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May 2025 Timetable Change - Confirmed Changes Only

JRT

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Does this mean the Abd to PENZ is being withdrawn permanently or just between May and December timetable changes?
The Aberdeen – Penzance through service will be WITHDRAWN.
There will be an 08:20 Aberdeen – Plymouth train Mondays to Fridays from May. In the reverse direction, there is an 09:27 Plymouth – Aberdeen service on Fridays and Saturdays (terminates at Dundee on other days).
The Scotland – Penzance service is reduced to 1tpd from May, and will operate Edinburgh – Penzance & return.
These changes will continue into the December 2025 timetable.
 
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Goldfish62

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Cross Country services are resuming calling at Camborne. One of the stations which they stopped serving "due to Covid".
 

hexagon789

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Daily Mail reporting this has run for over a Century. Well it did run in the last century but I would guess it probably first ran sometime in the 1980s, anyone got any firm info?
May 1984 for Aberdeen/Penzance (then via the WCML), but a through coach existed in the 20s and 30s.

A Dundee to Penzance HST via the ECML appeared in May 1983 (havibg started the previous year as an Edinburgh to Penzance HST, previously the Edinburgh to Plymouth LHCS working) but was withdrawn in May 1984 as part of the XC HST service reductions that year.
 

hexagon789

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So a gap of perhaps around fifty years between the 30s and the mid 80s.
Started 1921, ended 1939 and not reintroduced post-war though the main inter-regional working to which the through carriage was added did survive. For a spell in the early 1930s, the northbound service started from St Erth, due to lack of platforms at Penzance. The through coach also sometimes only ran to Plymouth. A sleeping car was trialled briefly.

The service also existed on and off a bit in the early privatisation period, in at least one timetable period in the 2000s, the Aberdeen XC service went to Bournemouth and not to Plymouth/Penzance.
 
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The usual T&Cs apply - some trains will be missing, there will be changes before the timetable goes live, definitely don't plan any important medical appointments using them... But some very early (and unformatted) drafts of the May 2025 timetables have been compiled on the RailwayData website - https://www.railwaydata.co.uk/timetables/May25
 

swt_passenger

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Daily Mail reporting this has run for over a Century. Well it did run in the last century but I would guess it probably first ran sometime in the 1980s, anyone got any firm info?
I wonder if the full origin destination figures tell us how many fares are typically sold per annum? It’s presumably below the lowest figure displayed, that’s around 250?
 

Bald Rick

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Daily Mail reporting this has run for over a Century. Well it did run in the last century but I would guess it probably first ran sometime in the 1980s, anyone got any firm info?

I wonder if the full origin destination figures tell us how many fares are typically sold per annum? It’s presumably below the lowest figure displayed, that’s around 250?

I wonder what the Venn diagram is that represents:

1) People who have travelled by train from Aberdeen to Penzance
2) People who have travelled on the through train from Aberdeen to Penzance (currently 1V60)
3) Current regular readers of the Daily Mail.

I bet it’s in low single figures, potentially the roundest number!
 

duffield

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I wonder what the Venn diagram is that represents:

1) People who have travelled by train from Aberdeen to Penzance
2) People who have travelled on the through train from Aberdeen to Penzance (currently 1V60)
3) Current regular readers of the Daily Mail.

I bet it’s in low single figures, potentially the roundest number!
Being picky in a set theory way, as 2) is a proper subset of 1), the intersection of 1), 2) and 3) is identical to the intersection of 2) and 3), so 1) is superfluous in this context. :E
 

Bald Rick

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Being picky in a set theory way, as 2) is a proper subset of 1), the intersection of 1), 2) and 3) is identical to the intersection of 2) and 3), so 1) is superfluous in this context. :E

Dammit, I have out typo’d myself. 1) was supposed to be ‘people who have travelled from Aberdeen to Penzance’.
 

InOban

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The route is inefficient since it involves a great deal of what is more or less ECS working with a very early departure from Edinburgh and I believe a similar return from Penzance back to Plymouth. It exists only for enthusiasts.
 

hux385

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Looks like passenger-service paths for the Camp Hill line are in RTT for the new timetable. Is this a glitch? I thought the stations on the line weren't ready?
 

Farigiraf

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Looks like passenger-service paths for the Camp Hill line are in RTT for the new timetable. Is this a glitch? I thought the stations on the line weren't ready?
Seems to be running non-stop from Kings Norton to New Street. May be too optimistic but I wonder if this is a pre-emptive shuttle service which can have calls added easily enough should the new stations be ready before the timetable change. Most likely too good to be true.
 

lachlan

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I thought about doing Aberdeen-Penzance but didn't get round to it before the service was cut during Covid times. Ah well.

It was faster to change trains three times IIRC than to do the direct train so it must have been a very slow route.
 

hexagon789

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It was faster to change trains three times IIRC than to do the direct train so it must have been a very slow route.
More a combination of longer route via the ECML than WCML, number of stops, some long station dwells.

The average speed was around the 55mph mark.

The route itself is reasonably fast in terms of permissible speeds bar perhaps Dundee to Edinburgh particularly south of Kirkcaldy to the Forth Bridge and Plymouth to Penzance, where curves and gradients tend to restrict fast running.
 

Harpo

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The route itself is reasonably fast in terms of permissible speeds bar perhaps Dundee to Edinburgh
I have heard the Aberdeen main line as having one of the highest numbers of PSR changes on a main line. Is that still the case?
 

lachlan

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More a combination of longer route via the ECML than WCML, number of stops, some long station dwells.

The average speed was around the 55mph mark.

The route itself is reasonably fast in terms of permissible speeds bar perhaps Dundee to Edinburgh particularly south of Kirkcaldy to the Forth Bridge and Plymouth to Penzance, where curves and gradients tend to restrict fast running.
Makes sense - I remember many of the station calls were dropped during covid and the timings were kept the same, IIRC.
 

hexagon789

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I have heard the Aberdeen main line as having one of the highest numbers of PSR changes on a main line. Is that still the case?
Edinburgh to Dundee alone has over 60 speed changes...

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Makes sense - I remember many of the station calls were dropped during covid and the timings were kept the same, IIRC.
Yes, exactly right. At one point all the Fife calls, Dunbar, Chesterfield and one or two others I think were all omitted but timings unchanged.
 

dk1

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I have heard the Aberdeen main line as having one of the highest numbers of PSR changes on a main line. Is that still the case?

PSR changes aside, the East Suffolk is a crazy line just for speed changes at level crossings. With its gradients I was once told it’s one of the most difficult for steam locomotives.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

No changes foreseen for this summers timetable change on this route.
 

Class15

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No changes foreseen for this summers timetable change on this route.
That’s a shame, there used to be a 17:04 Saxmundham to Ipswich that connected neatly with a Norwich to London service at Ipswich. Now that IC service runs earlier, ruining the connection, and the 17:04 running a few minutes earlier would be appreciated!
 

dk1

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That’s a shame, there used to be a 17:04 Saxmundham to Ipswich that connected neatly with a Norwich to London service at Ipswich. Now that IC service runs earlier, ruining the connection, and the 17:04 running a few minutes earlier would be appreciated!

Unfortunately you can’t do much about that. Like the off-pattern 15:54 (SX) Ipswich-Lowestoft (rather than XX:16 for most) as a path exists around that time for the Sizewell flask.
 

Class 170101

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That’s a shame, there used to be a 17:04 Saxmundham to Ipswich that connected neatly with a Norwich to London service at Ipswich. Now that IC service runs earlier, ruining the connection, and the 17:04 running a few minutes earlier would be appreciated!
The Norwich can't run later as it connects at Manningtree for the Harwich branch and it seems to be a pretty reliable connection too.
 

Old Yard Dog

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Cross Country services are resuming calling at Camborne. One of the stations which they stopped serving "due to Covid".

But not on Wednesdays

 

D9006

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40 metres over 100 miles sounds pretty gentle to me! ;)
100 miles Wigan to westhoughton and they cover it roughly 10 mins, nothing wrong with 769s fastest train on the planet, think you find it’s roughly 4 to 5 miles
 

WibbleWobble

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100 miles Wigan to westhoughton and they cover it roughly 10 mins, nothing wrong with 769s fastest train on the planet, think you find it’s roughly 4 to 5 miles
It was a joke, take a closer look at the post I was responding to...
 
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Not sure if it has been mentioned already, but it looks like there may be an extra train in each direction over the Heart of Wales line on Sundays during the summer holidays.

This means that, should the data be correct, and things not change before the timetable goes live, the line will be treated to three trains on Sundays between August 3rd and September 14th, instead of the long running two.
 

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