Loco-hauled resurgence?

[6Gman]

Just out of interest, why is this such a big deal? I'm not trying to be obtuse or rude or anything, it's interesting to understand the emotional attachment people have to different parts of the railway.

To be fair moving the noisy bit well away from the passengers does make for a quieter and less vibratory journey.

 

[JonathanH]

To be fair moving the noisy bit well away from the passengers does make for a quieter and less vibratory journey.

While at the same time, the most popular locomotives are the one that make the most noise?

 

[dooton]

he one loco hauled service that has lasted beyond the short term has been the Chiltern 67s, which are still clogging up the Marylebone air some years later. But their polluting days may soon be over as government cutbacks “encourage” Chiltern to ditch their non-standard stock

I think we need to ditch the narrative that the 68's are somehow more polluting than the 165/168's. 68's have modern cat engines whereas the 165's/168s have engines from the 90's. Yes they are loud, but they certainly do not produce more particulates than an equivalent 6 car 168.

 

[43096]

GBRF have bought a couple of 67s and one has been running on the Inverness portion at least.

Leased, not bought.

 

[Suraggu]

I hope Chiltern don't get rid of their loco hauled services, I find them very good to travel on.

They will be replaced by 2025 unless that is pushed back subject to fleet cascades etc.

I think we need to ditch the narrative that the 68's are somehow more polluting than the 165/168's. 68's have modern cat engines whereas the 165's/168s have engines from the 90's. Yes they are loud, but they certainly do not produce more particulates than an equivalent 6 car 168.

The problem is this is the line being peddled by the DfT and the TOC when in actual fact its all to do with the residents of Marylebone complaining to the council about the noise.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

There won't be any loco haulage on HS2.
I think the fastest loco-hauled high speed stock is the ÖBB RailJet in its various forms, with a Siemens Taurus loco on the front/back.
They run up to 230km/h which fits with the HSLs in Austria and beyond, and can run in pairs.
ČD also owns some similar sets which interwork with the ÖBB ones on the Prague-Brno-Vienna-Graz axis.

 

[Class15]

There won't be any loco haulage on HS2.
I think the fastest loco-hauled high speed stock is the ÖBB RailJet in its various forms, with a Siemens Taurus loco on the front/back.
They run up to 230km/h which fits with the HSLs in Austria and beyond, and can run in pairs.
ČD also owns some similar sets which interwork with the ÖBB ones on the Prague-Brno-Vienna-Graz axis.

If there’s no loco haulage on HS2, where will the Caledonian sleeper go?

 

[eastwestdivide]

If there’s no loco haulage on HS2, where will the Caledonian sleeper go?

Same as now? No need for extra speed overnight really

 

[zwk500]

If there’s no loco haulage on HS2, where will the Caledonian sleeper go?

If they survive, via the classic WCML.

 

[Halish Railway]

There won't be any loco haulage on HS2.
I think the fastest loco-hauled high speed stock is the ÖBB RailJet in its various forms, with a Siemens Taurus loco on the front/back.
They run up to 230km/h which fits with the HSLs in Austria and beyond, and can run in pairs.
ČD also owns some similar sets which interwork with the ÖBB ones on the Prague-Brno-Vienna-Graz axis.

I believe that the carriages themselves are capable of 250kph/155mph running.

To add my take to the topic, I would have preferred it if the DfT went down the bi-mode power car/locomotive-hauled route when specifying what became the Class 800s and 801s, that would have provided a far more pleasant travelling experience than the multiple units we have now, although the DfT may still have selected the horrible Fainsa Sophias that we have come accustomed to.

 

[adamedwards]

If we had a rolling programme of electrification and had done Oxford, Bristol, Swansea, Hull, Harrogate, Lincoln and Middlesborough there would have been a reduction in bi modes with engines removed as not needed. Same is in theory planned if the wires ever reach Sheffield. (I'm assuming a single diesel would be left on each train as an emergency back up.)

 

[Bletchleyite]

I believe that the carriages themselves are capable of 250kph/155mph running.

To add my take to the topic, I would have preferred it if the DfT went down the bi-mode power car/locomotive-hauled route when specifying what became the Class 800s and 801s, that would have provided a far more pleasant travelling experience than the multiple units we have now, although the DfT may still have selected the horrible Fainsa Sophias that we have come accustomed to.

Probably would. After all TPE's LH Mk5s have them.

 

[43096]

I believe that the carriages themselves are capable of 250kph/155mph running.

Siemens quote them as being 230km/h maximum. There's not much point in going faster as the highest speed locos to go with them are also 230km/h - currently these are the ES64U/ES64U2/ES64U4 (ÖBB Taurus, classes 1016/1116/1216). There is now a 230km/h Vectron variant available to go with the stock: ČD being the launch customer with an order for 50.

 

[route101]

I hope Chiltern don't get rid of their loco hauled services, I find them very good to travel on.

I had my first ride on one last week. Glad I did as they wont be running for too much longer.

 

[Sm5]

Theres plenty of loco haulage in Europe.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Theres plenty of loco haulage in Europe.

Though interestingly one of the mainstays of it, SBB, is rapidly converting to EMUs, and not very nice ones at that.

 

[william.martin]

I'm not sure it's quite that- or else why would enthusiasts have been attracted to chasing locos and avoiding DMUs when the former were commonplace prior to the 90s?

.

Because not all of us were alive in the 90's...

 

[4BEP]

There won't be any loco haulage on HS2.
I think the fastest loco-hauled high speed stock is the ÖBB RailJet in its various forms, with a Siemens Taurus loco on the front/back.
They run up to 230km/h which fits with the HSLs in Austria and beyond, and can run in pairs.
ČD also owns some similar sets which interwork with the ÖBB ones on the Prague-Brno-Vienna-Graz axis.

Just one Taurus, the driving coach, steurwagen, at the other end is an unpowered carriage with a driving cab. Impressive performance though. ÖBB is also running NightJets at up to 200kph.

 

[59CosG95]

Just one Taurus, the driving coach, steurwagen, at the other end is an unpowered carriage with a driving cab. Impressive performance though. ÖBB is also running NightJets at up to 200kph.

The Railjet formations often run as a coupled pair - although it's usually arranged "coaches, loco, coaches, loco".
But can you imagine TPE doing a "Nova 3" sandwich with the DTs in the middle and the 68s on the ends?

 

[hexagon789]

I believe that the carriages themselves are capable of 250kph/155mph running.

Siemens quote them as being 230km/h maximum.

Up to 249km/h according to Siemens English language brochure on the Siemens Viaggio coaches:

 

[4BEP]

The Railjet formations often run as a coupled pair - although it's usually arranged "coaches, loco, coaches, loco".
But can you imagine TPE doing a "Nova 3" sandwich with the DTs in the middle and the 68s on the ends?

The sight of a pair RailJets coupled, 18 Viaggio cars and two Taurus' , 17200 hp at 230 kmh is really something.

 

[Bryson]

The Railjet formations often run as a coupled pair - although it's usually arranged "coaches, loco, coaches, loco".
But can you imagine TPE doing a "Nova 3" sandwich with the DTs in the middle and the 68s on the ends?

I was surprised by this when catching the railjet from Salzburg to Vienna a few weeks ago. The service was portion worked, once the two portions had joined the formation was:

Coaches : Loco : Loco : Coaches.

The PIS speed display showed 235 Kph a few times.

 

[CE142]

The Railjet formations often run as a coupled pair - although it's usually arranged "coaches, loco, coaches, loco".
But can you imagine TPE doing a "Nova 3" sandwich with the DTs in the middle and the 68s on the ends?

Used to happen with Cromptons and 4TCs on the Waterloo-Salibury turns, there was a booked turn in a morning which was 8TC with a 33/1 on each end, although occasionally on of the 4TCs would be the 'wrong way' round so it would be Crompton, 4TC, Crompton, 4TC.
Don't think it ever happened that both 33/1s where in the middle though!