with pedantry for the sake of pedantry, if something needs explaining, fine, but it’a a pretty clear description whatever way you say it. Potatoes potatoes
 
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David Goddard

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Why?
Reading to Wokingham?, Ash to Guildford?, Redhill to Gatwick? all are DC And depot to P15 too
Third rail available from Reigate, but not in depot or P15. Passive provision was made so it can be laid through the underpass and into P15 but it wont go into the depot as that's wired anyway, and adding third rail would create additional hazards and require a whole swathe of extra safety training.

I asked the question earlier in this thread, the answer I received was that the third rail supply would be too limited to support the extra usage.
Remember reading this before over the last few years. If this isn't going to be resolved then it kind of renders the third rail capability of these redundant.

plus they can't change over on the move.
With the exception of Ash, all The North Downs services call at each of these stations anyway, so although the middle section couldn't be used, they could changeover to use the end sections if the supply was sufficient.
 

MML

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Let's see how clean the cloth trim on the seats stays. Penny wise, pound foolish.
 

Minstral25

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Third rail available from Reigate, but not in depot or P15. Passive provision was made so it can be laid through the underpass and into P15 but it wont go into the depot as that's wired anyway, and adding third rail would create additional hazards and require a whole swathe of extra safety training.

No, not from Reigate as Network Rail have stated locally there is insufficient power at Reigate to run more than the current Southern services, until the Platform 3 proposed upgrade happens, which includes power upgrade Redhill to Reigate.

Also, currently Network Rail have said there is insufficient power between Redhill and Gatwick. GWR press office recently said they will run on electric as soon as Network Rail will permit it.

Let's see how clean the cloth trim on the seats stays. Penny wise, pound foolish.

Yes, there is a cohort here in Redhill/Reigate areas who are aware these are a big downgrade having happily seen them leave 5 years ago.

Personally, having commuted for years on them to City Thameslink I am not looking forward to them appearing on our local services again, especially as it looks like I'll be using daily again soon.
 

rebmcr

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Porterbrook have decided to brand them as tri more trains, by that nature it is a valid description of the product even if there is room for pedantry on the technicalities of the operating modes of the train. Where is the problem?

It gets on people's nerves because Porterbrook's marketing department are effectively trying to tell people that (for example) they were wrong to not call Class 378s "bi modes" for the last eleven years.

It's less pedantry, and more refusing to accept obvious nonsense.
 

Meerkat

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It gets on people's nerves because Porterbrook's marketing department are effectively trying to tell people that (for example) they were wrong to not call Class 378s "bi modes" for the last eleven years.

It's less pedantry, and more refusing to accept obvious nonsense.
Obvious nonsense is wanting to pedantically use six syllables when two syllables is easier, better differentiated and clearly understood. It doesn't have to be consistent to be logical.
 

rebmcr

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Obvious nonsense is wanting to pedantically use six syllables when two syllables is easier, better differentiated and clearly understood. It doesn't have to be consistent to be logical.

Sorry it's not called 'pedantic' it's called 'zug' because it has fewer syllables. Everyone clearly understands that.
 

northernbelle

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Just because you can work something backwards doesn’t mean it’s necessary to, they have three discrete modes of operating, each with its own driving characteristics with its own training requirements. It is still a valid description simply by being the chosen brand by the person supplying the product, Technicality doesn’t come into it. You could quite easily say that all trains have one mode, wheels rolling on a rail, but then you could also say every train has 2 modes, wheels rolling one way and wheels rolling the other. It makes absolutely no difference whether you choose to fight the corner ‘dual voltage bi mode’ or ‘tri mode’.

apologies if this comes across as me being an arse, I just get annoyed with pedantry for the sake of pedantry, if something needs explaining, fine, but it’a a pretty clear description whatever way you say it. Potatoes potatoes
I think you're right.

However you look at it and whatever terminology you choose, the 769/9s are a 'first' in terms of being able to operate from 3 different power sources - and that is worth marketing.
 

JN114

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I think you're right.

However you look at it and whatever terminology you choose, the 769/9s are a 'first' in terms of being able to operate from 3 different power sources - and that is worth marketing.

By their logic they’re not first - it’s what, 7 power sources on some of the Eurostar e300 (373) sets?
 

James James

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25kV AC OLE (classic), 25kV AC OLE (LGVs inc. HS1), 1500V DC OLE, and 750V DC 3rd Rail (since removed).
Counting 25kV twice... is a bit silly if you ask me. They do support 3kV DC too though, if Wikipedia is to be believed.
 
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Counting 25kV twice... is a bit silly if you ask me. They do support 3kV DC too though, if Wikipedia is to be believed.

It would be a little difficult for a Eurostar to run to Bruxelles Midi without 3kV ;) In the early days, before the Belgian L1 was completed, they ran on 3kV all the way from the French border at Tournai via Ath, or via Mons if they were diverted that way.
 

59CosG95

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It would be a little difficult for a Eurostar to run to Bruxelles Midi without 3kV ;) In the early days, before the Belgian L1 was completed, they ran on 3kV all the way from the French border at Tournai via Ath, or via Mons if they were diverted that way.
Ahh yes, I remember seeing something about that.
And vis-a-vis the different settings for 25kV, the pan stayed the same throughout, but I think it was something related to the in-cab signalling which necessitated different modes on one voltage.
 

Class172

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Ahh yes, I remember seeing something about that.
And vis-a-vis the different settings for 25kV, the pan stayed the same throughout, but I think it was something related to the in-cab signalling which necessitated different modes on one voltage.
I believe it is something like that. In fact I have a feeling there are three modes in the 373s for 25kV: one for HS1, one for the tunnel and the last for the LGV. Happy to be corrected though.
 

Domh245

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I believe it is something like that. In fact I have a feeling there are three modes in the 373s for 25kV: one for HS1, one for the tunnel and the last for the LGV. Happy to be corrected though.

5 in fact: BR Conventional, HS(1), Eurotunnel, (L)GV, and French conventional! Primarily signalling related, but also accounts for changes with the OLE (high reach in ET, flat & level on HS/GV, etc)

 
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Will BR769.9 be used on Paddington - Oxford because of no wires Didcot - Oxford?

Currently BR387.1 from Paddington to Didcot, then BR165.1 from Didcot to Oxford as shuttle Zug.
 
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JonathanH

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Will BR769.9 be used on Paddington - Oxford because of no wires Didcot - Oxford?

Currently BR387.1 from Paddington to Didcot, then BR165.1 from Didcot to Oxford as shuttle Zug.
No, if you read post 364 above they are only going on Basingtoke, North Downs, Henley and Bourne End workings.
 

DorkingMain

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I'll still be amazed if we ever actually see one of these manage a full day in service. The 319s were never brilliant trains to begin with - whilst I can understand the desire to create 3-way bi-modes, more dimensions of course means more complications.

The amount of time these 769s will actually spend on the juice rail (Reading to Wokingham, Wanborough to Guildford, Reigate to Redhill) also makes me wonder if the trimode capability was ever really necessary. Compared to other situations where bimodes are being used (West Coast, Great Western) it makes you wonder if the traction switching will be as seamless as Porterbrook hopes it will be.

Anyway, I'll end my soapbox rant there.
 

big all

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I'll still be amazed if we ever actually see one of these manage a full day in service. The 319s were never brilliant trains to begin with - whilst I can understand the desire to create 3-way bi-modes, more dimensions of course means more complications.

The amount of time these 769s will actually spend on the juice rail (Reading to Wokingham, Wanborough to Guildford, Reigate to Redhill) also makes me wonder if the trimode capability was ever really necessary. Compared to other situations where bimodes are being used (West Coast, Great Western) it makes you wonder if the traction switching will be as seamless as Porterbrook hopes it will be.

Anyway, I'll end my soapbox rant there.
without the ability to change on the move wokingham to reigate is diesel only
 
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