• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

MML Electrification: progress updates

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
15,202
Location
Bristol
The end of useable wiring needs to be at least 250m north of the signal to reverse a 12-car 360. Assuming there isn't an additional shunting signal to allow reversal closer to the crossover, there are only two supports north of the signal (the taller one looks too close to the others to be an independent support). If the wires from the south are anchored onto the nearer one there certainly isn't enough length to reverse anything more than maybe a 4-car and even that is pretty doubtful. Hoping @Nottingham59's theory is correct, as it would be very useful for future work if they could put the Corby calls into diverted 810s and run the 360s to terminate at MH.
The signals controlling the crossovers are north of the bridge from where the photo is taken. There is no closer shunt signals. Assuming the portal shown is the limit of this phase of electrification, then trains would only be able to run Kettering-MH-Kettering by utilising the wrong-direction signalling.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Verulamius

Member
Joined
30 Jul 2014
Messages
289
Power supply south of Bedford to be boosted.


On Saturday 19 and Sunday 20 March, engineers will be upgrading the overhead line equipment - which is used to power some trains - south of Bedford.

As part of the largest upgrade to the Midland Main Line since it was completed in 1870, this work will help to deliver better, more reliable journeys for passengers and ultimately connect people to more job, education and leisure opportunities.

This is the first of several weekends in 2022 where the railway will be closed so that Network Rail teams can boost the power supply safely.
 

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
The viewpoint is around 350m beyond the crossover to the North of Harborough station, so it looks like there might be enough room, but with very little over-run.

Also, I notice that the mast nearest the portal is over-height. That should be an indicator of how the wiring is planned at this location, but I don't know enough about OHLE design to work it out.

(I did wonder if the portal structure in the photo is actually the anchor point for future wiring going north, and the anchor point for the cable run south is going to be behind the camera?)
That 'over-height' mast will likely have a cable or two (possibly up to four) going to another mast of similar height. This'll be used for switching/sectioning purposes; the 'live' part of the cable runs from the side where the switch actually is towards the track(s) which require the OLE to be switched.
 

Nicholas Lewis

On Moderation
Joined
9 Aug 2019
Messages
7,266
Location
Surrey
Power supply south of Bedford to be boosted.


On Saturday 19 and Sunday 20 March, engineers will be upgrading the overhead line equipment - which is used to power some trains - south of Bedford.

As part of the largest upgrade to the Midland Main Line since it was completed in 1870, this work will help to deliver better, more reliable journeys for passengers and ultimately connect people to more job, education and leisure opportunities.

This is the first of several weekends in 2022 where the railway will be closed so that Network Rail teams can boost the power supply safely.
Oh i love the language

We’re at a really exciting stage of the Midland Main Line Upgrade, which will see us boost the power supply south of Bedford and take us one step closer to delivering better, more reliable journeys for passengers.
When they get the wires to Sheffield that might be exciting although at the rate of authorising sections of about 10 miles at a time thats about ten steps away still.
 

Flying Phil

Established Member
Joined
18 Apr 2016
Messages
2,037
I had another wander between Kettering and MH but there has been comparatively little change. A few masts, some more odd cantilevers and some piles driven. Still nothing through Desborough.
On Saturday, I noticed, from the train window, that a roadway was being levelled across a field on the East side of the line about midway between Kibworth and Wigston Junction - could this be the beginnings of a worksite for the northward electrification from Market Harborough?
 
Last edited:

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
I had another wander between Kettering and MH but there has been comparatively little change. A few masts, some more odd cantilevers and some piles driven. Still nothing through Desborough.
I did a little pottering around MH today too. In the area behind P1 (near the warehouse), 3 masts for the DM await installation; SPC3/133.546 (portal), SPC3/133.598 (portal) and SPC3/133.647/DM (TTC). These are for the northern half of the station (i.e. beyond the footbridge).
Another concrete foundation sleeve has gone in at the London end of P2 (nr the Emergency Exit), but the concrete hasn't gone in yet. North of that is where portal SPC3/133.456 will go; based on the length to the final anchor boom north of the station*, it's likely to be an MPA (Mid Point Anchor) portal.
Then there's another concrete foundation (ready to take a mast by the look of it); I think the number was 133.516, although it could have been 133.506. It looks as if it's a UM TTC as an across track look to the DM side plonks a potential DM mast right where the new loo block's being constructed!

Some of the masts had "Week 50" written on them in marker pen; this implies that they may be installed this coming week.**

(*The final anchor boom is confirmed, with the aid of a zoom lens, to be SPC3/134.100.)
(**In the railway calendar, Week 50 (2022) started on the Saturday just gone, and ends at 23:59 on Friday.)

Pictures to follow.
 

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
First visual bulletin from Mkt H'boro' - I've ID'd the structures visible from Gt Bowden O/B.

The big boom (to be the new Limit of Wiring) is SPC3/134.100, as mentioned above in post no. 5077.
Beyond it in the picture are Spanwire mast 134.012/UM, Twin Cantilever Mast 134.005/UM, and SSA Mast 133.957/UM. (For 133.957, the Tensorex brackets are mounted such that the Tensorexes will face London)

Not part of the MML scheme but tweets yesterday (linked below) from Noel Dolphin of Furrer & Frey show progress on a demonstration at Wellingborough yard of retractable electrification to allow electric locos to be used end-end on freight. The MML contractor SPL are involved though.

Interesting, especially as it is working with GB Railfreight who don't really have any electric locos that could be used on the MML if it is going to be tested.
On this bombshell, 66724 took 92032 from Wembley Yard to Wellingborough Yard this morning: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R03364/2022-03-16/detailed

Looks like 92032 will be the test-bed loco for the retractable OLE.
 

Attachments

  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-1.jpg
    3.1 MB · Views: 98
Last edited:

Nottingham59

Established Member
Joined
10 Dec 2019
Messages
2,650
Location
Nottingham
The big boom (to be the new Limit of Wiring) is SPC3/134.100, as mentioned above in post no. 5077.
Beyond it in the picture are Spanwire mast 134.012/UM, Twin Cantilever Mast 134.005/UM, and SSA Mast 133.957/UM. (For 133.957, the Tensorex brackets are mounted such that the Tensorexes will face London)
Thank you for posting the photo. I'm still a bit confused about how the wiring will work at this location. Can I just clarify a couple of points?

If the Tensorex brackets on 133.957 are facing London, then what cables will the other masts in the photo be carrying?

If SPC3/134.100 is to be the new Limit of Wiring, does this leave enough space to allow electric stock to reverse over the crossover north of MHR station ?

Thanks
 

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
Thank you for posting the photo. I'm still a bit confused about how the wiring will work at this location. Can I just clarify a couple of points?

If the Tensorex brackets on 133.957 are facing London, then what cables will the other masts in the photo be carrying?

If SPC3/134.100 is to be the new Limit of Wiring, does this leave enough space to allow electric stock to reverse over the crossover north of MHR station ?

Thanks
No worries - there's plenty more where that came from!
I suspect 133.957/UM will be for the crossover allowing southbound UM trains to reach P1 'bang road'.
134.005 will be one of the twin cantilever overlap masts (i.e. having 2 cantilevers per track), and will work in conjunction with another, as-yet-unconstructed twin cantilever overlap mast*.
134.012 will 'switch' said overlap (which will be an insulated overlap rather than an uninsulated one), and have 4 cross-track feeds to switch 4 wire runs in the overlap (2 per track).

Of course, the crossover layout might be tangential, which makes this significantly more complex to explain!
(*UKMS 125 which I believe is used on the MML except the Corby branch, which uses UKMS100, has a maximum span length of 73m. 134.005 to 134.100 is a 95m span (inc. versine here!), so another structure would be required, nominally 50m from 134.005.)

134.100 might be the Limit of Wiring in a physical sense, but there may be an "Electric Trains No Access" sign (or similar) ruling any such move out, at least until wires continue towards Leicester and beyond.
 
Last edited:

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
Further updates (which might take a while due to the sheer size of the files):
Anchor mast off P2 confirmed to be SPC3/133.672/UM.
Portal leg off P2 (near the signals at the country end) confirmed to be SPC3/133.697/UM.
 

Attachments

  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-2.jpg
    3.5 MB · Views: 82
  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-3.jpg
    3.6 MB · Views: 66

Nottingham59

Established Member
Joined
10 Dec 2019
Messages
2,650
Location
Nottingham
I suspect 133.957/UM will be for the crossover allowing southbound UM trains to reach P1 'bang road'.
Thank you. That makes a lot of sense.

Also, there are two structures just visible above the portal boom of 134.100 (RH end) which look like TTC's in the far distance. Are these south of the station? If so, it's good to see such progress being made.

1647438771286.png
 

AndyW33

Member
Joined
12 Aug 2013
Messages
534
If SPC3/134.100 is to be the new Limit of Wiring, does this leave enough space to allow electric stock to reverse over the crossover north of MHR station ?

Thanks
What electric stock is going to need to reverse over the crossover? There's been no suggestion from anyone but rail enthusiasts that 360s would ever go to Market Harborough, there are only enough of them to operate the Corby service. 810s certainly will go there, and when the section north of Market Harborough is under engineering possession they might need to reverse at MH. However, they're bi-modes so it doesn't matter all that much whether there is enough wired track to use for reversing.
 

Nottingham59

Established Member
Joined
10 Dec 2019
Messages
2,650
Location
Nottingham
What electric stock is going to need to reverse over the crossover?
I just wondered. It just seems odd to electrify a line to just past a crossover, and not allow quite enough space for electric stock to use it for its intended purpose. When the extension to MHR was authorised, there was no guarantee that electrification would extend any further, so you would have thought the design would allow flexibility.

This layout prevents class 360s reversing at MHR if the mainline is blocked between MHR and Leicester - when Meridians can serve Corby.
 
Last edited:

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
I just wondered. It just seems odd to electrify a line to just past a crossover, and not allow quite enough space for electric stock to use it for its intended purpose. When the extension to MHR was authorised, there was no guarantee that electrification would extend any further, so you would have thought the design would allow flexibility.

This layout prevents class 360s reversing at MHR if the mainline is blocked between MHR and Leicester - when Meridians can serve Corby.
Worth remembering there are two crossovers at Mkt Hboro Jn; the southern one allows trains travelling northbound 'bang road' on the UM to rejoin the DM. This could be used as a crossover for reversal moves.

Thank you. That makes a lot of sense.

Also, there are two structures just visible above the portal boom of 134.100 (RH end) which look like TTC's in the far distance. Are these south of the station? If so, it's good to see such progress being made.

View attachment 111533
Yes and no - the first one is 133.957; the one in the far distance is on the southern approach to the station, possibly nr Kettering Rd U/B.

Another itty bitty update: the TTC north of P2 is SPC3/133.727/UM. Slightly north of that, an SSA pile has gone in on the DM side, and will likely anchor the EW/ATF or one of the crossover wire runs.
 

Attachments

  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-4.jpg
    3.3 MB · Views: 44
  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-5.jpg
    3.7 MB · Views: 41
Last edited:

edwin_m

Veteran Member
Joined
21 Apr 2013
Messages
26,724
Location
Nottingham
Thanks for the info. I guess if it is just going to stay in the yard and not go anywhere then it doesn't matter about clearance etc.
If the moveable catenary is life then powering a 92 would still need safety approval, especially as they are quite well known for putting electromagnetic interference into the supply and return. Even if it's in the yard the return currents could pass through the main line. However, with all signalling equipment being fairly modern it may be that there isn't a major issue.
I just wondered. It just seems odd to electrify a line to just past a crossover, and not allow quite enough space for electric stock to use it for its intended purpose. When the extension to MHR was authorised, there was no guarantee that electrification would extend any further, so you would have thought the design would allow flexibility.
I wonder if it was cut back when the extension towards Leicester was authorised, to avoid having to put something up that would be modified quite soon afterwards. This seems something of a false economy, because the further electrification will itself cause many diversions, for which the most sensible timetable would probably run 360s to MH and 810s via Corby. Or maybe extension to provide a train length of OLE north of the signals is an early delivery item for the Leicester work?
 

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
15,202
Location
Bristol
If the moveable catenary is life then powering a 92 would still need safety approval, especially as they are quite well known for putting electromagnetic interference into the supply and return. Even if it's in the yard the return currents could pass through the main line. However, with all signalling equipment being fairly modern it may be that there isn't a major issue.

I wonder if it was cut back when the extension towards Leicester was authorised, to avoid having to put something up that would be modified quite soon afterwards. This seems something of a false economy, because the further electrification will itself cause many diversions, for which the most sensible timetable would probably run 360s to MH and 810s via Corby. Or maybe extension to provide a train length of OLE north of the signals is an early delivery item for the Leicester work?
Worth remembering the Signals are north (the far side) of the overbridge - if this needs reconstruction before the OLE can be put up then it's really not worth it for the handful of times reversals may take place when it's already possible to just run in both directions on either track south of MH. I don't know the area so somebody else will need to advise on if the bridge is already suitable clearance.
 

edwin_m

Veteran Member
Joined
21 Apr 2013
Messages
26,724
Location
Nottingham
Worth remembering the Signals are north (the far side) of the overbridge - if this needs reconstruction before the OLE can be put up then it's really not worth it for the handful of times reversals may take place when it's already possible to just run in both directions on either track south of MH. I don't know the area so somebody else will need to advise on if the bridge is already suitable clearance.
Yes that's true and may well be the reason. In noting that the tracks have been spread out to pass through the centre of each arch of the road bridge (hence the wide spacing in the photos), it's easy to forget that the footbridge presumably hasn't been touched.
 

Nottingham59

Established Member
Joined
10 Dec 2019
Messages
2,650
Location
Nottingham
the overbridge - if this needs reconstruction before the OLE can be put up then it's really not worth it
That makes sense. The imperative was to electrify to Braybrooke feeder station; any further was a bonus. And getting to the platforms at MHR delivers almost all the additional benefit
 

edwin_m

Veteran Member
Joined
21 Apr 2013
Messages
26,724
Location
Nottingham
I'm getting my bridges mixed up. The road bridge, where the tracks were re-aligned through the centre of each arch, surely has enough clearance. The footbridge, which possibly hasn't, is about 300m north of the signal. Is this enough for a 240m train plus standback and OLE termination?
 

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
15,202
Location
Bristol
I'm getting my bridges mixed up. The road bridge, where the tracks were re-aligned through the centre of each arch, surely has enough clearance.
I agree, it's had its parapets raised in anticipation which they probably wouldn't have done if it were being replaced.
The footbridge, which possibly hasn't, is about 300m north of the signal. Is this enough for a 240m train plus standback and OLE termination?
It's generally 20m standback, so you've only got 20m for the OLE termination. But it also depends where you want your OHNS in the longer term. It would make sense to end the wires at MH where the future OHNS (or equivalent facility) is located, as you would already be terminating the wires there.
 

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
It's generally 20m standback, so you've only got 20m for the OLE termination. But it also depends where you want your OHNS in the longer term. It would make sense to end the wires at MH where the future OHNS (or equivalent facility) is located, as you would already be terminating the wires there.
Braybrooke gets the OHNS; Market Harborough only gets a switched and insulated overlap. Of course, the switch is next to useless until the wires extend northwards as there's no other wire run to shut the feed off from before then!
 

zwk500

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Jan 2020
Messages
15,202
Location
Bristol
Braybrooke gets the OHNS; Market Harborough only gets a switched and insulated overlap. Of course, the switch is next to useless until the wires extend northwards as there's no other wire run to shut the feed off from before then!
Ah, thanks for the info. Although the switch is useless at the moment, it still makes sense to terminate this part of the wire run at the place where it will eventually be. Locating it south of the Road bridge also handily places it directly at the access point to the lineside.
 

59CosG95

Established Member
Joined
18 Aug 2013
Messages
6,725
Location
Between Beeston (Notts) & Bedlington
Ah, thanks for the info. Although the switch is useless at the moment, it still makes sense to terminate this part of the wire run at the place where it will eventually be. Locating it south of the Road bridge also handily places it directly at the access point to the lineside.
Indeed it does; the switch will almost certainly be on the Up side of the line anyway.

Further pictures: a capless pile (most likely for another TTC) in the DM cess, just south of the "Market Harborough Junction" sign; 3 further piles of indeterminate type north of the small 85mph PSR north of the northern crossover, all in the DM cess.
 

Attachments

  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-7.jpg
    3.7 MB · Views: 43
  • Mkt Hboro Masts & Piles-6.jpg
    3.6 MB · Views: 39

Flying Phil

Established Member
Joined
18 Apr 2016
Messages
2,037
Here is the view to the South from the Great Bowden road overbridge.
DSC01462s.jpg

The concrete foundation slab for the toilet block is now poured.
DSC01465s.jpg

There is another mast in place at the Southern end of platform 2.DSC01466s.jpg
 

Top