London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

[Starmill]

I'll be on it again on Wednesday so will report back. Going up from Edinburgh on what is the 0710 from Leeds.

I've been on the last one from Aberdeen about a dozen times this year and have never seen first less than 65% full. It always normally goes into P2 at Waverley so you have to walk the full length of the train to get onto the main station and from looking in the windows standard is always usually around 50% full. During the festival it was rammed leaving Edinburgh so yeah definitely a good one for a day tripper.

I did Edinburgh to Leeds on it at the end of the festival, it was very very full.

I second the comments made by yorkie re the crew.

I'm not entirely sure EC would be happy if they knew Weekend First was being DIScouraged by some hosts. Not that it would have been worth anything given the service on offer!

 

[yorkie]

A source informs me the 2043 Newcastle - Doncaster doesn't have the miserable bloke from last week on it, and therefore the full service was provided by a lovely crew today!

So how's that for consistency? Same train, yet completely the opposite in customer service. It's a lottery, but when you pay a premium for a ticket, it shouldn't be a lottery.

 

[Chrism20]

I have come to the conclusion that the 0710 LDS-ABD service is just a shambles in its entirety.

I catch it back home from NCL at least twice a month, invariably there is nothing left or what is available is burnt to a crisp as it was cooked on the run out of Leeds.

Today is the fourth time in three months I've caught it from Edinburgh to Aberdeen and it is a joke.

Left Edinburgh at 1028 and out comes the afternoon tea menu, followed by the hot drinks - ran out of tea, finally got that on departure from Dundee.

Two Chinese tourists who are clearly struggling with English are then barked at by the staff member with the empty teapot to move along.

Drinks service (1) on departure from Kirkcaldy good job I bagged a second as there was no chance of seeing that trolley again. Mushroom pasty very nice as usual, unfortunately they had went gaga with the salad dressing.

Closure of the 'Fubar' (no D) announced when rolling into arbroath.

And I've just been covered in coconut! Rather than ask if I had finished with napkin they lean over me and pick it up. No sooner have they collected the rubbish cue the arrival of the on-board cleaner who appears to like yelling 'empties, rubbish, papers'.

There are atleast four crew and a manager on this service does it really take over an hour to relay the two and a half carriages and count the stock?

The 1818 can only be better than this.

 

[ainsworth74]

And here we come to my one remaining, major, gripe with East Coast the consistency of the service offered. The above member on the 0710 Leeds - Aberdeen had what sounds like fairly awful service. But on the same service back in April I had what I would consider really good service throughout the journey from Darlington to Aberdeen:

I spent the day in the clutches of East Coast yesterday doing Darlington to Aberdeen and back and I have to say the service throughout was excellent. Hot/cold drinks and breakfast order taken straight after Darlington served by Newcastle and was very tasty. Another run of drinks after Newcastle and Berwick. Change of crew and menu (to All Day) after Edinburgh and another run of drinks and food orders I had two of the cheese and two of the salmon and they were both very nice as was the chocolate cake. More drinks before and after Dundee. Trip outbound was fantastic and the crew after Edinburgh was brilliant.

My return journey on the 1452 was equally a success:

Return journey was afternoon tea from Aberdeen and we got two/three rounds of drinks and one run of food for each station called at (so everyone got one shot at the food) as far as Edinburgh. Slight crew change and they served the All Day menu with food and drinks served on departure and another drinks run after Berwick and Newcastle. I had the pie which was very tasty and well filled with chicken tikka. The only slight change I would make to the All Day menu is to offer an 'enhanced' service around tea time departures from principle stations. By which I mean, for example, serve the pie with a side of chips or perhaps New Potatoes. Something that won't add a lot of cost or complicate preparation but would make it more suitable for a evening meal (but doesn't require the crew/time/money that the full Evening Meal menu requires). As things go, however, this is a tiny niggle and not a complaint.

Same operator, different day, different crew and totally different experience! It shouldn't really be like this (or at least not as extreme).

 

[Chrism20]

Same operator, different day, different crew and totally different experience! It shouldn't really be like this (or at least not as extreme).

I agree, it shouldn't vary wildly between great and ridiculous, admittedly the 0710 is the only service I really have an issue with but between NCL and EDB at that time of the morning there is big gaps in the service due to most of the trains not having made it that far north yet.

Between EDB and ABD I could use Scotrail but find me someone who would prefer a packed 158 or 170 over an HST!

IIRC the crew that get on at Edinburgh and take the 0710 up to Aberdeen bring the 1452 back so there is a big gap between arrival and departure. I know they have to prepare the train etc but considering they have brought it up it will be set up the way they like it to start with.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Maybe the comment is a bit over the top but overall I have found Virgin's first class to be second rate when compared to other operators over similar distances

I think that's a bit harsh. There is a tendency with Virgin to only do one drinks run on the Manchester trains, but the last time I was with them on the 1720 out of Euston the food was lovely, the wine was lovely, and it all got served on a proper plate and in a proper glass.

East Coast's service is still very hit-and-miss. When it's a hit it's a real hit. The 1730 off the Cross tends to have very good staff, it's common enough that I've got the glass of red in my hand before we've even gone through Gasworks.

But some of the staff still act like every slice of bread or glass of wine is coming directly out of their wages. I don't understand it. Also why have they started taking the lids away when you order the miniature spirits?

Weekend service tends to be worse, everyone always seems a bit more grumpy, not sure why. But it's better than the weekend service- "Fetch it yourself"- on Great Western.

 

[Butts]

I think that's a bit harsh. There is a tendency with Virgin to only do one drinks run on the Manchester trains, but the last time I was with them on the 1720 out of Euston the food was lovely, the wine was lovely, and it all got served on a proper plate and in a proper glass.

East Coast's service is still very hit-and-miss. When it's a hit it's a real hit. The 1730 off the Cross tends to have very good staff, it's common enough that I've got the glass of red in my hand before we've even gone through Gasworks.

But some of the staff still act like every slice of bread or glass of wine is coming directly out of their wages. I don't understand it. Also why have they started taking the lids away when you order the miniature spirits?

Weekend service tends to be worse, everyone always seems a bit more grumpy, not sure why. But it's better than the weekend service- "Fetch it yourself"- on Great Western.

This is also a mystery to me and has been raised on numerous occasions. No one has given a satisfactory explanation of how the Miniature Spirits are accounted for at the end of the journey.

I wonder if there is a connection between this and the perhaps feigned meanness ....1 for me 1 for you !!!

 

[furgus2]

I very much agree with Arctic Troll's comments. I always enjoy travelling on the 17,30 out of Kings Cross as the crew members are always, in my experience, very efficient, friendly and often start serving the cold drinks even before departure.

It's true that Virgin only do one drinks run on Manchester (and indeed Liverpool and West Midlands trains too) but they nearly always offer one drink on the way out from the kitchen and another on the way back.

 

[Butts]

I very much agree with Arctic Troll's comments. I always enjoy travelling on the 17,30 out of Kings Cross as the crew members are always, in my experience, very efficient, friendly and often start serving the cold drinks even before departure.

It's true that Virgin only do one drinks run on Manchester (and indeed Liverpool and West Midlands trains too) but they nearly always offer one drink on the way out from the kitchen and another on the way back.

So the morale of that story is don't sit in the carriage furthest from the kitchen.

I had 5 doubles on a journey from B'Ham Int to Euston a couple of weeks ago

 

[Chrism20]

Much better on the 1818 back to Edinburgh.

One of the regular team leaders is onboard and the service good.

About 50% in first. Managed to bag a drink in and out and just had the mushroom parcel.

Very relaxed even with the riggers drinking cider like it's going out of fashion.

Why can't it always be like this?

 

[Blindtraveler]

The 18:18x ABD is always a good service and I think restocked in terms of food n drink at EDB.

 

[Chrism20]

The 18:18x ABD is always a good service and I think restocked in terms of food n drink at EDB.

Yup, the afternoon tea and all day menu stock is loaded onto the 14:32 from EDB with afternoon tea up to Aberdeen and allday menu back down on the 1818.

It's restocked again before it leaves EDB for the rest of the journey to LDS.

Works similar to the breakfasts being loaded the night before for the morning ABD and INV turns IIRC

 

[PaxVobiscum]

Completely OT, but if you are not viewing on a small mobile device and have a decent connection, have a look at this for an idea of first class travel should be like.
It's the account of a chap who used his Air Miles to travel on the 23000 Singapore Airlines Suites Class.

East Coast 1st Class is not quite there I'm afraid, and it's a little bit better than the Caledonian Sleeper (but there are some similarities).

 

[Butts]

Completely OT, but if you are not viewing on a small mobile device and have a decent connection, have a look at this for an idea of first class travel should be like.
It's the account of a chap who used his Air Miles to travel on the 23000 Singapore Airlines Suites Class.

East Coast 1st Class is not quite there I'm afraid, and it's a little bit better than the Caledonian Sleeper (but there are some similarities).

All that's missing is an Ashtray

Are you sure Singapore Airlines didn't copy a Pacer for that layout.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

. . . .

I've been on the last one from Aberdeen about a dozen times this year and have never seen first less than 65% full. It always normally goes into P2 at Waverley so you have to walk the full length of the train to get onto the main station and from looking in the windows standard is always usually around 50% full. . . . .

It's often brought into platform 19. It can catch out passengers and even the crew (in fact it did just that on Wednesday, with some red faces)!

I wasn't happy - I boarded at Waverley expecting to eat on the train as usual, not getting home until about 11pm. No food orders were taken, so I asked at the galley after Berwick and got the reply (from the 2 crew who had boarded at Edin) that they thought everyone had been served. Presumably that meant that they would not expect to serve food to any passengers - either they wuld have already been served by the previous crew who brought it into Edin. or, like me, they boarded at Edinburgh and simply wouldn't be served any more than drinks.

Yes, I was offered sandwiches, but they wouldn't offer me anything hot.

 

[Chrism20]

It's often brought into platform 19. It can catch out passengers and even the crew (in fact it did just that on Wednesday, with some red faces)!

I wasn't happy - I boarded at Waverley expecting to eat on the train as usual, not getting home until about 11pm. No food orders were taken, so I asked at the galley after Berwick and got the reply (from the 2 crew who had boarded at Edin) that they thought everyone had been served. Presumably that meant that they would not expect to serve food to any passengers - either they wuld have already been served by the previous crew who brought it into Edin. or, like me, they boarded at Edinburgh and simply wouldn't be served any more than drinks.

Yes, I was offered sandwiches, but they wouldn't offer me anything hot.

I was on that service on Wednesday night and got off at Haymarket - there was plenty of hot food. Whilst they were cleaning up (between Kirkcaldy and Inverkeithing) David the Team Leader - one of the best EC have IMO said to one of the other staff to set up the kitchen for the new crew and to leave out the chicken and mushroom that's left as they will use it!

I can only assume they have binned it!

 

[DaveNewcastle]

. . . David the Team Leader - one of the best EC have IMO . . .

Hah! Yes, I agree, I spoke with him briefly on the platform that night.

. . . said to one of the other staff to set up the kitchen for the new crew and to leave out the chicken and mushroom that's left as they will use it!

Yes, that's correct. But very sadly, the 3 Leeds crew who took over didn't!

 

[Chrism20]

Hah! Yes, I agree, I spoke with him briefly on the platform that night.

Yes, he is one of the best without a doubt.

Yes, that's correct. But very sadly, the 3 Leeds crew who took over didn't!

They clearly don't realise how easily they can be caught out!

There obviously wasn't a manager (on or off duty) on the service. That's is the problem with some of the late turns if no one is watching they get away with murder.

The 19:54 From Newcastle to Edinburgh is another one that is bad for this. There is an XC at 19:35 followed by an EC at 19:45 and another EC at 19:54 all going to Edinburgh. Obviously everyone gets on one of the first two which means there is only a handful getting on the 19:54 - I have been the only one boarding First some nights and sit in K and don't even get offered a tea or coffee let alone anything stronger, I do though have to sit and listen to the crews love lives etc and what they are doing at the weekend. I've had to get up around Alnmouth a few times and go and place an order.

 

[MichaelJP59]

Has there been a change in attitude recently in the EC crews? I haven't travelled FC for a while having slummed it in Standard for a few months (Retford-Leeds).

First one was the chap who went past asking if I wanted a refill of tea without breaking stride. "Thanks!" I said pushing my cup forward but he was already several metres up the carriage. Asked the 2nd chap and in a few minutes the 1st one came back.
"My colleague says you want more tea but I asked you and you said nothing!" he complained, begrudgingly refilling my cup.

Second one: Getting off the train at Leeds there was a pile of the complimentary 'bite size' crisp packets on the counter. "OK to take a bag of crisps?" I said to the seated girl in the crew area. Nothing was said so I took one.
"Excuse me, you can take it, but you don't have to hide it. They're not for breakfast anyway" she piped up from her sedentary position. "Sorry, but I did ask", I replied. "No, you didn't" came her rapid retort.

Nothing major, but this isn't a one off; service and attitude should be far better towards the customer. Hopefully there will be a major shakeup when the new franchise is awarded.

 

[Chrism20]

Ah yes the East Coast Catering Lottery strikes again.

What is really needed is a travel critic/reporter or one of the big online travel bloggers to take a few trips on EC, preferably with undercover recording equipment so that they can produce evidence.

As everyone says when the service is good it's great, unfortunately there is nothing in between great and grim. You only have to look at DaveNewcastle's experience and mine from last week where we were both on the same service but at different times to see how wildly the service can vary.

 

[ModernRailways]

Has there been a change in attitude recently in the EC crews? I haven't travelled FC for a while having slummed it in Standard for a few months (Retford-Leeds).

First one was the chap who went past asking if I wanted a refill of tea without breaking stride. "Thanks!" I said pushing my cup forward but he was already several metres up the carriage. Asked the 2nd chap and in a few minutes the 1st one came back.
"My colleague says you want more tea but I asked you and you said nothing!" he complained, begrudgingly refilling my cup.

Second one: Getting off the train at Leeds there was a pile of the complimentary 'bite size' crisp packets on the counter. "OK to take a bag of crisps?" I said to the seated girl in the crew area. Nothing was said so I took one.
"Excuse me, you can take it, but you don't have to hide it. They're not for breakfast anyway" she piped up from her sedentary position. "Sorry, but I did ask", I replied. "No, you didn't" came her rapid retort.

Nothing major, but this isn't a one off; service and attitude should be far better towards the customer. Hopefully there will be a major shakeup when the new franchise is awarded.

This has been my experience too lately. Staff simply seem uninterested, and as if you are making them do something. They were really quite attentive previously, but the past year or so they've significantly dropped in quality and I now tend to travel Standard since I get better service from the Self Service machine in Tesco

 

[MichaelJP59]

It does seem to have got worse in the last six months. Perhaps there's a downturn in staff morale with the franchise decision coming up and associated uncertainty.

I mainly go FC just for the extra table space for working, but you do tend to be made to feel that the staff are doing you a favour by serving you.

 

[Starmill]

I've sent Customer Relations a letter about one journey where I thought the service was a long way below the standard. It'll be interesting to see how they reply

 

[Chrism20]

I've sent Customer Relations a letter about one journey where I thought the service was a long way below the standard. It'll be interesting to see how they reply

Yes I have also sent one regarding the shambles that was the 10:28 EDB-ABD last Wednesday although going by previous correspondence I'm not holding out much hope.

 

[Marton]

Great service tonight as usual on 1730.


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[ModernRailways]

Great service tonight as usual on 1730.


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1700, 1730, and 2000 are the best trains out of Cross for FC on a weekday. The problem is they're the only decent services now, everything is else is just sub-par.

 

[ainsworth74]

I feel I must stand up for the 1819 as I've used it a few times now and it's always had really good service. Food delivered quickly, staff friendly and drinks/snacks provided often.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

1700, 1730, and 2000 are the best trains out of Cross for FC on a weekday. The problem is they're the only decent services now, everything is else is just sub-par.

Ahem!

You seem to have missed my preferred service, the 19:00.

I feel I must stand up for the 1819 as I've used it a few times now and it's always had really good service. Food delivered quickly, staff friendly and drinks/snacks provided often.

Indeed ! I was on that one last night, though with some crew from the 17:30.

 

[ModernRailways]

Ahem!

You seem to have missed my preferred service, the 19:00.

I've been on the 1900 twice and both times it was terrible - on one occasion we didn't even get any food, but drinks were only offered once, hot drinks were offered twice. Obviously, there was likely a problem with the supply, however the buffet was still selling sandwiches, biscuits etc. and so why couldn't they have been offered or maybe even discounted for those in First Class.

I've only ever used the 1700, 1730, 1800, 1900, and 2000 out of Cross on an evening as they are the Newcastle services so couldn't comment on the Leeds, Bradford, or Lincoln services.

 

[ainsworth74]

The 1819 is a Newcastle service