Is Veganism a Fad?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by westv, 13 Sep 2019.

  1. westv

    westv Established Member

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    Not a day seems to go by now without some vegan "offering" being mentioned on the news or other media outlet. It used to be that vegerarians had the trump hand in worthiness. Personally I would rather have razors shoved up my rear than become vegan but each to their own. In a few years maybe it will all die down and vegetarians will be able to reclaim their "moral high ground".
     
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  3. AM9

    AM9 Established Member

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    For some it is their ethical issue, either because they can't accept that human beings are by default omnivores or they just can't envisage themselves eating anything that lived as an animal, (as opposed to a plant). Some claim that vegan diets make the least impact on global carbon levels, (as they munch away at their quinoa shipped in from Peru and Bolivia). Few consider that exclusive exposure to a vegan diet can cause various malnutrition conditions, especially processed oven-ready vegan dishes in supermarkets. So token veganism such as going to Waitrose (or any other chain supermarket) to buy boldly labelled vegan prepared food almost certainly is a fad and in a year or two will probably fade away.
    The minority who take the trouble to study their diets and cook from raw ingredients may well move more towards a typical indigenous vegan diet, but they are probably already into genuine vegetarian diets anyway IMO.
     
    Last edited: 14 Sep 2019 at 06:49
  4. Terry Tait

    Terry Tait Member

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    Due to exponential population growth worldwide meat is increasingly becoming a luxury and will go up in price so alternatives will be used much more, incidentally, my sister cooked a Linda Mc Cartney burger last week but didn't tell me until I had finished it, I didn't realise and presumed it was meat.
     
  5. J-2739

    J-2739 Established Member

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    I don't intend to be a vegan, but if someone else wants to be one, why should I stop them? As long as we respect each other's views.
     
  6. westv

    westv Established Member

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    Linda McCartney wasn't vegan
     
  7. Lucan

    Lucan Member

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    Even if we all go vegan it will only delay by a few years the evil day when there is not enough food to go round. We need to stop population growth before it stops itself with mass starvations (in the First World probably before the Third World) and fighting for the remaining resources at all levels from the international down to the street. I give it 50 years, and 'm glad I won't live to see it.
     
  8. nlogax

    nlogax Established Member

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    Unless you're personally being force-fed certain Quorn products why is this a problem for you?

    Vegetarianism and veganism are going to become more and more common in coming years as meat becomes more expensive as populations continue to grow while resources shrink. You'll just have to deal with it along with everyone else.
     
  9. westv

    westv Established Member

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    Your opinion.
     
  10. nlogax

    nlogax Established Member

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    Unless you have a magic plan to feed an ever-expanding population, it's fact. Like it or lump it.
     
  11. westv

    westv Established Member

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    There is enough food. It is not equally shared though.
     
  12. GB

    GB Established Member

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    Cattle must be easier to rear in the quantities needed for an expanding population than having to rely purely on plant based foods.
     
  13. Darandio

    Darandio Established Member

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    But apparently they fart far too much and are trying to turn our planet into Venus. Saying that, it seems we are trying to do it even quicker than the cows in the neverending quest to be green! You really couldn't make this up. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-49567197
     
  14. Lucan

    Lucan Member

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    You are talking about the present day situation. However there will not be enough food in the not too distant future if this continues :
    [​IMG]

    [Source : World Bank via Google
    www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&met_y=sp_pop_totl&idim=country:GBR:FRA:DEU&hl=en&dl=en#!ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=sp_pop_totl&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=region&idim=region:EAS:ECS:LCN:MEA:NAC:sAS:sSF&ifdim=region&tstart=-298602000000&tend=1405465200000&hl=en_US&dl=en&ind=false ]

    World population has doubled in less than two generations, and still rising fast.
     
    Last edited: 14 Sep 2019 at 10:16
  15. Enthusiast

    Enthusiast Member

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    I've no objection to anybody adopting a vegan diet. Good luck to them - they must like being bored when eating. What I object to is the quasi-military wing of the vegan movement, like the mob that invaded a Brighton restaurant last year:

    https://www.brightonandhoveindepend...ers-with-sounds-of-animal-slaughter-1-8719754

    Today I read of a school that has introduced a vegan diet to its school meals. This was done, so they say, "to make the facility inclusive to all dietary requirements". Really? Well it doesn't exactly include those pupils who might want a bit of meat with their dinner does it? There have been reports of pupils returning home hungry and their parents giving them cash to buy takeaways.

    One other gripe is why do vegan and vegetarian dishes have to resemble those traditionally made from meat? Why are there vegan "sausages"? Why vegan "burgers"? Why not just say this is a tube filled with slush made from plants? I even saw a vegan "steak" (God knows what it was made from) that had been impregnated with beetroot juice to make it "bleed" like a proper steak! What a farce.

    I'm out for a fillet steak tomorrow (rare, natch).
     
  16. Tracked

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    "Is having razors shoved up your rear a fad?"
     
  17. 433N

    433N Member

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    Interested to know how you come to that conclusion ... it's a bizarre thesis.

    Cattle eat plant- based foods, you know ... It takes 16 pounds of plant protein to make 1 pound of meat protein IIRC.
     
  18. cactustwirly

    cactustwirly Established Member

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    This is the UK not America, a pound is a unit of currency! :rolleyes:
     
  19. The Ham

    The Ham Established Member

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    If it's a fad it's a useful one for our family.

    Although we aren't Vegan one of our children has a diety requirement which means that they can't have milk. I have two words which make our life a LOT easier when it comes to summertime treats Vegan Magnums!

    Although I agree that we should be moving towards a lower CO2 heavy diet there's no "magic bullet" to do this.

    For instance which is better locally produced milk from cows on low quality land or soya milk which had been shipped half way around the world and may well have been produced on land which was former rainforest?

    The answer to the above is probably a complicated one and therefore isn't as straight forward as the vegan option (much as those are very much in favour of veganism would like to think).

    For instance, if we stopped producing sheep on our uplands then chances are there's not really any other food production which could be undertaken there. Even if we could then it probably wouldn't produce the yields which would be produced on better quality land and so may not be much better environmentally. It would also likely be at the loss of a lot of our moorland and upland wetlands, which would be far from good.

    Likewise the answer isn't Organic, in that Organic can mean more pesticide use (yes there are Organic pesticides, they are just "natural", which as an aside I've seen a natural lake on a volcanic island which has a negative PH value due to the amount of sulfur, I can assure you that's not good for you even though it's natural) as they can be less effective.

    As for those who claim to produce products which are chemical free, they need to focus on reducing the amount of Dihydrogen oxide which people often use with their products.

    Dyhydrogen Oxide is one of the most used chemicals in the planet and is directly related to the third highest causes of deaths in children in the UK.

    Yes we do need to reduce the amount of resources we use to produce the stuff which we consume. Yes we're need to consume less. Yes it would probably be better if there we less meat consumption.

    By all means encourage this by things like meat free Monday or Veganuary so that it becomes more mainstream and more socially acceptable, but it is not the solution to everything.

    Even if you can't face the challenge of reducing the amount of meat in your diet, how about changing the type of meat which you eat. For instance Beef produces a lot more emissions than Lamb which in turn produces a lot more emissions than chicken and these also generally also equate to the amount of land required for their production (i.e. a kg of beef requires more land to produce than a kg of chicken). By making those switches in the food that we do eat then that would also help. As does doing things like having a smaller amount of meat by adding more vegetables to stew and stir fry to bulk them up without needing to remove the meat altogether.

    If 5 people reduced their meat consumption by 20% (1 vegetarian meal a week and a bit less meat in 2 other meals) that would likely have the same benefit as 1 person being a vegetarian. It is probably a lot easier to get 5 people to sign up to do that than it is to get 1 person to do so, chances are it would be easier to get 50 people to do it.

    That's the way to make a big difference, by getting everyone to do something rather than a few people doing big changes. As once they have made some small changes they could well be willing to make some more small changes.

    If everyone made the commitment to do one of the following (the more the better):
    - reduce meat consumption by 20%
    - change beef for lamb or better still chicken
    - do meat free Monday (or at least once a week have a vegetarian meal)
    - by locally produced products
    - but less meat but higher quality and use it more efficiently
    - try swapping cows milk for oat milk (especially if you mostly have milk in tea/coffee)

    However a lot of the hype around some of the alternative (which can be better, but not always) ways of doing things doesn't help.

    For those who don't understand what Dyhydrogen oxide or is the waste product of burying Hydrogen and it has 2 hydrogen molecules for every oxygen molecule and had the chemical symbol H subscript 2 and then an O.

    Which just goes to show that by giving something's chemical or chemical sounding name rather than calling it a more commonly used name, like water, can scare people into thinking that it's a bad thing. Just for clarification, drowning is the third biggest cause of deaths within children.
     
  20. mmh

    mmh Established Member

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    It's because they, as a group stereotype, tend to be disproportionately vocal. Hence the old line "how can you spot a vegan? You don't need to, they'll have already told you."
     
  21. 433N

    433N Member

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    Correction : It takes 16 kg of plant protein to make 1 kg of animal protein. (for those who can't do the maths) . ;)
     
  22. 433N

    433N Member

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    When a friend of my daughter announced she was going vegan, I knew it was doomed to failure and she was back to meat eating within a few months. The thing is, people announce or make a noise for effect and when there is no more attention to be had, the novelty fades and most don't have the resolve to do the hard yards.

    My wife and I have been vegetarian for a very long time ; both my daughter and son are vegetarians. We never gave them meat as kids but never stopped them eating meat at friends' houses or parties. Now they continue to be vegetarian in adulthood. Frankly, we never announce it to anyone - don't even think about it - we just don't eat meat. The most common problem we have is being served meaty food because we have neglected to inform anyone about our vegetarianism due to our unawareness that we are.
     
  23. NoMorePacers

    NoMorePacers Member

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    There wouldn't be as many vegans as there currently are if it wasn't "trendy", and it probably is a fad that'll go away at some point.

    I personally do not have an issue with someone being vegan - quite frankly I couldn't give a baboon's testicle what someone else ate - as long as they don't attempt to force it on me. And from my experience, a lot of vegans are simply not content with just being vegan - rather, they feel as if they need to take it upon themselves to convert every single person on the planet to their ideology - and I find it extremely irritating that they do this (also stuff like protesting at a farm that the people who run it are murderers, while ignoring that our government happily sells weapons to countries that publicly behead their citizens, but that's going off-topic).
     
  24. 433N

    433N Member

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    Isn't that just like a non-smoker complaining about passive smoking, though ? Does it equally irritate you when passive smokers complain about smokers ? If it does, is it because you are a smoker ? If you are a non-smoker and it doesn't irritate you then that would be pertinent because you are irritated only because it impinges on what you want to do.

    If vegans believe that your actions (meat eating) are detrimental to their health and well-being (through environmental damage), why should they not try to convert you ? Does your irritation arise simply because they want you to stop doing something you enjoy ?

    PS : I'm well aware that 'vegans' can be irritating but you need but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't be questioning whether your meat-eating is right or not.
     
  25. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    Why are you worried about whether someone wants to be vegan? What are you worried about? How does it make any difference to you and your life?

    If this is all you have to worry about you are a lucky man! It is like listening to that Renta quite idiot penis moron ranting on about Gregg's selling a vegan roll.

    I mean who actually cares?
     
  26. AM9

    AM9 Established Member

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    Slightly different as passive smoking has been demonstrated to present a health risk to those near to smokers practicing their habit. Apart from the irritating wailing from some vegans, especially those who have just discovered it, even sitting next to one in a restaurant will never be a health risk.
    I don't mainline on meat but I do enjoy it as part of a balanced omnivore's diet. For those that can't handle that, therapy might help.
     
  27. NSEFAN

    NSEFAN Established Member

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    It's a slippery slope, don'tcha know? Sure you have choice NOW, but if THEY keep demanding greater recognition, we will soon all be forced to conform to their snowflake ways incase we offend them!!. We have to stand up for TRADITIONAL English food!! Our culture is being eroded by these cow huggers!!!!

    Or something like that. :D
     
  28. 61653 HTAFC

    61653 HTAFC Established Member

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    Veganism is definitely "in" at the moment, and the environmental arguments for it are quite compelling... but:

    Like a lot of environmental causes, it's something only easily adopted by those with the means: those who can afford to pay extra for almond milk and soybean cheese. It's a petit-bourgoisie lifestyle choice in most cases.

    I've known vegans who hold more scorn for vegetarians than they do for meat-eaters, the attitude being that if you can't go all-in, you may as well not bother at all.
     
  29. najaB

    najaB Veteran Member

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    Yes. No. Depends.

    For some people it's just a fad. For other people it's a long-standing lifestyle. And for others it's something that they are trying to see if it suits them.
     
  30. nlogax

    nlogax Established Member

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    As it stands, vegan cheese is enough of a reason not to go all-in right now. But Impossible and Beyond burgers are really very good and I’d happily go for those as much as I’d go for something from Bleecker or Five Guys.
     
  31. Waldgrun

    Waldgrun Member

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    "Live long and prosper!", that a Vegan greeting is it not!
     

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