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Media Coverage of COVID -19

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VauxhallandI

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BBC article saying the Tanzanian government have been telling its citizens that steam treatments help save you from Covid. No such similar comments for the varied random stuff we have been subjected to.


Mr Magufuli has also warned - without providing any evidence - that Covid-19 vaccines could be harmful and has instead been urging Tanzanians to use steam inhalation and herbal medicines, neither of which have been approved by the World Health Organization (WHO) as treatments.
 
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brad465

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BBC article saying the Tanzanian government have been telling its citizens that steam treatments help save you from Covid. No such similar comments for the varied random stuff we have been subjected to.


Mr Magufuli has also warned - without providing any evidence - that Covid-19 vaccines could be harmful and has instead been urging Tanzanians to use steam inhalation and herbal medicines, neither of which have been approved by the World Health Organization (WHO) as treatments.
Tanzania also has a history of albino persecution by witch doctors who use them for so-called magical purposes. Based on that it doesn't surprise me Tanzania has that attitude, but I doubt it will get any sort of following elsewhere, which would likely have happened by now.
 

VauxhallandI

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Tanzania also has a history of albino persecution by witch doctors who use them for so-called magical purposes. Based on that it doesn't surprise me Tanzania has that attitude, but I doubt it will get any sort of following elsewhere, which would likely have happened by now.
No doubt someone will call that we can’t go anywhere until ALL countries are vaccinated down to Primary school age
 

kristiang85

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The Mail is back on form today. The main headline online is saying that the vaccines are still effective against the South African variant's worst effects (unlike other media). Also they have an editorial saying that we need to relax lockdown to save lives.
 

Skimpot flyer

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Sir Charles Walker gave an excellent interview on Channel 4. The biggest breath of common sense I’ve heard in months.
The interview starts at 3m10s

Good quotes are
I’m really sorry, but I’m not getting into this game where somehow, a death from coronavirus is different from a death from cancer, a death from heart disease. We accept that 20,000 people die from flu each year, we accept that 617,000 people die every year from old age; but somehow, you’re not allowed to die from coronavirus. Ever. We CANNOT cancel life, to preserve every life.
 

NorthOxonian

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Sir Charles Walker gave an excellent interview on Channel 4. The biggest breath of common sense I’ve heard in months.
The interview starts at 3m10s

Good quotes are
Just make sure you stop watching past 7m 45s, unless you want to hear some of the most patronising twaddle I think I've ever heard.

Not wanting millions of people to suffer and all of our lives to be put on hold is completely different to "throwing a tantrum because you want a unicorn for your birthday". If anything, I'd suggest the Zero Covid approach advocated by Devi Sridhar and her ilk is much more like wishing for a unicorn, frankly.

On the topic of the thread, it's interesting how Charles Walker is immediately followed by a Zero Covid zealot to counter all of his points. I can't help but feel like you wouldn't get that the other way round.
 

Yew

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On the topic of the thread, it's interesting how Charles Walker is immediately followed by a Zero Covid zealot to counter all of his points. I can't help but feel like you wouldn't get that the other way round.
Can't let them risk that they'll have to stand up for their claims, old chap.
 

Skimpot flyer

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Just make sure you stop watching past 7m 45s, unless you want to hear some of the most patronising twaddle I think I've ever heard.

Not wanting millions of people to suffer and all of our lives to be put on hold is completely different to "throwing a tantrum because you want a unicorn for your birthday". If anything, I'd suggest the Zero Covid approach advocated by Devi Sridhar and her ilk is much more like wishing for a unicorn, frankly.

On the topic of the thread, it's interesting how Charles Walker is immediately followed by a Zero Covid zealot to counter all of his points. I can't help but feel like you wouldn't get that the other way round.
I guess I’m suffering from confirmation bias, because I only watched the Charles Walker interview. There’s no need to watch someone else parroting the ‘accepted’ media viewpoint. It’s everywhere, quite literally in my face at bus stops, railway stations etc
 

Bikeman78

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Just make sure you stop watching past 7m 45s, unless you want to hear some of the most patronising twaddle I think I've ever heard.

Not wanting millions of people to suffer and all of our lives to be put on hold is completely different to "throwing a tantrum because you want a unicorn for your birthday". If anything, I'd suggest the Zero Covid approach advocated by Devi Sridhar and her ilk is much more like wishing for a unicorn, frankly.

On the topic of the thread, it's interesting how Charles Walker is immediately followed by a Zero Covid zealot to counter all of his points. I can't help but feel like you wouldn't get that the other way round.
The comparison with Australia is interesting. I doubt the UK track and trace system will ever get cases that low. No boubt we'll have the double whammy of no foreign holidays and continued masks etc. The idea that quarantine is the solution to international travel is very strange. I'd be reluctant to sit in a hotel 10 days if it were free never minding paying £1750 for the privilege.
 

kristiang85

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Sky News have this very promising article from India.


Scientists have been left confused by the plummeting rate of coronavirus infections in India - particularly because the country was at one point on course for the biggest toll worldwide.

Nearly 100,000 infections were reported each day during India's peak, but this has taken an unexplained tumble since September to around 11,000 a day.

Official figures in November also showed 90% of New Delhi's critical care beds with ventilators were filled, whereas just 16% were full last Thursday.

Vaccines have so far been ruled out as a reason alone as the country's jab programme didn't begin until January - although this is expected to brighten the outlook even further.


The Indian government has suggested compulsory mask-wearing in public may have helped, especially due to hefty fines that follow violations in some cities.

But experts say it can't only be attributed to masks as declining case numbers appear to be uniform across the country, whereas mask-wearing fluctuates in different areas.

"If we don't know the reason, you could unknowingly be doing things that could lead to a flare-up," said Dr Shahid Jameel, who studies viruses at India's Ashoka University.

Meanwhile, Vineeta Bal, who studies immune systems at India's National Institute of Immunology, said some large areas may have reached herd immunity, although the population as a whole remains vulnerable, particularly in the face of new variants.

A nationwide antibody screening by national health agencies found that one in five Indians had caught the virus before vaccinations had begun - a rate far below the estimated 70% necessary for herd immunity.

Despite this, the survey also showed that more people had been infected in cities rather than villages, and that the virus was moving slower through these rural areas.

"Rural areas have lesser crowd density, people work in open spaces more and homes are much more ventilated," said Dr K Srinath Reddy, president of the Public Health Foundation of India.

Therefore, he added, if some cities are edging toward achieving herd immunity, and also taking precautions with masks and social distancing, then the slower transmission in rural areas of India may provide an explanation for the sudden drop in cases.

India has recorded more than 10.9 million cases and 155,813 deaths since the pandemic began, according to Johns Hopkins University, but it has the world's second-biggest population with more than 1.3 billion residents.

I've highlighted the most interesting comments.

But these drops are mirrored worldwide, so it is important to try to find out why, as otherwise NPIs might be potentially damaging the effort or are simply pointless right now.
 

brad465

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Yes having long watched India's stats I do think herd immunity has been reached here. This is their key stats:

1613484034235.png 1613484056700.png

They have flatlined recently but at a very low level, so it's possible this is now just background noise for them. It's also worth pointing out the peak occurred during their monsoon season if this has any influence on Covid spreading, where their peak summer is April and May (although escaping the heat might put them indoors more).

Wasn't 100% sure where to post this, but it appears the Dutch curfew violates right to free movement and a court has ordered its removal:


A court in The Hague has told the Dutch government that an overnight curfew to reduce the spread of coronavirus should be lifted immediately, ruling that it breaches the right to free movement.

The court said the 21:00 to 04:30 curfew was imposed by an emergency law when there was no "acute emergency".

The decision is a victory for campaign group Viruswaarheid (Virus Truth).

Prime Minister Mark Rutte urged people to follow the curfew, even if ministers failed to stop it being lifted.

The government asked the court to suspend its decision until an appeal is heard at the end of the week. Unless the court agrees, ministers will be unable to prevent the curfew from being lifted on Tuesday night. Police have said they are prepared for both scenarios.

"We haven't for a second considered scrapping the curfew as it is simply necessary," said Mr Rutte, who described the ruling as a setback. The cabinet is urgently working on a new law to enforce the curfew, but that could take time.

Curfews have been widely used in Europe to restrict movement. France has had a nightly curfew from 18:00 but has stopped short of imposing a third lockdown. Greece has also imposed curfews, as have Spain and Italy.
 
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Darandio

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I wasn't sure whether this should have been in the supermarket thread but that is closed so can you please let me offer my apologies as it is an article from the Sun. However, the video is on Youtube as well as other sites and Morrisons have responded to Big Brother Watch on Twitter in relation to it.

It's not that long ago people on here were laughed at for suggesting similarities with Jewish stars but that is exactly where we are at right now when things like this are happening. For those of you on here who have ridiculed people not wanting to openly display their exemption status by comparing it to something like blue badge in your car window, hang your heads in shame.


MORRISONS staff have sparked fury after threatening to call police when a disabled customer refused to wear a yellow sticker so he could shop without a face mask.

The supermarket giant has apologised to the shopper after footage showed a security guard telling him he would need to wear a sticker to identify himself as someone with a face mask exemption.

Face masks are mandatory in supermarkets in England and Wales but shoppers with certain disabilities and physical or mental conditions are exempt.

Exemption cards or badges are available but are not required by law.

Footage shared on social media shows staff telling the shopper - who says he has a 'medical exemption' - that 'new Morrisons policy' requires him to wear a sticker to reassure other shoppers.

Another staff member says she is going to call police as the shopper refuses to accept the sticker.

The security guard says: "It's new Morrisons policy we're rolling out that everyone has to wear a mask or [with] an exemption letter you wear a sticker.

"It's more to explain to the other people in the store that you are exempt and that's why you haven't got a mask on."

The shopper replies: "I shouldn't need to explain to other people, I've got a medical exemption that should be enough.

"I shouldn't have to declare my medical exemption that's a Discrimination Act thing.

"If they ask me , I can tell them, I'm perfectly capable of communicating myself to them."

Morrisons has now apologised and said there is no policy requiring people exempt for wearing face masks to wear stickers.

A spokeswoman said: "We can confirm that this is very much an isolated incident and not Morrisons policy.

"We're sorry the customer has had this experience, as our store marshals are well trained and understanding of those who are medically exempt.
 

scotrail158713

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I wasn't sure whether this should have been in the supermarket thread but that is closed so can you please let me offer my apologies as it is an article from the Sun. However, the video is on Youtube as well as other sites and Morrisons have responded to Big Brother Watch on Twitter in relation to it.

It's not that long ago people on here were laughed at for suggesting similarities with Jewish stars but that is exactly where we are at right now when things like this are happening. For those of you on here who have ridiculed people not wanting to openly display their exemption status by comparing it to something like blue badge in your car window, hang your heads in shame.

It’s disgraceful. I’m not even in Morrisons very often, but I still decided to lodge an official complaint with them. I’m glad to see they’ve backtracked and it was only an “isolated” incident.
 

RomeoCharlie71

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Anecdotally, Morrisons seem to be the most heavy-handed at enforcing restrictions. I've heard of one case where there were multiple security guards dotted around the store back in July ensuring shoppers were wearing face coverings, using the hand sanitiser and trolley wipes at the door and following the ticky-box one-way system up and down every aisle.
 

DerekC

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It's not that long ago people on here were laughed at for suggesting similarities with Jewish stars but that is exactly where we are at right now when things like this are happening.
I am not commenting on the desirability or otherwise of exemption badges, but the comparison is totally out of order. The politest thing I can find to say is that I think you had better re-read your 20th Century history.
 

Darandio

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I am not commenting on the desirability or otherwise of exemption badges, but the comparison is totally out of order. The politest thing I can find to say is that I think you had better re-read your 20th Century history.

I really don't need to re-read up on anything. What I would suggest is offering that pearl of wisdom to those who dream up these hair-brained schemes in order to demand that those with hidden disabilities stand out from the crowd.

I'm not affected but there are many on here who are and have pointed out multiple times that is exactly how it is making them feel.
 

6862

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I wasn't sure whether this should have been in the supermarket thread but that is closed so can you please let me offer my apologies as it is an article from the Sun. However, the video is on Youtube as well as other sites and Morrisons have responded to Big Brother Watch on Twitter in relation to it.

It's not that long ago people on here were laughed at for suggesting similarities with Jewish stars but that is exactly where we are at right now when things like this are happening. For those of you on here who have ridiculed people not wanting to openly display their exemption status by comparing it to something like blue badge in your car window, hang your heads in shame.


This is awful, must be terrible for the people affected (I hate wearing a muzzle but it must be doubly bad for people who can't wear one and feel forced into doing it).

I am not commenting on the desirability or otherwise of exemption badges, but the comparison is totally out of order. The politest thing I can find to say is that I think you had better re-read your 20th Century history.

I don't think Darandio's comparison is 'out of order' - as I see it he is pointing out that we could be at the beginning of a slippery slope. He's not making light of what the Jews suffered at the hands of Hitler (I assume that's why you say it's out of order), but rather expressing concern that we don't blindly head in the direction of something that (even remotely) resembles that.
 

ScotRail158725

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Anecdotally, Morrisons seem to be the most heavy-handed at enforcing restrictions. I've heard of one case where there were multiple security guards dotted around the store back in July ensuring shoppers were wearing face coverings, using the hand sanitiser and trolley wipes at the door and following the ticky-box one-way system up and down every aisle.
Reckon this then varies from area to area or store to store. Im a Morrisons employee and at my shop i can probably count on one hand the number of staff who actually challenge people without masks and same goes for others in the region while during trips to saisnsburys ive seen harsh one-way systems, always been told only one person can enter, and ive also seen people challenged for not socially distancing
 

MikeWM

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I don't think Darandio's comparison is 'out of order' - as I see it he is pointing out that we could be at the beginning of a slippery slope. He's not making light of what the Jews suffered at the hands of Hitler (I assume that's why you say it's out of order), but rather expressing concern that we don't blindly head in the direction of something that (even remotely) resembles that.

Of course it wasn't just the Jews who suffered terribly under Hitler, though they were the largest group. The physically disabled, mentally disabled, gay people, ethnic minorities, Roma, and political opponents were all caught up in the utter horrors caused by those evil people. Basically anyone who they decided didn't 'fit in' to the new, 'pure' society they wanted to create.

Interestingly, one of the ways the Jews were marginalised was by the Nazi propaganda that they spread diseases and so you should stay away from them for fear you may catch something bad. Quarantine signs were often posted at the entrance to ghettos to dissuade ordinary Germans from wandering in and seeing what was happening.

Is forcing disabled people to wear a sticker in a supermarket the same as that? No, of course it isn't. But all such horrors start somewhere, and the common theme is always the marginalisation and identification of the 'different'. When the state or its agents begin to do so, alarm bells should be ringing very loudly.
 

Simon11

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Almost two million people have not worked for at least six months because of the economic impact of the pandemic, according to a report.

Those people affected are either unemployed or fully furloughed, the Resolution Foundation says.

Among workers currently employed, 8% either expect to lose their jobs in the next three months, or have been told they will be made redundant, the think tank adds.

It is calling for the furlough scheme to remain in place for several months after lockdown restrictions are eased, to allow employers time to recover.

"Job insecurity remains high, particularly among those who have spent long periods not working," says Nye Cominetti, senior economist at the Resolution Foundation.

It says support should be tailored to sectors of the economy hit hardest, such as hospitality.

The Treasury says the government will continue to invest in protecting and creating jobs, adding "the next stage of our plan for jobs" will be set out at the forthcoming Budget.

The above story is from BBC news, and hopefully opens some eyes in government. Huge impact on people's well being, the economy and concerns for the future.

I struggled to cope with two weeks holiday over Christmas without much to do and I cannot even start to think about the challenges people would face not being in work for six months.
 

birchesgreen

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One of my best friends was unlucky enough to be made redundant just before Lockdown 1.0 and has been unemployed since. I do see him now and then (socially distanced of course!) and I worry about his mental well being as I really can see a decline.
 

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I am not commenting on the desirability or otherwise of exemption badges, but the comparison is totally out of order. The politest thing I can find to say is that I think you had better re-read your 20th Century history.
Oh, we're only making you wear a star of david.
Oh, we're only sending you into a specific area of your city that you can't leave.
Oh, we're only forcing you off to POW type camps, nothing will happen, honest! They're just labor camps, nothing to be afraid of.

Darandio is right to make those comparisons.
 

Darandio

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In my defence I was merely repeating the comparisons already made on here by people who are actively having to deal with people demanding their exemption status day in day out. They had already stated that wearing any type of exemption symbol was making them feel like this. Many posts ridiculed them, dismissing them as silly if they mentioned comparisons with the star and that they should just get on with it, it's no worse than displaying a blue badge.

Considering it was a (often yellow) symbol during the Holocaust to identify Jewish people and with the news yesterday that Morrisons (possibly in isolated cases) were demanding those with exemptions had to wear a yellow sticker, it's fairly obvious that these comparisons are going to appear.

Got an exemption from wearing a mask but refuse to tell us what it is, as is your right? Right, wear this yellow sticker (star) so you can be identified.
 

StationTown

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I am not commenting on the desirability or otherwise of exemption badges, but the comparison is totally out of order. The politest thing I can find to say is that I think you had better re-read your 20th Century history.

Completely agree. The comparison is repugnant and displays a concerning ignorance of history.
 

greyman42

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The above story is from BBC news, and hopefully opens some eyes in government. Huge impact on people's well being, the economy and concerns for the future.

I struggled to cope with two weeks holiday over Christmas without much to do and I cannot even start to think about the challenges people would face not being in work for six months.

And how many of those face redundancy once furlough ends?
 

Richard Scott

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Completely agree. The comparison is repugnant and displays a concerning ignorance of history.
I'm not so sure it does. This started with one person's dislike of a race. Not sure I'd have used the comparison but can see why the poster did. We never stop learning from history and best we never have attitude that these things can't happen again. Think the disintegration of Yogoslavia in early 1990s shows that it can. Maybe that was on a smaller scale but appalling nonetheless.
 

VauxhallandI

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Completely agree. The comparison is repugnant and displays a concerning ignorance of history.
I believe its more repugnant to deny the similarity of the process. Promises of cash for big firms and the I'm alright jack attitude of the masses is how things like this happen. Ignorance of it having seen the consequences of it so recently is quite scary. By the time it comes to your door it will be too late; your frog will have boiled.
 

6862

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Completely agree. The comparison is repugnant and displays a concerning ignorance of history.

Why is it 'repugnant' to point out that making someone wear a badge that shows they are different to the majority of other people is something we should view with great trepidation? This is going very off topic on the media thread!
 

island

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I do not see an issue with asking someone to wear a visible but discreet symbol of some sort to indicate that they have declared their exemption to a staff member, so that they are not repeatedly challenged.
 

VauxhallandI

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I do not see an issue with asking someone to wear a visible but discreet symbol of some sort to indicate that they have declared their exemption to a staff member, so that they are not repeatedly challenged.
I'd rather be repeatedly asked by staff. Maybe if staff are reminded that there are goons at every door so once they are in then they can stand down their heroic questioning.
 
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