Improving Northern's Customer Service

[northwichcat]

I can think of a number of reasons it might be opposed, but for the company I think the biggest one is that they would be worried about the risks it poses. Potentially it's a lot of staff with unrestricted access to the company twitter account, officially or otherwise, at any time.

I would have thought anyone who works on the Twitter feed would have access to it at all times. If not Northern must change the passwords at the end of every shift or not allow the people tweeting to login to the account themselves, which wouldn't be normal ways of working in a digital environment.

I didn't mean the Twitter team would normally work remotely but they could in exceptional circumstances.

 

[Moonshot]

My personal ones:

Connections of the late trains from the Settle Carlisle and Hull lines into the last Hallam line train out of Leeds, arriving a few minutes before and after that train leaves.

The Cumbrian coast line train which gets into Carlisle within the minute the last Carlisle - Leeds train leaves, making travel from Cumbria to Yorkshire difficult.

The Manchester Vic - Huddersfield which is timed to get in five minutes after the last Wakefield connection has left, meaning that I have to further crowd the already overcrowded last train from Leeds.

Probably others but those ones affect me in particular.

Ok so just focusing on the MCV - Hudds.....what impact would that have on other services if it was timed to arrive 10 minutes earlier? I note you have also mentioned trains that are pretty much last ones at night.....but in general would you agree that increased frequencies on every line would lead to better connections automatically ?

 

[ainsworth74]

FWIW, I think the best way to do Twitter well is to have the team either located in, or very closely connected to, the TOC Control.

Like Northern you mean?

 

[hairyhandedfool]

I would have thought anyone who works on the Twitter feed would have access to it at all times. If not Northern must change the passwords at the end of every shift or not allow the people tweeting to login to the account themselves, which wouldn't be normal ways of working in a digital environment.

I didn't mean the Twitter team would normally work remotely but they could in exceptional circumstances.

I don't know how they do it because I am not in that team, for all I know they might change it at the end of the day and leave a note on the desk for the next person.

 

[yorksrob]

Ok so just focusing on the MCV - Hudds.....what impact would that have on other services if it was timed to arrive 10 minutes earlier? I note you have also mentioned trains that are pretty much last ones at night.....but in general would you agree that increased frequencies on every line would lead to better connections automatically ?

Well, the train from Vic takes up a slow path from the west, so there should be a corresponding slow path to the east.

In a way, you hit the nail on the head. Increased frequencies would benefit in some cases, but it's in the evenings when you need a good connection, that the frequencies drop to hourly or worse. All of the examples I've cited are hourly or worse at that time of the day.

 

[pdq]

Another example of timetabling that misses a connection...
From HUD to BTL there is just one train an hour, at around xx:00. The only other option at the moment is the xx:15ish TPE to DEW but with a 20 minute wait there for the stopper to Leeds from Man Vic via Brighouse.

At HUD, the stopper to Wakefield leaves around xx:30, getting to Mirfield at xx:40, just four minutes after the MCV-LDS has gone through. By tweaking either or both of these slightly there could be a quick, easy, same-platform connection at MIR giving a second realistic service from HUD to BTL and Morley.

 

[Moonshot]

Well, the train from Vic takes up a slow path from the west, so there should be a corresponding slow path to the east.

In a way, you hit the nail on the head. Increased frequencies would benefit in some cases, but it's in the evenings when you need a good connection, that the frequencies drop to hourly or worse. All of the examples I've cited are hourly or worse at that time of the day.

Increase frequenices may also lead to an increase in subsidy to support those services however.......and I m not sure there is an appetite for that at stations with low footfall. As always in this industry, trying to solve one issue invariably creates another one elsewhere.

 

[yorksrob]

Increase frequenices may also lead to an increase in subsidy to support those services however.......and I m not sure there is an appetite for that at stations with low footfall. As always in this industry, trying to solve one issue invariably creates another one elsewhere.

This is true, which is why it would be cheaper to time the last Hallam train to leave ten - fifteen minutes later to line up with the infrequent services from Settle and Hull.

The Dales are a major tourist attraction and Hull is a major City, so it's reasonable for people to expect to be able to travel back from there. That's what having a functioning transport system means.

 

[Moonshot]

This is true, which is why it would be cheaper to time the last Hallam train to leave ten - fifteen minutes later to line up with the infrequent services from Settle and Hull.

The Dales are a major tourist attraction and Hull is a major City, so it's reasonable for people to expect to be able to travel back from there. That's what having a functioning transport system means.

I kind of get the idea that the vast majority of passengers wanting connections would be from outlying towns into major stations to connect with intercity services. As always, no matter what we do in the industry , there will always be someone not happy.

 

[yorksrob]

I kind of get the idea that the vast majority of passengers wanting connections would be from outlying towns into major stations to connect with intercity services. As always, no matter what we do in the industry , there will always be someone not happy.

That's quite a simplistic view.

Whilst many local routes feed into IC services, they have a role in enabling people to move around the region as well. WY Metro publishes a network map presumably to promote this aspect of regional rail travel. What's the point of promoting a 'network' if you aren't prepared to offer the most basic network connectivity.

As an example, I use the network almost every day of the year. The vast majority are simple suburb - centre journeys. Probably between ten and twenty a year connect to IC journeys. Far more, I estimate around fifty - seventy connect to the wider regional network.

 

[lejog]

Another example of timetabling that misses a connection...
From HUD to BTL there is just one train an hour, at around xx:00. The only other option at the moment is the xx:15ish TPE to DEW but with a 20 minute wait there for the stopper to Leeds from Man Vic via Brighouse.

At HUD, the stopper to Wakefield leaves around xx:30, getting to Mirfield at xx:40, just four minutes after the MCV-LDS has gone through. By tweaking either or both of these slightly there could be a quick, easy, same-platform connection at MIR giving a second realistic service from HUD to BTL and Morley.

This "tweak" may give Huddersfield to Batley a second tph, but would mean Calder Valley-Wakefield passengers (a route with zero direct trains) losing a quick, easy, same-platform connection at Mirfield and having to wait there nearly an hour for a connection.

 

[pdq]

Fair point

 

[JimmyR]

Some of today's customer service operatives seem to have been told to include a minimum number of standard sentences/paragraphs regardless of whether they are relevant or not. Remarkably, some of the standard responses are not even grammatically correct and seem to have been written and/or approved by people who do not have English as their first language.

>>>>>>

Going back to the OP, if there was an event in Sheffield I would certainly have put my name down. I might still do so as I could get to Leeds easily enough as long as they pay for my travel (which, I note, they do not mention).

Some standard paragraphs aren't "official" or "approved" often advisors will write their own paragraphs and share it with their colleagues at which point no one questions using it and eventually they forget where it even came from in the first place. A lot of advisors wont read what the paragraph says and will just include it based off what it's called.

You'll often hear the question "do you have a paragraph for X?" being passed around.

 

[trainophile]

Has anyone mentioned the frustration of holding on the phone (with appalling repeated "music") for as long as you can bear it, eventually hanging up (my personal best was 25 minutes) because apparently no-one is answering the phones that day?

If they rely on stock paragraphs to respond to queries, it explains why they don't want to have to talk to customers in real time. The sooner they accelerate the necessary improvements, the better for all concerned.

 

[meridian2]

Has anyone mentioned the frustration of holding on the phone (with appalling repeated "music") for as long as you can bear it, eventually hanging up (my personal best was 25 minutes) because apparently no-one is answering the phones that day?

One of the few things to make my blood boil is un/under manned phones. Especially with inappropriate music and assurances my call is valuable to those concerned.

There should be legislation to insist any such call longer than 10 minutes requires a message saying the provider has failed in their duty of care, and offering an alternative number to an ombudsman with powers to correct the situation. When the service is a utility like transport, there's no excuse for under manning.

 

[455driver]

I also would have thought they would ask employees if they are able to do some overtime when they are extremely busy, especially as it's a role which can be done remotely.

And if the staff say no?

 

[sheff1]

Some standard paragraphs aren't "official" or "approved" often advisors will write their own paragraphs and share it with their colleagues at which point no one questions using it and eventually they forget where it even came from in the first place. A lot of advisors wont read what the paragraph says and will just include it based off what it's called.

I think that tells us all we need to know.

 

[Bungle965]

Has anyone mentioned the frustration of holding on the phone (with appalling repeated "music") for as long as you can bear it, eventually hanging up (my personal best was 25 minutes) because apparently no-one is answering the phones that day?

If they rely on stock paragraphs to respond to queries, it explains why they don't want to have to talk to customers in real time. The sooner they accelerate the necessary improvements, the better for all concerned.

My current longest is 50 minutes waiting to speak to someone.
Sam

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

One of the few things to make my blood boil is un/under manned phones. Especially with inappropriate music and assurances my call is valuable to those concerned.

There should be legislation to insist any such call longer than 10 minutes requires a message saying the provider has failed in their duty of care, and offering an alternative number to an ombudsman with powers to correct the situation. When the service is a utility like transport, there's no excuse for under manning.

Apart from the insistence that TOCs should make money!

 

[northwichcat]

Apart from the insistence that TOCs should make money!

Cutting back on customer service usually means people get annoyed and go elsewhere. OK with the railways a lot of people don't have a realistic alternative but even those who don't have an alternative for commuting might be more likely to move jobs or homes if they get annoyed with the railways or could be less likely to use the railways at weekends or during their holidays if they get annoyed with how a TOC treats them in relation to their commute.

 

[Bungle965]

Phoned up northern today to chase up a delay repay that I made in January only to be told that they are only just getting round to dealing with claims from December!
Sam

 

[yorksrob]

Phoned up northern today to chase up a delay repay that I made in January only to be told that they are only just getting round to dealing with claims from December!
Sam

I'm awaiting one from December, so hopefully I should hear soon !

 

[trainophile]

It wouldn't be so bad if they tweaked their email auto-replies to include an estimate of the waiting duration currently being experienced. If it said "We appreciate your patience, and during this busy period we will aim to respond to you by the end of May 2017" at least you wouldn't feel quite so ignored.

 

[northwichcat]

Phoned up northern today to chase up a delay repay that I made in January only to be told that they are only just getting round to dealing with claims from December!
Sam

Claims will be considered without undue delay and any compensation due
will be paid within 14 days of your claim being agreed by the Train Company.
Our target is to process all claims within one month of receipt.

So up to a month to process and 14 days to make the payment after they've processed the claim should mean even if they received a claim on 31st December the payments should have been made by mid-Feb at the latest.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Further evidence, if it were needed, that it'd be better if Delay Repay was moved to a single national centre for processing, with TOC Customer Services allowed to deal with actual customer service issues (i.e. ones requiring proper investigation rather than just a check of stats and payout).

 

[trainophile]

Has anyone else recently had an email from ORR, asking to complete a questionnaire about how their complaint with Northern was handled?

The email I received asked about my complaint "which was made on 13/01/17". The first question was "do I remember this complaint", to which I had to answer NO, as the last time I contacted them before giving up was 16/12/16. I thought I might have the opportunity to expand, but upon entering NO I was informed that there were no more questions!

Presumably they didn't even look at my complaint until 13/01/17, but it beggars belief that they can't even get the correct details in a customer satisfaction survey! If I had known they really meant the actual date I emailed them (for the second and last time) I would have selected YES, but I thought that might become complicated.

 

[yorksrob]

Well, I finally got my delay repay.

A bit annoyed as I got a cheque rather than the return ticket I'd requested.

 

[northwichcat]

A bit annoyed as I got a cheque rather than the return ticket I'd requested.

Old Northern once sent me one of their day tickets when I requested a RTV after being delayed on a journey involving both Northern and Virgin.

 

[northwichcat]

Northern's Twitter team have referred to an amended service due to the Man United game being played tonight as an 'operating incident'!

 

[Ed92uk]

I would have thought anyone who works on the Twitter feed would have access to it at all times. If not Northern must change the passwords at the end of every shift or not allow the people tweeting to login to the account themselves, which wouldn't be normal ways of working in a digital environment.

I didn't mean the Twitter team would normally work remotely but they could in exceptional circumstances.

I can't say for certain with Northern obviously but the chances are they don't actually login to twitter like me and you would at home. They probably use some kind of web portal, an internal system for large companies or just a third party application for smaller users. That way Northern for example could allow and track all staff using internal logins not the actual twitter login. It would be very rare and bad practise for a large business to be using Twitter with no middle man. Hope that explanation makes some kind of sense.