Has the future of GA's class 317/321s been decided?

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by MrPIC, 15 Oct 2019.

  1. MrPIC

    MrPIC Member

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  3. hexagon789

    hexagon789 Established Member

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    I imagine the 317s will go for scrap based on their age, the 321s could go elsewhere potentially.
     
  4. class379

    class379 Member

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    Isn't there some sort plan for the 321's to convert them to hydrogen units?
     
  5. 86246

    86246 Member

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    I might have missed it, but is there a new home for the 379s ?
     
  6. MrPIC

    MrPIC Member

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    Gautrain in SA is what I heard
     
  7. HLE

    HLE Established Member

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    The WAML if rumours on here turn out to be true.
     
  8. Doomotron

    Doomotron Member

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    Highly likely (soemwhat confirmed) to be going to Southern.
     
  9. 87015

    87015 Established Member

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    317/7 desperately wanted by GA for Stansteds is the latest amusing murmur due to Stadler issues, back to the future indeed!!
     
    Last edited: 15 Oct 2019
  10. hexagon789

    hexagon789 Established Member

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    I know Porterbrook developed a working prototype, but I'm not sure of a full scheme is going ahead or not.
     
  11. MrPIC

    MrPIC Member

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    Ha, well at least they've got universal bogs already fitted! Probably don't work anymore though
     
  12. TT-ONR-NRN

    TT-ONR-NRN On Moderation

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    Sorry - when was it confirmed? By who?
     
  13. Doomotron

    Doomotron Member

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    Southern are going to be investing in battery trains for the Marshlink and Uckfield lines; they have been talking with the ROSCO. With 379s soon to be available and Electrostars the preferred type of train (and Southern need more trains anyway), 379s are highly likely.
     
  14. Tobbes

    Tobbes Member

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    Saw a 317 in Manningtree last night around 2000 - very odd (but not unwelcome) sight. Not sure what it was doing over there (I'd just gotten off a delayed IC set), but a new one on me. I presume that they're not replacing the 321s, however much a step up in standard that would be! (I can't be the only one who hates effectively sitting on the floor in an unmodified 321...)
     
  15. sd0733

    sd0733 Established Member

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    There is a booked job on the GE for 317s on a Liverpool Street-Ipswich and return Every day.
     
  16. Tobbes

    Tobbes Member

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    Ah, tyvm - I'd never seen that before. Every day is school day!
     
  17. Bikeman78

    Bikeman78 Member

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    1812 from Liverpool Street and 1950 back up. From the December timetable it will terminate at Colchester.
     
  18. Aictos

    Aictos On Moderation

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    Any idea what subclass of Class 317s are diagrammed? Would it be the nice and comfy Class 317/6s or even the ex GTR ones?
     
  19. fat_boy_pete

    fat_boy_pete Member

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    Also the 7.29 Witham up starter in the mornings. Comes ECS from Ilford I believe.
     
  20. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Established Member

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    379s are mostly likely to stay on GA. There are no known takers for 321s, even the Renatus ones at the moment, in that context it's difficult to see the 317's and most of the 321s surviving the cutter's torch even if conversion to Hydrogen is successful. We're talking about life-expired trains, transfer to other areas will not go down well with the natives.
     
  21. NoMorePacers

    NoMorePacers Member

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    Except none of the 321s are life-expired. That is the problem.
     
  22. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Established Member

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    Oh really. Explain.
     
  23. Aictos

    Aictos On Moderation

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    Well they’re nowhere near as old as the actual life expired trains such as the PEP Class eg 313s, 314s, 315s etc...

    And using them as in the Class 317/321 might actually help the business case for new electrification schemes as the overall cost would be lower.
     
  24. chubs

    chubs Member

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    Except they are though, aren't they? Just because some enthusiasts don't want to face reality isn't a good enough excuse to refurb this junk and make another part of the country suffer for another 20 years.
     
  25. Class 466

    Class 466 Member

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    Far More likely is 379s to GN, then 387s to SN as they've all got shoes already.
     
  26. Class 466

    Class 466 Member

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    The 1617 off LST to Witham is also 8 317
     
  27. NoMorePacers

    NoMorePacers Member

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    If 321s are such life-expired junk, then please explain why ScotRail are keeping such similar units (318s and 320s) in service with no plan to replace them for at least the rest of their franchise. To further that, ScotRail have taken 321s from other operators and put them in service on their network.
     
  28. zn1

    zn1 Member

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    ALL BREL stock was constructed to a main line life expectancy of 40 years, if they kept to their specified coded heavy overhauls, some life extension work they should all easily exceed the design life and should be able to acheive at least 50 years.

    the old way of unit cascading around the country as new fleets were introduced worked perfectly, the units can be given a code 1 or 3 and carry on...

    it is a system that the TOCS and ROSCOS should be doing together to ensure that units work to their contruscted expected life expiry year...ie get the maximum amount of mileage and passenger use out of them,
     
  29. NoMorePacers

    NoMorePacers Member

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    Indeed. I don't think we should be living in such a throwaway society where things that aren't life-expired (or nearer to brand new - see 350/2s and 707s being pointlessly replaced) are just sent to Rotherham for some new stock that might not last half as long.

    But then what does stupid little me know, huh?
     
  30. AC47461

    AC47461 Member

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    I would imagine, though i have no proof, that the Renatus 321s (or at least some of them) will stick around on the GEML / Southend Vic for a while, if nothing other than cover branch diagrams where the 5 car 720s won't fit certain platforms like the bays at Wickford (and that will take years to fix I suspect). I don't know if there are any other short platforms elsewhere (Battlesbridge, Cressing, White Notley perhaps, though they may be long enough for a 5-car 720, maybe the Walton and Harwich branches too?).
     
  31. RailWonderer

    RailWonderer Member

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    Hard to keep this meme free. Dear lord, where to begin. The intention at time of construction is irrelevant. They haven't aged well and anyone who uses them semi-regularly knows this. Same for 317s. LM replaced theirs in the late 2000s, GN a bit later. They form the bulk of the GA fleet unlike Scotrail which in majority runs 380s, 385s and 365s on electric services with modern 170s and well refurbished 158s on the remainder. 317s, 321s creek and rattle to no end, the seating is angled and low and horrific more over 40 minute journeys, thy aren't PRM compliant and the refurbished units are in some ways worse, and the screeching noise can be heard form the inside if too many windows are open meaning you can't even have a conversation. It reminds me of 3rd world transport on a bad day. They were supposed to be replaced years ago had it not been for a succession of short term franchise extensions granted.
     

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