Longest line of sight (UK)

Ianno87

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Does anyone know what the furthest north or west of London one can see the Shard ( or another London landmark if that's easier to see)
The little 'ridge' the the M11 goes over near Harlow affords a fantastic view of the London skyline. Pretty sure it includes the Shard.

The Shard is also, IIRC, visible from the windows of Terminal 5 at Heathrow.
 
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Altrincham

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Very interesting thread! I've taken quite a few long distance photos from Sheffield - York Minster, Humber Bridge, Bilsdale transmitter can all clearly be seen on a good day.

A fantastic website for calculating lines of sight is this: https://www.heywhatsthat.com/

It appears that from Cross Fell you *may* be able to see both the North Sea and Irish Sea. From Great Dun Fell, a little lower, I've certainly seen the the latter.
Would be great to see your photos from Sheffield!

That’s incredible about Cross Fell, and I’ve just been looking at Viewfinder Panoramas for that view. Amazing to see that it’s possible to see the Irish Sea off the North Wales coast (to the south/south-west) in one direction and then the North Sea to the north east of Newcastle. That would be an amazing photo to capture and would require phenomenal conditions to see both seas.

http://viewfinderpanoramas.org/panoramas/ENG/CROSS.GIF
 

Altrincham

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Does anyone know what the furthest north or west of London one can see the Shard ( or another London landmark if that's easier to see)
I’ve not been up the Shard but I’ve been on the London Eye and could see a dark stump, sat low on the western horizon, which was Windsor Castle.
 

supersonic525

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Would be great to see your photos from Sheffield!
They are a bit grainy, I have some others somewhere - but you can make out the landmarks. The structures to the far right on the Minster upload are York Racecourse grandstand and Terry's chocolate factory. Can also see York Hospital to the far left.Humber.jpg Bils-horse.jpg minster-1.jpg
 

supersonic525

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It's just under 50 miles from this viewpoint. If you go further west into the hills, it's still easily visible.

I've been trying to work out the longest line of sight just in England, might be able to see the Belmont transmitter from the Dales near Reeth, about 105 miles apart.
 

DerekC

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I have a memory from many years ago of standing with my dad somewhere on the Lleyn Peninsula in Wales and him pointing out that you could see the Wicklow Hills in Ireland. My amateur check suggests that this should be very possible - the probable location in Wales was Rhiw Mountain (301m), from which it is about 115 km to Lugnaquilla (925m) in the Wicklows. Can anybody confirm that this is doable - and has anyone got a photo?

Looking at the map (which I should have done before) I don't think it could have been Rhiw Mountain because I can remember sea in the foreground - so more likely Mynydd Mawr right at the tip of Lleyn which is much lower (~160m)
 
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Comstock

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It's just under 50 miles from this viewpoint. If you go further west into the hills, it's still easily visible.

I've been trying to work out the longest line of sight just in England, might be able to see the Belmont transmitter from the Dales near Reeth, about 105 miles apart.
Thanks. The only reason I'm skeptical about see Belmont from such a distance is it's a long thin transmitter rather than a bloomin great big mountain like Snowdon.

A fun game (well maybe) might be to get from Lands End to JoG viewpoint to viewpoint in the fewest possible hops....
 

najaB

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Thanks. The only reason I'm skeptical about see Belmont from such a distance is it's a long thin transmitter rather than a bloomin great big mountain like Snowdon.
In that case might it be best trying to view the navigation beacon at night?
 

Altrincham

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Altrincham

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Thanks. The only reason I'm skeptical about see Belmont from such a distance is it's a long thin transmitter rather than a bloomin great big mountain like Snowdon.

A fun game (well maybe) might be to get from Lands End to JoG viewpoint to viewpoint in the fewest possible hops....
Using Viewfinder Panoramas, I have looked at how it’s possible to see from the English Channel right up to the Atlantic Ocean at the top of Scotland. (With a bit more research it might be possible to tie-in with Lands End / John o’Groats).

Starting point: Dartmoor (view south to Portland Bill and English Channel)

Dartmoor to Foel Cwmcerwyn (Pembrokeshire)
Foel Cwmcerwyn to Snowdon (Gwynedd)
Snowdon to Merrick/Lamachan Hill (Dumfries & Galloway)
Merrick to Ben Lui (Southern Highlands)
Ben Lui to Ben Macdui (Cairngorms)
Ben Macdui to Ben Hope (Sutherland)

Ending point: Ben Hope (view north to the Atlantic, North Rona, and Orkney)
 

Altrincham

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I did think of that, but would that really be visible 105 miles away?

In this case, seeing would quite literally be believing :D
It seems that Belmont is visible from parts of Derbyshire, so I’d imagine that this is possibly the northern parts of Derbyshire on the South Yorkshire border. A cold night with crystal-clear conditions soon should hopefully show the mast’s lights.
 

Comstock

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Well, you can see asteroids millions of miles away in space so if the line of sight is there then no reason why not.
Asteroids are rather bigger than the lights of Belmont transmitter though!

Possibly you could take an FM radio to the viewpoint and try 102.2 and 94.9, the two local stations on Belmont.

If you could get them, it would be a pretty good sign, although of course FM signals do dip below the horizon a bit.
 

supersonic525

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QUOTE="DerekC, post: 4302458, member: 31961"]Can anybody confirm that this is doable[/QUOTE]

It is indeed doable! Looking at heywhatsthat.com, there are many places in the area of Rhiw where Lugnaquilla can be seen. Mynydd Mawr is further n/w though? Looking at Google Earth.

As for Belmont, only one way to find out, I'll have a look next time I'm up that way - am a frequent visitor to the Tan Hill Inn! Nighttime may well be best as those beacons can be seen from some big distances. Assuming one is right on the top. The picture of the Bilsdale mast I took was from 64 miles away, but would need some really amazing conditions I'd think.
 

Comstock

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I wonder if anyone has ever tried using line of sight walkie talkies to communicate over on of these super long distance views.

I suspect the answer is that it wouldn't work, but in theory there is nothing to block the signal but the atmosphere.
 

najaB

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Not something I'm familar with. What does it say?
Signal strength drops off as the inverse square of distance - so for every doubling of the distance the signal strength drops by four times. Take the signal strength at 1km, double the distance to 2km and the signal strength drops to a quarter of what it was. By the time you get out to the kind of distances being considered here (>100km) the signal strength will be a tiny fraction of normal.

https://energyeducation.ca/encyclopedia/Inverse_square_law
 

Comstock

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Ok, thanks. I have seen some walkie talkies advertised that claim a 50 mile range in 'ideal conditions', whatever that means.

I've no idea if these models are available in the UK, but 50 miles isn't so very far short of 100 km.

My instinct is still that you would get nowt, but might be fun to try.
 

najaB

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Ok, thanks. I have seen some walkie talkies advertised that claim a 50 mile range in 'ideal conditions', whatever that means.
I'm going to call BS on that. TV and radio transmission stations have outputs measured in tens of kilowatts to get coverage ranges that far. I can't see a handheld device being able of generating an equivalent signal.
 

najaB

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Maybe. It's the old 'up to' trick again.
Indeed it is. From the Wikipedia article:
FRS manufacturers generally claim deceptively exaggerated range. The presence of large buildings, trees, etc., will reduce range. Under exceptional conditions, (such as hilltop to hilltop, or over open water) communication is possible at 60 km (37 mi) or more, but that is rare. Under normal conditions, with line of sight blocked by a few buildings or trees, FRS has an actual range of about 0.5 to 1.5 km (0.3 to 1 mile).
They're limited to 2W at maximum so it really would be exceptional if you could manage anything over 10km with any level of reliability.
no idea if these devices are even legal in the UK.
They most certainly are not.
 

The Lad

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You would stand a chance with Amateur kit, up to 100 watts and narrow band Vs broadcast wide band.
Or just go up there with flash guns and a schedule.
 

Comstock

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Certainly, in the days before the FM band filled up you could get really clear reception on stations from Winter Hill and Emley Moor in South Derbyshire with a roof aerial. Thats about 60 to 70 miles. But those stations were 5000 and 2500 watts respectively, a lot more than even the amateur kit.

Anyway, getting slightly off topic.....
 

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