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Merseyrail legacy fleet updates (Class 507/508)

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D6700

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507003+507023
507018+507029
507001+507017

All out today on diagrams 1, 2 & 3, respectively, as per the diagrams quoted in post 2663 above.
 
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507016

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Currently sat at Southport and there’s a
507 in the CHS, does anybody know what unit it is, my best guess would be 016 but I can’t see it’s unit number
 

D7666

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507003+507023
507018+507029
507001+507017

All out today on diagrams 1, 2 & 3, respectively, as per the diagrams quoted in post 2663 above.
Dang you beat me to it i.e. to confirm them out; all 3 pairs had this afternoon / evening.

Remind me of the recent froth which unit is the alleged very loud 507 now ? I'm "oooop norrff" until Friday although it might be Friday before next I board a 507.

Posted from Swan & Railway in Wigan .
 

prod_pep

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Currently sat at Southport and there’s a
507 in the CHS, does anybody know what unit it is, my best guess would be 016 but I can’t see it’s unit number
507007 is the spare at Southport, having moved from Kirkdale on Saturday evening I believe. 016 is still firmly tucked away at the back of Birkenhead North shed.
 

507016

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507007 is the spare at Southport, having moved from Kirkdale on Saturday evening I believe. 016 is still firmly tucked away at the back of Birkenhead North shed.
Ah ok, I’m guessing 016 is still being repaired from the brake fault, also I was having a journey on 018 earlier and as I was on my home journey to Brunswick the driver turned rheostatics on whilst moving, a bit odd seeing as they didn’t engage approaching south parkway or Cressington, either way hopefully nobody turns them off, also are there any plans to get 016 on the wheel lathe soon? as it’s got a pretty bad flat spot in 64382
 

WirralLine

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Ah ok, I’m guessing 016 is still being repaired from the brake fault, also I was having a journey on 018 earlier and as I was on my home journey to Brunswick the driver turned rheostatics on whilst moving, a bit odd seeing as they didn’t engage approaching south parkway or Cressington, either way hopefully nobody turns them off, also are there any plans to get 016 on the wheel lathe soon? as it’s got a pretty bad flat spot in 64382
It's worth noting that the rheostatic can be switched on but the conditions for it to become active arn't met. It only applies if the camshaft has been notched up to at least full series or above. Some drivers I've noticed shut off power (having notched above full series meaning dynamic would become active when brakes applied), but then reapply power to a low notch and shut off again, meaning the camshaft notches back to the starting position/below full series. You then won't get rheostatic braking. Some drivers do this so they can set off from stations quicker as they don't have to wait for the camshaft to notch back down to the start position (so once the driver applies power from a stand, you can tell what position the camshaft was in by the number of contactor clicks and clunks before it actually sets off) - if there is just one clunk and away it goes, it wouldn't have been in a high enough notch for rheostatic to be active.

Also the rheostatic only kicks in at around 60mph and below, so if doing say 70mph it'll be disc braking only to around 60, and the dynamic will then takeover. Finally if the unit detects wheelslip under rheo braking, it'll cut it out and resort to disc braking only while the WSP (Wheel slip protection) does its thing.

Hope this helps!
 

St. Paddy

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It's worth noting that the rheostatic can be switched on but the conditions for it to become active arn't met. It only applies if the camshaft has been notched up to at least full series or above. Some drivers I've noticed shut off power (having notched above full series meaning dynamic would become active when brakes applied), but then reapply power to a low notch and shut off again, meaning the camshaft notches back to the starting position/below full series. You then won't get rheostatic braking. Some drivers do this so they can set off from stations quicker as they don't have to wait for the camshaft to notch back down to the start position (so once the driver applies power from a stand, you can tell what position the camshaft was in by the number of contactor clicks and clunks before it actually sets off) - if there is just one clunk and away it goes, it wouldn't have been in a high enough notch for rheostatic to be active.

Also the rheostatic only kicks in at around 60mph and below, so if doing say 70mph it'll be disc braking only to around 60, and the dynamic will then takeover. Finally if the unit detects wheelslip under rheo braking, it'll cut it out and resort to disc braking only while the WSP (Wheel slip protection) does its thing.

Hope this helps!
If it’s anything like the rheo brake on a 313 which was a pile of doodoo, just trip the mcb in the cab. That’s what 99% of Great Northern Drivers did ;)
 

8A Rail

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I’ve seen the last coach of 508201 is now on a low loader… is it heading for scrap?
As you have seen it on a low loader, could you advise where you have seen it please as that may give a clue for its possible destination. I'm under the impression either that or it's mate or both were going under cover at Seacombe.
 

prod_pep

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I’ve seen the last coach of 508201 is now on a low loader… is it heading for scrap?
I don't want to betray anyone's confidence, so please excuse the vagueness, but this carriage is not for scrap. Hopefully an official announcement is imminent.
 

Josh01

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Looks like a heritage railway the pacer to the bottom right gives that hint?
 

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86246

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I visited Liverpool today partly to see these units for the final time.

507001 is out on its own. It was on the diagram 1 from above (11:21 from Hunts Cross) but was on the 13:12 from Southport departure.

507010 and 507029 ran empty from Kirkdale and were on that 12:42 from Southport instead.

507003 & 507023 are on diagram 2. 507018 and 507007 were out earlier but now presumably replaced by 010 & 029.

Thanks to those who have provided information in this thread as that has helped the planning for today.
 

M28361M

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508201's fate revealed. From Peter Spokes of the 400 Series Preservation Group on Twitter/X:
Following 18-months of careful planning and negotiation, the last surviving vehicle of unit 508201 (508001) is to return home to Kent. The 508/2 has direct links to the local area with plans in place for its restoration and future use.

The @ESTCWirral have very kindly donated the vehicle for preservation which departed their site in Birkenhead on 19th July for temporary secure storage. It will be based at the @EastKentRailway under the ownership of the "400 Series Preservation Group"

The driving car of 508201 will, post restoration & modification, be made fit for passenger traffic before it takes on its eventual role as a translator vehicle for 313201 to enable the unit to be hauled on preserved lines with an air-braked locomotive
 

507016

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Just a question about 016s Rheostatics, I was on the 6:17 out of Brunswick to hunts cross on a spotting day out a few weeks ago and approaching st Michael’s it’s Rheostatics turned on and then very violenty cut power to the motors and then I haven’t witnessed it happen since, what actually needs repairing for Rheostatic brakes to work and how come 016s blipped on for a short while?
 

prod_pep

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Just delightful news regarding 508201. Those of us who contribute towards 313201 were informed three weeks ago, but no need to bite the tongue any longer.

It's hard to believe that 508201's last passenger working was as long ago as 8th December 2006. Now, after 17 years of dodging the cutter's torch, one of its carriages is finally preserved.
 

D7666

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Earlier person on track Waterloo

Southport line in Kaos; guess where I am .

1257 is 507 010 029 per gen

1242 was cancelled (well from Southport anyway)

507 001 in Southport sdgs
 

Vinnym

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Earlier person on track Waterloo

Southport line in Kaos; guess where I am .

1257 is 507 010 029 per gen

1242 was cancelled (well from Southport anyway)

507 001 in Southport sdgs
Merseyrail website was reporting this disruption and stated that it was due to a trespasser at Walton which didn’t make any sense until I read your post and the trespasser was actually at Waterloo. Poor show when they cannot get their facts right.
 

D7666

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1257 passed un/id 2x507 at Hall Road; loss of WiFi so at time could not post; and I not saw numbers; it might have been empty

1257 before LLParkway passed 507 007 + 018 on 1351 Hunts Cross

So assume the 6car passed was 507 003 + 023

Service had recovered by 14:00 or so but obviously units now in wrong places


_

Waterloo was what they (Northern) said at Southport.

Wrong station TLA selected or auto complete. Human error, nothing deeper than that.

I have to say at Southport there were 3 very alert helpful and informed staff who seemed to know what was going on and directing normals appropriately.. albeit helpless with huge service gaps
 
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Tynwald

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Just a question about 016s Rheostatics, I was on the 6:17 out of Brunswick to hunts cross on a spotting day out a few weeks ago and approaching st Michael’s it’s Rheostatics turned on and then very violenty cut power to the motors and then I haven’t witnessed it happen since, what actually needs repairing for Rheostatic brakes to work and how come 016s blipped on for a short while?
Traction motors, i would think.
 

karlbbb

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It's worth noting that the rheostatic can be switched on but the conditions for it to become active arn't met. It only applies if the camshaft has been notched up to at least full series or above. Some drivers I've noticed shut off power (having notched above full series meaning dynamic would become active when brakes applied), but then reapply power to a low notch and shut off again, meaning the camshaft notches back to the starting position/below full series. You then won't get rheostatic braking. Some drivers do this so they can set off from stations quicker as they don't have to wait for the camshaft to notch back down to the start position (so once the driver applies power from a stand, you can tell what position the camshaft was in by the number of contactor clicks and clunks before it actually sets off) - if there is just one clunk and away it goes, it wouldn't have been in a high enough notch for rheostatic to be active.

Also the rheostatic only kicks in at around 60mph and below, so if doing say 70mph it'll be disc braking only to around 60, and the dynamic will then takeover. Finally if the unit detects wheelslip under rheo braking, it'll cut it out and resort to disc braking only while the WSP (Wheel slip protection) does its thing.

Hope this helps!
Reading things like this, as well as trying out "older" locos on Train Sim, really makes me appreciate how far controls systems have come, and how much is now abstracted away from the driver and the modern combined brake/power handles.
 
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