Hull Trains cancellations due to chronic shortage of available rolling stock

[Failed Unit]

Be interesting if HT performance hits LNER / Northern in the survey.

Let’s say the train was cancelled.

Passenger using an LNER service instead. They tick the LNER box as they are now on an LNER service and give their opinion of the service. LNER gets the flak. Same with northern in the other direction.

 

[ainsworth74]

Just a reminder that there is a thread for more talk on the HST that arrived at Hull yesterday. You can find it here.

 

[HowardGWR]

Survey done on trains, therefore high proportion of people surveyed would be happy, especially if infrequent travellers.

I don't see that at all. Passenger Focus carried out the surveys, not the TOCs. The results would be comparable anyway, due to the same method being used across all TOCs. If HT scores 91% and that is held by sceptics to be 'optimistic', it still beats the likes of GWR in the 60s. Chiltern scored mid 90s and that is a good comparator.

 

[robbeech]

But as said, if the surveys are done on the trains then passenger are likely to be happier than say a survey done on a bus at 0120 just leaving Brough.

 

[HullRailMan]

The surveys aren't done on the train as such, they are given out to be completed as and when with a pre paid envelope to post it back. The actual number of replies will be less than the numbers handed out. Clearly they won't be given out to passengers of a rail replacement bus but it could be on a heavily delayed train. But that is the same for all operators.

Looking at the questions on this survey it's all about station and on train facilities. And the HT sample size is larger than the Grand Central one despite them being a larger TOC.

 

[Deafdoggie]

I don't see that at all. Passenger Focus carried out the surveys, not the TOCs. The results would be comparable anyway, due to the same method being used across all TOCs. If HT scores 91% and that is held by sceptics to be 'optimistic', it still beats the likes of GWR in the 60s. Chiltern scored mid 90s and that is a good comparator.

Surveys are only given out on trains for smaller TOCS, otherwise they are usually given out on stations

 

[Failed Unit]

Surveys are only given out on trains for smaller TOCS, otherwise they are usually given out on stations

That is interesting. Had them handed to me at Kings Cross many times. (Along with other main stations).

But if they are handed out in the train it is likely to be positive. You should be commenting on that specific journey. It is running and you are unlikely to be waiting since the previous cancelled service (which happens a lot more on franchised operators).

No good way to do the survey, but small operators do have an advantage.

 

[Deafdoggie]

The reason, is that, of course, handing them out at King cross is unlikely to get you many HT customers, so giving them out on the train, means they know they got HT customers

 

[Bungle965]

Tell you what I could understand the farce that Hull Trains are having with their fleet if they were operating Class 108s!!

Hull Trains has unveiled its new state-of-art train that bosses hope will bring city transportation into a new era.

The open access operator which runs long-distance services from the city to London King’s Cross has come under fire in recent months due to ongoing issues with its current Class 108’s.

https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/new...-news/hull-trains-louise-cheeseman-new-249412
Sam

 

[robbeech]

I couldn’t. They’d be more reliable. Bit steady mind.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

Surveys are only given out on trains for smaller TOCS, otherwise they are usually given out on stations

Really? I’ve had on-train surveys with GWR several times.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

Despite the better part of a decade of commuting, and countless leisure journeys, I've never encountered a Transport Focus survey. By contrast, I've been on the German railways for perhaps twenty journeys in my life, and I had a survey the very last time I was on it (and I have previously seen them doing surveys with other passengers). I suppose it could just be a question of statistics and probability meaning that this is entirely random, but if so, I must just be very unlucky!

 

[Deafdoggie]

Really? I’ve had on-train surveys with GWR several times.

Smaller TOCs are given out on trains so they have a reasonable sample size. Larger TOCs are USUALLY given out at stations, but not exclusively.

 

[SC43090]

Tell you what I could understand the farce that Hull Trains are having with their fleet if they were operating Class 108s!!



https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/new...-news/hull-trains-louise-cheeseman-new-249412
Sam

I look forward to travelling on a class 108 first generation DMU...... I would have thought they would have rattled themselves to bits by now

Also since when as a MK4 DVT 82208 been an HST......


SC43090

 

[robbeech]

Page appears to be gone.

 

[Darandio]

The Hull Daily Mail offices were raided earlier this morning by the incorrect rolling stock police.

 

[jfowkes]

Moved to here: https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/new...news/hull-trains-louise-cheeseman-new-2494124

 

[jon0844]

Moved to here: https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/new...news/hull-trains-louise-cheeseman-new-2494124

"The open access operator which runs long-distance services from the city to London King’s Cross has come under fire in recent months due to ongoing issues with its current Class 180’s."

The above made me chuckle.

"The fact they are bi-modal means that if overhead electric lines were to come down on the East coast, which happens quite often, we can drop the pantograph and return to diesel power and carry on moving."

That's perhaps a little optimistic. In many cases the wires being down will block the lines, and if the wires don't, other trains ahead will.

But in theory it's a benefit.

 

[Failed Unit]

The above made me chuckle.



That's perhaps a little optimistic. In many cases the wires being down will block the lines, and if the wires don't, other trains ahead will.

But in theory it's a benefit.

Do all their drivers sign Doncaster - Lincoln - Sleaford / Newark - Peterborough?

I know they use both routes but not sure if they are piloted.

As you say wires down = no trains. But hopefully they can implement plan B quickly.

 

[jon0844]

It will be nice to see days when Hull Trains are able to avoid problems caused by other operators, rather than the other way around.

Hull Trains have not only caused problems for their own passengers, but have caused untold chaos for everyone else with various train fires. And the cursed 180s have also caused problems for Grand Central, such as the recent incident where a panel fell off and damaged a GTR and LNER train.

I won'd shed a tear when the 180s go - even if they ARE very comfortable to be on.

 

[ricoblade]

Despite the better part of a decade of commuting, and countless leisure journeys, I've never encountered a Transport Focus survey. By contrast, I've been on the German railways for perhaps twenty journeys in my life, and I had a survey the very last time I was on it (and I have previously seen them doing surveys with other passengers). I suppose it could just be a question of statistics and probability meaning that this is entirely random, but if so, I must just be very unlucky!

I've seen them on GNER/EC/Virgin EC/LNER and HT a few times over the years.

 

[Starmill]

Despite the better part of a decade of commuting, and countless leisure journeys, I've never encountered a Transport Focus survey. By contrast, I've been on the German railways for perhaps twenty journeys in my life, and I had a survey the very last time I was on it (and I have previously seen them doing surveys with other passengers). I suppose it could just be a question of statistics and probability meaning that this is entirely random, but if so, I must just be very unlucky!

I was once surveyed on a Northern train on which the guard has incorrectly claimed that my ticket wasn't valid. They relented in the end but I made sure to be nice and balanced when I filled the form in! The most amusing part of that was when the Passenger Focus rep got involved in the dispute!

Most recently I was given one at London Fenchurch Street. I couldn't fill it in though because I only went into the station to use the ticket machine for ToD, and then proceeded to London Underground, and the form specifically says you shouldn't consider them.

 

[duffield]

I look forward to travelling on a class 108 first generation DMU...... I would have thought they would have rattled themselves to bits by now
SC43090

More than 20 still operational at various heritage railways, including my local one, the Ecclesbourne Valley.

 

[sprinterguy]

The dire performance of Hull Trains' class 180 fleet since one unit jettisoned an engine in December 2017 has cost the company £2 million in profits during 2018, as well as passenger goodwill:

https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/business/hull-trains-reveals-lost-millions-2508407.amp

Hull Trains lost £2m in profits in 2018 as its worst ever year was blighted by “catastrophic engine failure” and the Beast from the East.

In newly filed accounts, the operator admitted a train break down in December 2017 – combined with the perishing weather at the start of 2018 – resulted in “one of the most challenging operational periods in the company’s 18-year history.”

In the year ending March 31, 2018, profits at Hull Trains dropped from £5.3m to £2.7m, with more disruption following in late 2018.

Despite returning to full service for summer 2018, two train fires within two days in October – followed by problems to its other two engines – temporarily left the operator unable to put a train on the rails.

 

[westv]

Maybe they should bring back Nectar points.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

The dire performance of Hull Trains' class 180 fleet since one unit jettisoned an engine in December 2017 has cost the company £2 million in profits during 2018, as well as passenger goodwill:

Note that this is until the end of March only - I fear the results for this financial year will be a lot worse, but we won't know until this time next year.

 

[matacaster]

Could they top / tail Class 180 sets with Class 67's?

 

[43096]

Could they top / tail Class 180 sets with Class 67's?

Is that a serious question?

 

[matacaster]

Is that a serious question?

Well, they seem to have serious problems!

I am sure it wouldn't be particularly economic, there may be issues with couplings and they would likely need a driver + second driver with route knowledge. However, since the failures have been repetitive and for a significant period plus customer service seems to have been sadly lacking, perhaps they need to think outside the box?

 

[43096]

Well, they seem to have serious problems!

I am sure it wouldn't be particularly economic, there may be issues with couplings and they would likely need a driver + second driver with route knowledge. However, since the failures have been repetitive and for a significant period plus customer service seems to have been sadly lacking, perhaps they need to think outside the box?

Oh wow. You actually think top’n’tailing 180s with 67s is an option. “Challenges” with top speed, couplers, train supply, crew training, etc etc would take longer to resolve than getting their 802 fleet delivered.

I assume you have missed all the talk of sub-leasing a GWR HST that is actually happening?