More Stupidity Taking Photos - This time at a Footpath Crossing at Tidemills, East Sussex

[PG]

At 2.05 in someone needs to "have a word" as even the copper stops and lingers. And that's in a promotional/safety video!!

While not ideal in the context of the video, as can be seen the BTP officer clearly had permission to be on the railway as seconds later he is pictured walking along the cess from the crossing.

 

[LSWR Cavalier]

It could be interpreted or misinterpreted as loitering on the track, should not have been published thus, IMHO

 

[LAX54]

It is funny you mention that, as I have just come across

At 2.05 in someone needs to "have a word" as even the copper stops and lingers. And that's in a promotional/safety video!!

Of course rules have been tightened up a long time ago now, RT of course have been 'gone' for almost 20 years now.

 

[chorleyjeff]

If the railway crosses a public right of way, then that right of way can be exercised. The alternative is to close the right of way (i.e. the crossing) and provide an alternative right of way (i.e. a bridge).

Now of course, this assumes people are going to be sensible and treat the railway crossing with respect. We've had these crossings for hundreds of years, with appropriate signage (most of the time) but sadly, society has changed and people just don't think, or care about their own actions these days, and the consequences of their actions. I'm sure this sort of thing didn't happen before the invention of mobile phones/social media etc.

As a well-used crossing, I think NR are right to consider alternative means in order to retain the right of way, but it has to be sympathetic to the local area/landscape

My recollections from 60 years ago is that people are no more stupid now than they were then. But instant digital imaging has changed how much stupidity we can see on screen. People regularly walked along railway tracks as shortcuts, children put coins on tracks and lads played around railway sidings and sneaked round engine sheds. We were just as stupid as today's teenagers.

 

[Llanigraham]

Whilst lying down on a railway track is crass stupidity wherever in the world it occurs, it does raise the question as to whether fencing railways is essential in rural locations: large parts of France seem to manage with no rural fencing at all even on mainlines. I'm not aware of a significantly higher number of accidents on SNCF involving pedestrians. Sadly those intent on taking their own lives will do so wherever the opportunity arises, regardless of society's attempts to physically prevent this.

2 points:
The High Sped lines in France are most definitely fenced, much with very similar palisade fencing now found here.

Railways are fenced in the UK because nearly every Enabling Act stated that there had to be a fence between the land owned by the railway and that of it's neighbour. That legislation does not appear to be present in France

 

[Lucan]

My recollections from 60 years ago is that people are no more stupid now than they were then. ..... People regularly walked along railway tracks as shortcuts, children put coins on tracks and lads played around railway sidings and sneaked round engine sheds. We were just as stupid as today's teenagers.

It is in fact possible to sneak around railway yards etc without danger, just as it is possible to work in them. I was in my school railway club, and around 1965 we made permitted [obviously] visits to Cricklewood, Old Oak Common and Hornsey MPDs. Imagine 20 schoolboys with complete freedom in a depot - across the tracks, and up and down the footplates of unmanned locos in steam with banked fires, and not an orange jacket in sight. But we had the sense not to get in front of moving locos or put our arms into fireboxes. As in Monty Python : tell people that today and they would not believe it.

As a kid I happened never to trespass on the railway, but I did some similar things. But looking back I never put myself in danger; I do potentially more dangerous things around home and garden today, like going up the roof to fix an aerial, but I apply the same caution as I learned to excercise back then. I think the difference today is that there is less circumspection, less acceptance of your own responsibility and less regard to self-preservation.

 

[Stigy]

Really ! of course they are tresspassing, they are 'allowed' to cross, and quickly, not stop and have a lay down and take stupid photos !

It’s a bit of a grey area to be fair. The British Transport Commission Act 1949 (s.55) which covers trespass takes in to account clear cases of trespass with no mention of public foot crossings (or level crossings in general).

A few years ago for example, it used to be acceptable to prosecute offenders who hopped over level crossing barriers or solely ignored the lights at these crossings (full barrier and AHB etc) for trespass. This was however rules out as trespass bu the law commission who deemed it not to be trespass as the railway crosses a road. My argument has and always will be that as soon as the lights start to flash the public highway becomes part of the operational railway. Unfortunately though, the BTA 1949 is so generic it doesn’t take anything other than blatant trespass on a railway in to account.

 

[eoff]

As a kid I happened never to trespass on the railway, but I did some similar things. But looking back I never put myself in danger;

I used to cross the ECML from time to time as a teenager at a place which must have previously been a minor road crossing. I remember having to be really careful as the line speed was high and in fact it was too dangerous to do so when it was windy as it was hard to hear the track sing (which you could hear before the train). But that was a long time ago.
If I'm honest I have been more concered about the danger of crossing busy roads or on-road tram tracks or being too near New Forest ponies.

 

[Bikeman78]

I used to cross the ECML from time to time as a teenager at a place which must have previously been a minor road crossing. I remember having to be really careful as the line speed was high and in fact it was too dangerous to do so when it was windy as it was hard to hear the track sing (which you could hear before the train). But that was a long time ago.
If I'm honest I have been more concered about the danger of crossing busy roads or on-road tram tracks or being too near New Forest ponies.

Some may recall I wrote about a trip on the Braintree branch a few years ago. The roads leading to Cressing and White Notley are both fairly narrow without pavements. They are wide enough for two cars to pass comfortably but anything bigger becomes a challenge. Most drivers made little effort to slow down when they saw me and a few had near misses with oncoming traffic when two vehicles happened to pass close to me. Not an experience I'm keen to repeat. Conversely, I've never had any problem using railway foot crossings.

 

[philthetube]

I used to cross the ECML from time to time as a teenager at a place which must have previously been a minor road crossing. I remember having to be really careful as the line speed was high and in fact it was too dangerous to do so when it was windy as it was hard to hear the track sing (which you could hear before the train). But that was a long time ago.
If I'm honest I have been more concered about the danger of crossing busy roads or on-road tram tracks or being too near New Forest ponies.

I have a walk book, "The London Countryway" which tells you to take care crossing the East coast main line at a foot crossing because of the way the new trains come flying round the corner, written about the same time as the M 25 was built, no crossing there now however.

footpath diverted to cross Skimpans bridge previous location at TL329051 . you can see the danger form the map.

 

[SWTCommuter]

footpath diverted to cross Skimpans bridge previous location at TL329051 . you can see the danger form the map.

That grid reference seems a little wide of the mark. Did you mean TL2399805006?

Pin point and share locations with dropped pins | OS Maps

Share locations from OS Maps with others or mark key locations to come back to in the future with dropped pins in OS Maps.

osmaps.ordnancesurvey.co.uk

 

[181]

That grid reference seems a little wide of the mark. Did you mean TL2399805006?

I'm not philthetube, but yes, that is the former London Countryway crossing, which I remember using in 1985. I'm pleased to see from the map that a replacement path has been provided rather than making people walk along the road -- as others have said, at most railway crossings (that one perhaps having been an exception) you can reduce the risk to virtually zero by being sensible, but on the road it's quite possible to die as a result of someone else's carelessness.

 

[philthetube]

yes, 239 not 329, the rest is near enough, cheers.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

yes, 239 not 329, the rest is near enough, cheers.

Minor error; you'll now only be at some random location about 9 kilometres away (!)

 

[philthetube]

Minor error; you'll now only be at some random location about 9 kilometres away (!)

Randon location , Bread and Cheese Bridge. Honest.

 

[4069]

I've got some lovely pictures of Deltic-hauled expresses taken from that crossing. It was pretty scary at the time, even if you cowered in the cess.

 

[Lockwood]

And more...

A train driver in Lancashire was forced to carry out an emergency stop over the weekend after spotting several people on the tracks ahead of him.

A group of six people had stepped onto the live tracks to take selfies of themselves as the train approached their position.

Due to the quick reactions of the train driver, nobody was hurt in the incident.

The episode happened on Sunday 31st January at Hoghton Level Crossing near Preston.

No arrests have been made, and BTP Lancashire is investigating the incident.

EMERGENCY SERVICES NEWS, 2021. Train Driver Forced To Apply Emergency Brake After Spotting Six People Taking Selfies On Tracks [viewed 02 February 2021] Available from: https://emergency-services.news/tra...spotting-six-people-taking-selfies-on-tracks/

 

[bobslack1982]

What are people’s thoughts on taking photographs from a manned crossing when the barriers are up? Genuine question - not looking to play Devil’s advocate with this particular situation.

 

[zwk500]

What are people’s thoughts on taking photographs from a manned crossing when the barriers are up? Genuine question - not looking to play Devil’s advocate with this particular situation.

No. Unless you have permission from the crossing keeper/signaller, he/she has given you a line block to take the photos, and you are clearly identifiable to anybody passing as authorised to be there. It's not necessarily about the person taking the photos knowing what they're doing, but about the example being shown to others who may not.

There's plenty of images of rail tracks disappearing into the perspective available to buy from commercial sources, or you can get a very similar effect from a safe place such as a footbridge.

 

[Stathern Jc]

I must confess to having given way to the temptation.



But did look both ways and thought I was safe.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

What are people’s thoughts on taking photographs from a manned crossing when the barriers are up? Genuine question - not looking to play Devil’s advocate with this particular situation.

May I suggest a new thread is started on this?

 

[zwk500]

I must confess to having given way to the temptation.

But did look both ways and thought I was safe.

(As I said, it's more about giving people who don't know what to look for bad ideas than any danger to yourself.)

 

[bobslack1982]

No. Unless you have permission from the crossing keeper/signaller, he/she has given you a line block to take the photos, and you are clearly identifiable to anybody passing as authorised to be there. It's not necessarily about the person taking the photos knowing what they're doing, but about the example being shown to others who may not.

There's plenty of images of rail tracks disappearing into the perspective available to buy from commercial sources, or you can get a very similar effect from a safe place such as a footbridge.

I see. I hadn’t thought of it that way. Thanks very much.

 

[najaB]

While I share the concern over how stupid people can be I'm not really convinced that there is any major risk in this instance.

Three words: Normalisation of Deviance.

 

[nanstallon]

I don't think it is very wise to rely on there being no train scheduled for a while. There could be an unscheduled train, such as an engineers train. Behaving like that is inviting tragedy, and just as likely regardless of the legal status of the crossing.