Increase in Graffiti on the network

[HarryL]

Trains get put in sidings that are only mildly guarded, whereas a buses, trucks, etc. are parked in secure depots overnight. I guess a siding equivalent for buses would be a bit like if you parked it on the street overnight and came back for it in the morning.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I'm puzzled that rail vehicles are often targeted by graffiti vandals, but never road trucks or buses. Do the culprits have an anti-rail bias? And why are aggregates and coal wagons attacked, but never intermodal flats or containers?

I recently travelled by rail across North Korea and saw no graffiti, but on a similar trip in the United States nearly every rail-car seemed to have been attacked. Is graffiti part of the price we pay to live in a capitalist democracy?

In my observations, containers are more likely to be tagged (or at least not be cleaned immediately) than passenger vehicles. Hoppers and the like seem to get it worse, but then if a wagon is going to be filthy from dust much of the time, there's less incentive to clean the tags off when they appear.

I imagine tagging a bus wouldn't have the kudos that tagging a train would. If our small sample size of one is anything to go by, it's more likely that the bias is in favour towards rail rather than against it- strange as it may seem to those on the outside.

Whilst it does seem that graffiti has increased during lockdown, the issue is still nowhere near as widespread as certain places on the continent. Urban centres around the Mediterranean seem to have it particularly bad.

 

[furnessvale]

I'm puzzled that rail vehicles are often targeted by graffiti vandals, but never road trucks or buses. Do the culprits have an anti-rail bias? And why are aggregates and coal wagons attacked, but never intermodal flats or containers?

I recently travelled by rail across North Korea and saw no graffiti, but on a similar trip in the United States nearly every rail-car seemed to have been attacked. Is graffiti part of the price we pay to live in a capitalist democracy?

If someone attacks an HGV or a private car, the criminal is liable to get a good hiding, an option not normally available at a remote site of stationary rolling stock.

 

[Ladder23]

I'm puzzled that rail vehicles are often targeted by graffiti vandals, but never road trucks or buses. Do the culprits have an anti-rail bias? And why are aggregates and coal wagons attacked, but never intermodal flats or containers?

I recently travelled by rail across North Korea and saw no graffiti, but on a similar trip in the United States nearly every rail-car seemed to have been attacked. Is graffiti part of the price we pay to live in a capitalist democracy?

Search up some old New York graffiti history, books, and documentries, then you’ll see why it’s obviously still inspiring to people some 30/40 years later. Maybe start with searching “Dondi”.

 

[birchesgreen]

Amusing that rail enthusiasts cannot understand the motivations of someone else with a strange hobby

 

[ExRes]

Amusing that rail enthusiasts cannot understand the motivations of someone else with a strange hobby

Since when did graffiti become a "hobby"? it's nothing other than vandalism and a complete disregard for other peoples property

 

[birchesgreen]

Since when did graffiti become a "hobby"? it's nothing other than vandalism and a complete disregard for other peoples property

Well yes but it is their hobby too. I don't see it as being either or. I don't agree with it myself but i don't deny the interesting history behind it.

 

[Ladder23]

Well yes but it is their hobby too. I don't see it as being either or. I don't agree with it myself but i don't deny the interesting history behind it.

100%, and I agree with your previous post too. The history of it all is amazing and I can totally understand why today it’s still a big thing.

 

[furnessvale]

Amusing that rail enthusiasts cannot understand the motivations of someone else with a strange hobby

I look forward to the day that Thugees are recognised as a religion in the UK.

 

[seagull]

We had a member of the "breaking into people's garden sheds and making off with expensive items" hobby visit us recently.
To think how all these appropriation enthusiasts have been treated as mere burglars for all these years.

 

[dakta]

" Amusing that rail enthusiasts cannot understand the motivations of someone else with a strange hobby "

I think a lot of it is well understood, I think what sets it apart is with a legal hobby criticism tends to be of an opinion, where in this case critique is more justified on a point of legal fact.

The actual motivation bit, I'll grant you might have a point on. If you could graffiti something, does it have to be someone elses for it to retain it's hobby value? otherwise why aren't they doing just their own property, and what is the particular motivating bit about doing it explicitly to someone elses?

Have to concede i don't get those bits, but I'm a kind of 'if I want to paint I'll buy a canvas' guy.

 

[najaB]

Since when did graffiti become a "hobby"? it's nothing other than vandalism and a complete disregard for other peoples property

That depends entirely on what's being painted. As an example, many councils have areas where people are allowed to graffiti, and even have organised events:

Scotland's longest-running street art event brings Dundee's walls to life

Scotland's longest running graffiti event saw dozens of artists spend two days bringing walls across the city's Hilltown to life. Painters from London,

www.thecourier.co.uk

 

[Ladder23]

I think trains are just a big thing in the graffiti world, they’re admired it’s just how it’s been for many many years, I would say the rail is of big interest to the guys/ girls who do it. Some models appeal more so it’s a target and they want there work on that model for personal reasons, I wouldn’t say it’s even to be seen by people, as the post above confirms once done and photographed it wasn’t a big deal if it went out or not.

I refer to nyc when obviously back then it was about getting known and spotted so the best way was doing trains as they move from borough to borough, it’s just a legacy that’s carried on.

 

[furnessvale]

I think trains are just a big thing in the graffiti world, they’re admired it’s just how it’s been for many many years, I would say the rail is of big interest to the guys/ girls who do it. Some models appeal more so it’s a target and they want there work on that model for personal reasons, I wouldn’t say it’s even to be seen by people, as the post above confirms once done and photographed it wasn’t a big deal if it went out or not.

I refer to nyc when obviously back then it was about getting known and spotted so the best way was doing trains as they move from borough to borough, it’s just a legacy that’s carried on.

That is the opinion of one criminal which does not accord with my experience of interviewing other criminals or indeed the written word in books such as "Getting Up", "Spraycan Art", or "Subway Art". Having completed their damage, criminals would often wait at the nearest station for trains to come into service so they could photograph them on the move and add to their distorted kudos.

 

[ExRes]

That depends entirely on what's being painted. As an example, many councils have areas where people are allowed to graffiti, and even have organised events:

Scotland's longest-running street art event brings Dundee's walls to life

Scotland's longest running graffiti event saw dozens of artists spend two days bringing walls across the city's Hilltown to life. Painters from London,

www.thecourier.co.uk

This thread is called "Increase in Graffiti on the network", I'm not posting off thread so council sponsored graffiti has nothing to do with my response

 

[najaB]

This thread is called "Increase in Graffiti on the network", I'm not posting off thread so council sponsored graffiti has nothing to do with my response

You asked how graffiti is a hobby, you got an answer.

 

[Welly]

I'm puzzled that rail vehicles are often targeted by graffiti vandals, but never road trucks or buses.

I saw a parked up white van covered in graffiti when I visited Copenhagan back in 2014 and hoped that would not spread across the world!

 

[alex397]

I saw a parked up white van covered in graffiti when I visited Copenhagan back in 2014 and hoped that would not spread across the world!

I’ve seen that quite a few times in London in recent years. And in the past on Royal Mail vehicles.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I’ve seen that quite a few times in London in recent years. And in the past on Royal Mail vehicles.

It is quite common in Paris to see vans completely "redecorated" on both sides.

 

[Old Yard Dog]

The sooner the media stops glorifying the likes of Banksy the better. There have been a number of travelogues lately where our TV channels have been encouraging tourists to go and see so-called graffiti artists at work in foreign climes. Graffiti turns decent areas into threatening ghettos.

The only decent wall paintings I have seen have been those painted by the two communities in West Belfast. These are works of art, presumably put up with the owners' permission, which no little toe rag dare spray his "tag" over. Black taxi tours are well worth the money.

 

[Jamesrob637]

It's not new on LNW - about 4 years ago I caught the 0616 Northampton - Birmingham, and it arrived ECS from stabling at Bletchley with the composite's side completely covered in graffiti. And 'SNER' seems to like putting his mark, like a feral cat. on railway property round here, including the ventilation shaft outlet of a tunnel visible from the M45, some distance from the nearest road.

As per the below:
Dropped pin
Near M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

52°19'38.2"N 1°09'39.0"W · M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

maps.app.goo.gl

 

[najaB]

Graffiti turns decent areas into threatening ghettos.

That depends very much on the graffiti though. While I agree a lot of it is simple "tagging" that displays little skill, I have also seen truly great street art both in the UK and abroad.

 

[alex397]

That depends very much on the graffiti though. While I agree a lot of it is simple "tagging" that displays little skill, I have also seen truly great street art both in the UK and abroad.

Yes, when it’s street art like I’ve seen in Berlin, Brussels and Vilnius/Kaunas, it really adds to the area, and I have gone out of my way to try and see some of them. But those pieces are generally commissioned legally.

I realise some argue that ‘art is in the eye of the beholder’, but the ‘tagging’ that is prevalent really makes an area seem intimidating. Some of the alley ways and paths I use to get home are covered in tags, which makes me more uncomfortable about using them at night. Especially as tagging is sometimes, not always, used by gangs to mark their territory, like dogs urinating up a lamppost.

 

[Merle Haggard]

As per the below:
Dropped pin
Near M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

52°19'38.2"N 1°09'39.0"W · M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

maps.app.goo.gl

Thank you, yes, seems a bit of a trek from the nearest road just to scrawl four initials. I'm not sure whether it's the tunnel on the old line or the new one though.
Although it's on railway property it obviously can't be seen from a train, but there must be some railway obsession involved.

 

[freddie1729]

As per the below:
Dropped pin
Near M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

52°19'38.2"N 1°09'39.0"W · M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

M45, Kilsby, Rugby CV23 8UW

maps.app.goo.gl

A Grade II* listed structure

 

[najaB]

Yes, when it’s street art like I’ve seen in Berlin, Brussels and Vilnius/Kaunas, it really adds to the area, and I have gone out of my way to try and see some of them. But those pieces are generally commissioned legally.

Yes, there are definitely commissioned pieces, but many of them are not. As an example, in Dundee there's a hoarding around a large development plot (that's seen no development in the last six or seven years) which has become a canvas for the local graffiti artists. So instead of a dirty, tatty many years old hoarding we have a constantly evolving outdoor art 'gallery'. (And the fact that it's constantly being painted has probably slowed the wood rotting away).

The people who do the drawings are mostly pretty talented and few pieces last more than a few weeks before being covered over with something new, and most of them reflect social commentary on recent events, or are a reply to an earlier piece.

That kind of thing is genuine art, spraying random tags is not.

 

[Ladder23]

unfortunately ‘graffiti’ is all put under one umbrella, the grotty tags, to nice commissioned pieces, and most people especially rail enthusiasts refuse to look or simply just can’t differ it and will brand it all the same.

A lot of what I see on trains passing by is amazing, but there is as much which is just pure rubbish, good or bad doesn’t take away the fact it’s illegal etc, but the issue has been around for many many years and it won’t go away. I appreciate the good stuff when I see it.

 

[Donny_m]

Still here, only check in a few times a week to view a few specific threads about diagrams and new freight flows in my area.

The reason I found it difficult to answer the question about wether I would like someone to deface my personal property, the answer Is obviously no, and I would never deface someone else’s car or house, when have you ever seen graffiti on someone’s car? The issue with the question is railway vehicles aren’t someone’s personal property, no one individual has worked hard to acquire it, so in my opinion it’s a tedious comparison and I believe there are better that could be made.

It’s like asking someone who had just received and kept two £20 notes from a cashpoint when they had only requested one, if they would like it if someone took £20 from them, the answer is obviously no, and they would never dream of stealing money from somebody else.

 

[Jamesrob637]

Thank you, yes, seems a bit of a trek from the nearest road just to scrawl four initials. I'm not sure whether it's the tunnel on the old line or the new one though.
Although it's on railway property it obviously can't be seen from a train, but there must be some railway obsession involved.

It's the Kilsby tunnel on the direct Milton Keynes to Rugby line.

 

[Merle Haggard]

It's the Kilsby tunnel on the direct Milton Keynes to Rugby line.

Thank you for the conformation.
So, after 180 years, the brickwork is now irreversibly impregnated with spray paint.