Moving TOC as a PQA or experienced driver

[PlexiDriver]

I wanted to know a few things - consider it a bit of a summing up of information about the topic!

1) How easy is it / often does it happen, that PQA 1 / 2 drivers can be picked up by another TOC?

2) If you have a blip on your record (from TPWS to Fail to cancel AWS) does that make is impossible to move?

3) Is getting a job at another TOC more difficult nowadays or is it relatively easy for a qualified driver to get a move elsewhere?

4) What sort of things give you an advantage? (Traction, safety record, systems like ETRMS)

5) Does one type of work impact the decision, such as commuter TOC drivers applying for Intercity services etc.?

Thanks all in advance

(If you've another other information about it, please feel free to pile in!)

 

[baz962]

1 sometimes
2 not always
3 getting more difficult. Still happens but quite a few are moving towards trainee or apprenticeship.
4 living on the line /commute . Safety record.
5 not really.

 

[Juliet Barvo]

I wanted to know a few things - consider it a bit of a summing up of information about the topic!

1) How easy is it / often does it happen, that PQA 1 / 2 drivers can be picked up by another TOC?

2) If you have a blip on your record (from TPWS to Fail to cancel AWS) does that make is impossible to move?

3) Is getting a job at another TOC more difficult nowadays or is it relatively easy for a qualified driver to get a move elsewhere?

4) What sort of things give you an advantage? (Traction, safety record, systems like ETRMS)

5) Does one type of work impact the decision, such as commuter TOC drivers applying for Intercity services etc.?

Thanks all in advance

(If you've another other information about it, please feel free to pile in!)

1) slightly more difficult in your first couple of years, but it does happen. A certain freight company will take you on just as long as you have a license and are still breathing..

2) Opps. Fail to Cancel is nothing (as long as you reported it to the signaller). Getting taken out by TPWS is bad, expect difficulties for a few years. Fail to call, expect a chat about what you have done to prevent it happening again.

3) Any job ad for Qualified Drivers is just that. Know your rulebook changes and know all about the company you are applying to.

4) A good reputation and a good safety record.

5) Mainline is mainline, Metro is Metro. Reputation and a decent route card goes far.

 

[387star]

With wages frozen at most TOCS for a long time now there's no longer so much incentive to move TOCS for the money unless you're working for Southeastern...

 

[choochoochoo]

2) Opps. Fail to Cancel is nothing (as long as you reported it to the signaller). Getting taken out by TPWS is bad, expect difficulties for a few years. Fail to call, expect a chat about what you have done to prevent it happening again.

I'm hearing certain TOCs are proposing to make fail to cancel AWS a safety of line incident. Hopefully it's just mess room chat.

 

[godfreycomplex]

I'm hearing certain TOCs are proposing to make fail to cancel AWS a safety of line incident. Hopefully it's just mess room chat.

Oh for crying out loud….

 

[Juliet Barvo]

I'm hearing certain TOCs are proposing to make fail to cancel AWS a safety of line incident. Hopefully it's just mess room chat.

It's the RSSB and ORR that make those decisions, TOCs just administer. All you need do is look at the Transfer of Safety Information form that a Driver is asked to complete and sign to prove their honesty.

RIS-3751-TOM Iss 3​

Rail Industry Standard for Train Driver Selection
Appendix A

​

 

[dereksingh291]

What does PQA stand for if anyone dosent mind me asking?

 

[Smelliott]

What does PQA stand for if anyone dosent mind me asking?

Post Qualified Assessment - meaning a newly qualified driver. Green. Wet behind the ears.

 

[cossie4i]

Oh for crying out loud….

I know, it’s ridiculous.
I suppose it comes under a lapse of concentration, making it a safety of the line incident.

 

[Smelliott]

I know, it’s ridiculous.
I suppose it comes under a lapse of concentration, making it a safety of the line incident.

I've had to hit the button a second time on more than one occasion, as the first failed to register for some reason. Surely there's no way they could conclusively prove this hadn't happened if someone failed to cancel? I've also heard of the button coming unscrewed and falling off!

 

[TheGoldfish]

I've had to hit the button a second time on more than one occasion, as the first failed to register for some reason. Surely there's no way they could conclusively prove this hadn't happened if someone failed to cancel? I've also heard of the button coming unscrewed and falling off!

I’ve had the button get stuck more than once (as it doesn’t cancel until it’s released )… frantically wacking it til it pops out again before the brake comes in

 

[ComUtoR]

I've had to hit the button a second time on more than one occasion, as the first failed to register for some reason. Surely there's no way they could conclusively prove this hadn't happened if someone failed to cancel?

OTDR "download" data would be used to determine if the button was pressed and bow many times etc.

 

[baz962]

If you get dumped on the Aws for a signal , call the box and report a right side failure

 

[Smelliott]

OTDR "download" data would be used to determine if the button was pressed and bow many times etc.

I'd considered that, but if the button had somehow failed mechanically (or, indeed, fallen off), there's surely got to be at least a chance the hit wouldn't be registered by the OTDR?

 

[irish_rail]

I'm hearing certain TOCs are proposing to make fail to cancel AWS a safety of line incident. Hopefully it's just mess room chat.

Already SOLI on GWR. Uttely ridiculous, especially as on 80x stock the button isn't great and on more than one occasion I've had to hit it twice when it hasn't registered the first time.

 

[ComUtoR]

I'd considered that, but if the button had somehow failed mechanically (or, indeed, fallen off), there's surely got to be at least a chance the hit wouldn't be registered by the OTDR?

Without tying to check; I don't know how sensitive the OTDR electronics are. Considering it's just a button press, I would need to record fractions of a second button presses.

If the AWS physically failed. Probably one to kick down to Engineering to look at, as it would therefore be a unit fault.

I've had a Mechanical AWS failure where the button got stuck in but that was recorded.

If this was going on a safety of the line record, I'd expect a full investigation to take place and evidence provided.

 

[Horizon22]

This commentary has got somewhat off-topic now to the original questions if we could return to those. Thanks.

 

[20atthemagnet]

I wanted to know a few things - consider it a bit of a summing up of information about the topic!

1) How easy is it / often does it happen, that PQA 1 / 2 drivers can be picked up by another TOC?

2) If you have a blip on your record (from TPWS to Fail to cancel AWS) does that make is impossible to move?

3) Is getting a job at another TOC more difficult nowadays or is it relatively easy for a qualified driver to get a move elsewhere?

4) What sort of things give you an advantage? (Traction, safety record, systems like ETRMS)

5) Does one type of work impact the decision, such as commuter TOC drivers applying for Intercity services etc.?

Thanks all in advance

(If you've another other information about it, please feel free to pile in!)

1. Does happen often

2. It makes it harder but not impossible, what will matter more is what happened after. (Did you learn from it, did you do something again etc)

3. Its very very easy. You apply, ATOC check, get offered a position, medical, you move.

4. A clean record above anything else.

5. It can but not necessarily. An ex colleague went straight from metro to Eurostar.

Anything goes at the Railway at the moment. Recently a non RDG “metro” company had 160 applications for a qualified position and the applcants ranged from suburban to Highspeed and everything inbetween. When I started many moons ago you started Metro and Highspeed was the endgoal. Today its who pays the most for the best conditions closest to your house, and thats not necessarily a highspeed outfit anymore. Would have never happened 20 10 even 5 years ago.

 

[Firedriver]

1. Does happen often

2. It makes it harder but not impossible, what will matter more is what happened after. (Did you learn from it, did you do something again etc)

3. Its very very easy. You apply, ATOC check, get offered a position, medical, you move.

4. A clean record above anything else.

5. It can but not necessarily. An ex colleague went straight from metro to Eurostar.

Anything goes at the Railway at the moment. Recently a non RDG “metro” company had 160 applications for a qualified position and the applcants ranged from suburban to Highspeed and everything inbetween. When I started many moons ago you started Metro and Highspeed was the endgoal. Today its who pays the most for the best conditions closest to your house, and thats not necessarily a highspeed outfit anymore. Would have never happened 20 10 even 5 years ago.

Which TOC has the best conditions?

 

[ComUtoR]

Which TOC has the best conditions?

What would you like/prefer ?

Annual leave
Money
Taxi agreement
Rest day agreement
4 day week
Fixed rest day pattern
Corporate benefits
Pension scheme
PQ remuneration
Average turn length
Max/Minimum turn length
Succession planning / (PT&R arrangements)
AAW (attendance) Triggers
PNB length
Paternity/Maternity Pay
Sick pay
Travel Benefits

It's not as easy as saying who is or isn't 'The Best'

**edit**

Passengers
Link Structure
Company Vehicle

 

[Firedriver]

What would you like/prefer ?

Annual leave
Money
Taxi agreement
Rest day agreement
4 day week
Fixed rest day pattern
Corporate benefits
Pension scheme
PQ remuneration
Average turn length
Max/Minimum turn length
Succession planning / (PT&R arrangements)
AAW (attendance) Triggers
PNB length
Paternity/Maternity Pay
Sick pay
Travel Benefits

It's not as easy as saying who is or isn't 'The Best'

Good point

Good point

Good pension, permanent earlies or lates and no nights for me

 

[Train_manager]

What would you like/prefer ?

Annual leave
Money
Taxi agreement
Rest day agreement
4 day week
Fixed rest day pattern
Corporate benefits
Pension scheme
PQ remuneration
Average turn length
Max/Minimum turn length
Succession planning / (PT&R arrangements)
AAW (attendance) Triggers
PNB length
Paternity/Maternity Pay
Sick pay
Travel Benefits

It's not as easy as saying who is or isn't 'The Best'

Lmao. All TOC and FOC are different.

 

[ComUtoR]

Good pension, permanent earlies or lates and no nights for me

*Money, location, 4 day week; for me.

Lmao. All TOC and FOC are different.

I should have added 'Passengers' in the list !!

*edited for top 3

 

[Firedriver]

Lmao. All TOC and FOC are different.

Exactly….hence the post about finding the TOC/FOC which has the best conditions….lmao

 

[nithen]

What would you like/prefer ?

Annual leave
Money
Taxi agreement
Rest day agreement
4 day week
Fixed rest day pattern
Corporate benefits
Pension scheme
PQ remuneration
Average turn length
Max/Minimum turn length
Succession planning / (PT&R arrangements)
AAW (attendance) Triggers
PNB length
Paternity/Maternity Pay
Sick pay
Travel Benefits

It's not as easy as saying who is or isn't 'The Best'

**edit**

Passengers
Link Structure
Company Vehicle

I actually think we could make a game out of this. New thread with all of this. Pick and mix; pick any 3 that you want.

 

[ComUtoR]

I actually think we could make a game out of this. New thread with all of this. Pick and mix; pick any 3 that you want.

Snog - Driver at a different depot (cute as a button)
Marry - My Team Admin
Avoid - 'A' Shift (They're just weird)

 

[Horizon22]

Right, this thread has got rather off-topic now. The answers have been provided, so it’s being closed.