Information for GTR Southern passengers during strike (no DOO discussion)

[Starmill]

Miraculous! Trains at Seaford

 

[RichardKing]

Miraculous! Trains at Seaford

I think you spoke too soon - a broken down train at Bishopstone is blocking the line between Newhaven and Seaford until further notice.

With the unit failure at Falmer (and later between Brighton and Lovers Walk, blocking all lines into/out of Brighton) last night, it's not been a good weekend for the East Coastway. Mind you, it's not been a good week, fortnight, month or year either!

 

[Kite159]

At least Gatwick Express were accepting "southern" tickets on the Brighton services last night, even calling at East Croydon with the premium gate lines closed with passengers requested to access Gat Express platforms via the suburban gateline

 

[infobleep]

Despite saying that timetables would be updated at 2pm the day before, it seems they have decided to put up Tuesdays timetables in advance.

Thwy seem to have decided not to stop the Gatwick Express services at East Croydon or Clapham Junction.

Seems a shame to do that. Perhpas they are expecting them to be leaving people behind and thus won't be any room.

I take it all back. There is a 22.53 service to Hastings that is running from Clapham Junction to East Croydon. I wonder if it will be cancelled on the day?

Interestingly that takes 9 minutes. All other fast travel options take 45 minutes and including travelling via Wimbledon on the tram.

If one wishes to use Gatwick Express then they would need to go to Waterloo, tube to Victoria. Train to Gatwick Airport and then Thameslink back to East Croydon. Just under 1 hour 50 minutes in journey time.

Lets hope the shortage of drivers on Thameslink isn't to bad on Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday

Given that Thameslink run so few services from East Croydon between 17-18 hours during the week, I can see East Croydon being packed on Southern driver strike days. Off peak they run 4 an hour but during the peak, Southern take over some of the paths and Thameslink run elsewhere.

Lets home one of the two trains that run isn't cancelled due to driver shortage or a failed train.

Couls they divert any of the other services instead? I mean Overground are diverting some services.


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[TEW]

I think not-stopping Gatwick Express trains at Clapham Junction and East Croydon is probably a sensible idea, they'd just be swamped and the resultant overcrowding on the platforms could become dangerous.

 

[Starmill]

I wasn't expecting GX to be calling anywhere because they clearly will not be able to operate even their full 4tph frequency.

The 'do not travel' advice has already been issued; arranging an alternative only undermines the advice.

 

[infobleep]

I wasn't expecting GX to be calling anywhere because they clearly will not be able to operate even their full 4tph frequency.

The 'do not travel' advice has already been issued; arranging an alternative only undermines the advice.

True except on Thameslink's Web Site they are not advising people not to travel. They list the strike details but stop short at saying don't travel.

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[Starmill]

I mean Overground are diverting some services.

Are they?

I take it all back. There is a 22.53 service to Hastings that is running from Clapham Junction to East Croydon. I wonder if it will be cancelled on the day?

Interestingly that takes 9 minutes. All other fast travel options take 45 minutes and including travelling via Wimbledon on the tram.

I suspect this is simply an error, like the few trains that are still in the timetable to run on Christmas Day. I do not see it running as likely!

True except on Thameslink's Web Site they are not advising people not to travel. They list the strike details but stop short at saying don't travel.

Perhaps not, but the Southern website is giving advice not to travel on Gatwick Express, or on Thameslink between London Blackfriars / London Bridge - Brighton / Peckham Rye (interestingly) / Sutton.

What services will operate?

Check our map
On routes shown in grey, there will be no service and you will not be able to travel
On routes shown in red and purple, you are advised that there will be a significantly reduced service and are advised not to travel

http://www.southernrailway.com/your-journey/strike/aslef-strike/

 

[infobleep]

Are they?



I suspect this is simply an error, like the few trains that are still in the timetable to run on Christmas Day. I do not see it running as likely!



Perhaps not, but the Southern website is giving advice not to travel on Gatwick Express, or on Thameslink between London Blackfriars / London Bridge - Brighton / Peckham Rye (interestingly) / Sutton.



http://www.southernrailway.com/your-journey/strike/aslef-strike/

Bicbasher said they were diverting services.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=2804834

As for the advice, I think I'll take Thameslink's advice as it's more favourable to taking a train. Lol.

I can't deny I haven't been warmed by Southern though and your good self.

It so happens I need to travel that afternoon and can't travel the day before; in the morning or later. I will be travelling slightly earlier in the afternoon than I otherwise would though.

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--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I'm on a delayed train to Sutton. The OBS announced Sutton would be the next stop. I know the were an OBS as they announced themselves as that or what's to that effect.

A time laymtwr, as we slowly passed through Mitcham Junction, she announced that we would surely be arriving into Sutton.

The train then sped up as we have sometime before we reach Sutton. At least 6 minutes by my reckoning.

I wonder if the OBS knows where we were exactly?


Maybe not as when we pulled into Sutton, they announced we are now approaching Sutton.
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[RichardKing]

Despite saying that timetables would be updated at 2pm the day before, it seems they have decided to put up Tuesdays timetables in advance.

Talking of which, if GTR are successful in their appeal today, surely it would be impossible to update the timetables fast enough to operate a 'normal' service tomorrow? If I remember rightly, when the RMT called off one of their Friday strikes back in the summer, GTR claimed that they still couldn't run a full service as they didn't have enough time to update the timetables. Unless they've invested in some marvellous new software (doubtful), surely tomorrow's service will be absent regardless of today's result?

 

[87015]

Talking of which, if GTR are successful in their appeal today, surely it would be impossible to update the timetables fast enough to operate a 'normal' service tomorrow? If I remember rightly, when the RMT called off one of their Friday strikes back in the summer, GTR claimed that they still couldn't run a full service as they didn't have enough time to update the timetables. Unless they've invested in some marvellous new software (doubtful), surely tomorrow's service will be absent regardless of today's result?

Of course its possible to re-instate WTT or even re-bid a full service. NR have had planning resource in all weekend to deal with GTR's "timetable" and they are more than able to deal with a late bid today. Whether the GTR will is there is another question - bearing in mind traincrew diagrams etc are entirely in their court.

 

[RichardKing]

Of course its possible to re-instate WTT or even re-bid a full service. NR have had planning resource in all weekend to deal with GTR's "timetable" and they are more than able to deal with a late bid today. Whether the GTR will is there is another question - bearing in mind traincrew diagrams etc are entirely in their court.

So, on that Friday, the limited service (even though the strike had been called off) was down to GTR's unwillingness to alter the crew diagrams?

 

[infobleep]

Talking of which, if GTR are successful in their appeal today, surely it would be impossible to update the timetables fast enough to operate a 'normal' service tomorrow? If I remember rightly, when the RMT called off one of their Friday strikes back in the summer, GTR claimed that they still couldn't run a full service as they didn't have enough time to update the timetables. Unless they've invested in some marvellous new software (doubtful), surely tomorrow's service will be absent regardless of today's result?

Your correct about that so expect cancellations tomorrow whatever.

If they can suddenly run a overtime ban timetable day service, one will wonder why they couldn't previously after the RMT strike.

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[Deepgreen]

Redhill shone again this morning - the staff there seem to forget/don't care that the loud speakers anywhere away from the canopies do not work and therefore any train announcements they can be bothered to make (often incorrectly), cannot be heard by anyone towards the London end of the platforms! Trains came and went from platform 2 and passengers were none the wiser as to which they were. Eventually the 0853 to Victoria turned up about seven late and we set off. I was surprised to take the fats line at Stoats Nest, as we called at Purley. The fast platform was crowded for our train, which must have meant a change of platform for hundreds of people, but nothing seemed to be in the way between Purely and South Croydon on the slow line, so this change of platform seemed odd to say the least. We also stopped at Selhurst (fast platform again) to change drivers - never done that on the fast before!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Your correct about that so expect cancellations tomorrow whatever.

If they can suddenly run a overtime ban timetable day service, one will wonder why they couldn't previously after the RMT strike.

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It won't be the timetables that can't be updated, as the normal timetable exists 'in the background' anyway, but it will be the crew/stock rosters.

 

[maniacmartin]

They're using the fast lines a lot lately between Stoat's Nest and Purley because of bridge replacement works on the slow lines between these two places at Old Lodge Lane. This is the replacement that was cancelled last year due to forecast high winds. By the end of the year the fast lines side of the bridge will have major structural work done too

 

[hwl]

They're using the fast lines a lot lately between Stoat's Nest and Purley because of bridge replacement works on the slow lines between these two places at Old Lodge Lane. This is the replacement that was cancelled last year due to forecast high winds. By the end of the year the fast lines side of the bridge will have major structural work done too

Indeed TSR on the down slow limiting capacity this week and last

 

[Deepgreen]

From NR web site -
"Speed resrictions have been put in place at Balham and Thornton Heath and are likely to remain in place for the rest of the day. This is causing delays of up to 20 minutes to services through East Croydon.

A signalling problem at Haywards Heath is also affecting services through the area."

Two TSRs between Balham and East Croydon - does anyone know the cause(s)? These two, plus the Stoats Nest TSR, must make for potential unravelling of even a reduced service.

 

[Taunton]

I heard it was in Balcombe tunnel, which if so is very wet. The problem is the line is now almost 170 odd years old and is creaking at the seams. Many repairs are almost sticking plaster jobs.

I agree that many repairs nowadays are "sticking plaster jobs", but there's no apparent reason why. Network Rail are awash with money increases every year, but seem to squander it on anything except doing a proper engineering job. Tunnels which are wet are fixed long tern by the installation of properly adequate drainage. I do understand that the staffing structure at NR has driven away many of the established and competent engineers, while the money gets skimmed off by the politically-correct bonehead zealots who have been allowed to take charge. I did have hopes for Sir Peter Hendy to get to grips with it, but he seems to have disappeared into the quicksand as well.

Over on the GW, quite apart from the electrification fiasco, the equivalent problems in Chipping Sodbury tunnel, which is now regularly closed whenever it rains, seem notably similar. Incidentally, this latter is one of the more modern tunnels on the network (it's 20th century) so overall age has little to do with it. I presume there's nobody senior left at NR who has a civil engineering degree and understands underground drainage. All accountants and economists.

 

[GatwickDepress]

...politically-correct bonehead zealots...

Um, eh?

 

[skyeeloy34]

Hello I know Southern are back at court today, do you think they have a chance of their appeal being uphold?

 

[Deepgreen]

Hello I know Southern are back at court today, do you think they have a chance of their appeal being requested?

"Requested"?

 

[Robertj21a]

I presume there's nobody senior left at NR who has a civil engineering degree and understands underground drainage. All accountants and economists.

Is a civil engineering degree an essential requirement ?

 

[infobleep]

From NR web site -
"Speed resrictions have been put in place at Balham and Thornton Heath and are likely to remain in place for the rest of the day. This is causing delays of up to 20 minutes to services through East Croydon.

A signalling problem at Haywards Heath is also affecting services through the area."

Two TSRs between Balham and East Croydon - does anyone know the cause(s)? These two, plus the Stoats Nest TSR, must make for potential unravelling of even a reduced service.

I got caught up in that, although it wasn't reported on NR by that point. I also got caught up in congestion caused by an earlier signalling problem at Clapham Junction into Waterloo. Again not reported but delays are only 10 minutes so someone must have decided the reporting of it wasn't needed today. Some days people take the opposite view and do put up a note.

Being 10 minutes late meant I missed my unofficial 5 min connection and then after that got further delayed due to a waiting train crew.

I would have travelled via Wimbledon were it not for the fact a Thameslink train was cancelled due to shortage of drivers.

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[YorkshireBear]

Is a civil engineering degree an essential requirement ?

No, but it helps when undertaking civil engineering.

 

[DarloRich]

I agree that many repairs nowadays are "sticking plaster jobs", but there's no apparent reason why. Network Rail are awash with money increases every year, but seem to squander it on anything except doing a proper engineering job. Tunnels which are wet are fixed long tern by the installation of properly adequate drainage. I do understand that the staffing structure at NR has driven away many of the established and competent engineers, while the money gets skimmed off by the politically-correct bonehead zealots who have been allowed to take charge. I did have hopes for Sir Peter Hendy to get to grips with it, but he seems to have disappeared into the quicksand as well.

Over on the GW, quite apart from the electrification fiasco, the equivalent problems in Chipping Sodbury tunnel, which is now regularly closed whenever it rains, seem notably similar. Incidentally, this latter is one of the more modern tunnels on the network (it's 20th century) so overall age has little to do with it. I presume there's nobody senior left at NR who has a civil engineering degree and understands underground drainage. All accountants and economists.

:roll: I know that i am wasting my time with people like you but I can give one apparent reason why: The TOC wont grant the access needed to do a long job and would rather have a sticking plaster approach which keeps their trains running.

In some areas the access "down time" is 3 hours overnight. 3 hours. 3. Not 13. How do you propose to do more than a sticking plaster job in the available time, which is often more like 1 hour after the last trains have run. Also try getting a disruptive long term possession planned and agreed at short notice for anything more than a dire emergency. Good luck.

but yeah, all boneheads, zealots and accountants. They will be to blame. :roll:

 

[Robertj21a]

No, but it helps when undertaking civil engineering.

Yes, I understand that it may well help, but then so does experience in the job. In my experience (not civil engineering) I'd usually put those with experience well above those with degrees.

 

[infobleep]

:roll: I know that i am wasting my time with people like you but I can give one apparent reason why: The TOC wont grant the access needed to do a long job and would rather have a sticking plaster approach which keeps their trains running.

In some areas the access "down time" is 3 hours overnight. 3 hours. 3. Not 13. How do you propose to do more than a sticking plaster job in the available time, which is often more like 1 hour after the last trains have run. Also try getting a disruptive long term possession planned and agreed at short notice for anything more than a dire emergency. Good luck.

but yeah, all boneheads, zealots and accountants. They will be to blame. :roll:

Still they have managed to do upgrades to London Bridge and its on going and are working on Waterloo so it is possible. Obviously with timetable changes.

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[DarloRich]

Still they have managed to do upgrades to London Bridge and its on going and are working on Waterloo so it is possible. Obviously with timetable changes.

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Just think about the differences in the quoted examples. One is a major upgrade job while the other is, essentially, a local maintenance task.

 

[bicbasher]

More disruption, this time on the Sydenham corridor after what appears to be a criminal act on a unit at Forest Hill.

Southern stoppers are running on the fast lines, while London Overground services are terminating at New Cross Gate.

 

[tsr]

More disruption, this time on the Sydenham corridor after what appears to be a criminal act on a unit at Forest Hill.

Southern stoppers are running on the fast lines, while London Overground services are terminating at New Cross Gate.

All reopened after police released the train reasonably quickly (also in turn allowing the train stuck behind at Honor Oak Park to move forward ECS) - stock involved now out of service and on the move.

Aside from a points failure in the Southampton Ctl area and the continuing speed restrictions, the latter now having only a negligible impact on further services, services are now recovering from most earlier incidents (points failures at Streatham South Jn and Haywards Heath; gapped unit Fratton; etc.), so it looks like the biggest problem will be driver shortages and displaced stock, unless any further incident occurs going into the peak.