Northern rail service increases in July

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yorkie

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Northern Rail have been requested to run a full timetable as of today, though at the time of writing this has not yet happened.

Some routes have seen frequency increases but not all.

Here is a link to the current timetables:


(the URL really ought to be updated!)

This thread is purely to discuss timetable changes on Northern services during July 2020. Please do not discuss anything else in this thread (the forum has plenty of capacity to accommodate threads to discuss any other topic)
 
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NorthOxonian

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Not sure I'm seeing a great deal of change around the North East. The Whitby service is still very infrequent (the arrival which would be used by most day trippers no longer exists), and the Tyne Valley line remains hourly.

One odd point I've noticed - most timetables are labelled as "Temporary", but a handful (mostly scenic routes on a Sunday) are labelled as "Key Worker" timetables. I'm not sure if there's any real distinction between the two other than frequency.
 

Starmill

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One odd point I've noticed - most timetables are labelled as "Temporary", but a handful (mostly scenic routes on a Sunday) are labelled as "Key Worker" timetables. I'm not sure if there's any real distinction between the two other than frequency.
Is that just because the latter haven't substantially changed this week?
 

Glenn1969

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The Northern report to the WYCA Meeting that I read online recently seems to indicate that they still have staff availability issues which explains the poor timetable currently. Apparently they also stopped training on the new stock during the pandemic. So guess we will have to wait
 

yorksrob

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The Northern report to the WYCA Meeting that I read online recently seems to indicate that they still have staff availability issues which explains the poor timetable currently. Apparently they also stopped training on the new stock during the pandemic. So guess we will have to wait
One does wonder why Northern has been hit more than other TOC's by this. Do they have a noticably higher risk staff demography (older male perhaps) than most TOC's ?

The other issue I wonder is whether they're doing as much as can be done to bring older, servicable stock back into use, such as pacers to enable strengthening without being a drain on the overall pool of resources.
 

CaptainHaddock

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Good news - Northern have reintroduced the fast service from Nottingham to Leeds via Barnsley!

Bad news - whereas it used to run hourly, it's now just two trains a day in each direction!...
 

Huntergreed

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They seem to have ditched the out of use seat coverings
Along with “essential travel only”. I think it’s safe to say, the railway is reopen for business. My only worry is that nobody actually knows this as, although “essential only” has gone, they’ve not actually specifically said you’re allowed to travel again.
 

Jamesrob637

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Along with “essential travel only”. I think it’s safe to say, the railway is reopen for business. My only worry is that nobody actually knows this as, although “essential only” has gone, they’ve not actually specifically said you’re allowed to travel again.
Half reopen at my station. The Buxton stopping service still isn't there, and whatever happened to the reintroduction of Alderley Edge to Southport partially with Pacers due to the (continued) delay in service of the 769s?! From Manchester the trains run at quarter to the hour and on the hour, leaving a 45 minute gap! Towards Manchester it's sightly better: 15 past, 33 past and 44 past the hour. Actually, towards Manchester the only missing service is the 24 past the hour: there would be half an hour's gap from quarter to until quarter past even under normal circumstances.
 
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johntea

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Don’t worry, Leeds station still seems to be firing out the rather draconian ‘Only travel if your journey is REALLY essential!’ announcement...
 

AdamWW

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Along with “essential travel only”. I think it’s safe to say, the railway is reopen for business. My only worry is that nobody actually knows this as, although “essential only” has gone, they’ve not actually specifically said you’re allowed to travel again.
I think so long as the National Rail web site has this on its home page:

1594115954665.png

people might get the impression that they shouldn't be using trains.

I suppose "really necessary" is an improvement over essential, and it's nicely ambiguous as to whether the journey has to be necessary, or whether they mean using the train is necessary for the journey.

(Rather like the way that travelling to work was always allowed if travelling was essential to doing the work, not that the work itself had to be essential in any sense).
 

johntea

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Leeds to Sheffield via Cas Vegas on a 195?!

Presumably just a bit of luck with the reduced Nottingham service :D
 

185

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I wrote last week to the DfT regarding Northern after informally approaching the ORR, after the company 'misremembered' / gave a mildly incorrect response to two politicians earlier last week. Interesting they've still (earlier today) been deleting late evening trains off NRE for Monday after next, when there is no sign of possessions and other trains are running over the same stretch of track.
 

northernchris

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Leeds to Sheffield via Cas Vegas on a 195?!

Presumably just a bit of luck with the reduced Nottingham service :D
Northern have however reduced all diagrams on the Leeds - Sheffield route to 2 carriages as most were 4 up until last week, despite their press release claiming more carriages would be out. In fact from what I've seen double sets are rare again around Leeds, which is disappointing given a lot of routes still aren't at their usual frequency. TPE on the other hand are running all 185s as doubles, even on the Huddersfield stopper!
 

Bow Fell

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Good news - Northern have reintroduced the fast service from Nottingham to Leeds via Barnsley!

Bad news - whereas it used to run hourly, it's now just two trains a day in each direction!...
You can still go direct from Nottingham - Leeds (and vv) the units interwork with the Leeds-Sheffield via Moorthorpe services (it’s slower obviously).
 

Jamesrob637

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Northern have however reduced all diagrams on the Leeds - Sheffield route to 2 carriages as most were 4 up until last week, despite their press release claiming more carriages would be out. In fact from what I've seen double sets are rare again around Leeds, which is disappointing given a lot of routes still aren't at their usual frequency. TPE on the other hand are running all 185s as doubles, even on the Huddersfield stopper!
Yep apparently almost nothing was in Ardwick depot at midday, same as a normal weekday. TP are doing rather well here. Neville Hill, on the other hand... (Newton Heath had a few more in than a normal weekday but not as many as prior to yesterday)
 

northernchris

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Yep apparently almost nothing was in Ardwick depot at midday, same as a normal weekday. TP are doing rather well here. Neville Hill, on the other hand... (Newton Heath had a few more in than a normal weekday but not as many as prior to yesterday)
It is disappointing, especially given the news article last week stated extra carriages would be used. Whilst it makes sense to only run services Northern can reliably crew, I can't understand why some services have less capacity than last week. I was expecting every available unit to be out, Calder Valley for example should be mix of 4 and 5 car formations, one of the Leeds- Preston diagrams was just 2 carriages today
 

Howardh

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Still nothing after 2230 from Manchester to Boltton and beyond, not even bustitutions.
 

Howardh

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Still nothing after 2230 from Manchester to Boltton and beyond, not even bustitutions.
Contacted them this morning - reply was
we are now running more service but have not yet fully restored the timetables, we are hoping to restore more over the coming weeks. Sadly I do not have an exact timescale for when this will be complete
which means no late evening trains throughout the rest of summer. We need to get the evening economies up and running, Blackpool in particular I'm sure would like some later trains for visitors to return on - but nothing, not even a bus.
After three months of lockdown this is just stabbing us in the back, as if we hadn't already had enough.

EDIT, a further reply;
Sadly we do not have any replacements planned at present, we will make our timetabling team aware of your suggestion for you. Apologies for any inconvenience caused
I've contacted manchester Evening News and I'm hoping they will pick this up and get (Mayor) Andy Burnham involved.
 
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Jamesrob637

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Don't forget that any increases in services sees more people at work which is a boost to their mental health - I'm itching to get back in August having been furloughed since March. Don't mind July off funnily enough as I have a few things to do during the month.
 

yorksrob

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Inspired by @Howardh I contacted Northern myself to ask about services west of Skipton, in particular the large gap between the train leaving Giggleswick for Leeds at 18:32 and the next one at 22:19 which after a change arrives at Leeds too late to connect to anything (the last train South from Settle leaves at 17:56). I suggested that at the very least, the previous train from Giggleswick ought to be trinstated as it is direct and connects into the rest of the network.

I recieved a speedy reply which seems to be a variation on the theme of there being "no confirmed timescale for for when we expect to restore further additional services on this particular line of route within the available resource at this time". This is obviously very concerning, and I'm considering how to further escalate the issue.
 

Howardh

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Inspired by @Howardh I contacted Northern myself to ask about services west of Skipton, in particular the large gap between the train leaving Giggleswick for Leeds at 18:32 and the next one at 22:19 which after a change arrives at Leeds too late to connect to anything (the last train South from Settle leaves at 17:56). I suggested that at the very least, the previous train from Giggleswick ought to be trinstated as it is direct and connects into the rest of the network.

I recieved a speedy reply which seems to be a variation on the theme of there being "no confirmed timescale for for when we expect to restore further additional services on this particular line of route within the available resource at this time". This is obviously very concerning, and I'm considering how to further escalate the issue.
It's a pity other companies can't/won't fill the void. Would havr thought someone like TPE might say "well, if you can't run the trains we will". Thought the Northern franchise was now under public ownership (can anyone fill me in?) but all I can suggest is keep peppering twitter with mail. They knew normality - of sorts - would return, but they aren't ready. Why not??
 

yorksrob

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It's a pity other companies can't/won't fill the void. Would havr thought someone like TPE might say "well, if you can't run the trains we will". Thought the Northern franchise was now under public ownership (can anyone fill me in?) but all I can suggest is keep peppering twitter with mail. They knew normality - of sorts - would return, but they aren't ready. Why not??
Indeed. It's the lack of any sort of timescale that's unacceptable. As the various ongoing cancellations in the North West pre-lockdown showed, they seem unready to run a train service full-stop.
 

Jamesrob637

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Indeed. It's the lack of any sort of timescale that's unacceptable. As the various ongoing cancellations in the North West pre-lockdown showed, they seem unready to run a train service full-stop.
Sundays for sure. Under normal circumstances Northern has a fairly good schedule Mondays to Saturdays albeit with the odd annoying gap such as why does the 12:55 Stoke to Manchester omit Heaton Chapel and Levenshulme yet all the rest manage to call there?
 

Fisherman80

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I boarded the 1049 Leeds to Carlisle service at Bingley yesterday. It was a 3 car 158 and it was very quiet.
Crossing Ribblehead Viaduct,I couldn't help but notice the number of cars parked on the road leading to Hawes,there were lots of them. Were some of those car owners regular travellers on the Settle to Carlisle line put off by the "dont use the train" message?
At the moment,the whole timetable on the Leeds to Morecambe/Carlisle railways are utterly inadequate.
 

northernchris

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Northern have updated some of their temporary timetables with effect from July 20th. They mostly look to involve Blackpool and Scarborough routes
 

YorksDMU

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Northern have updated some of their temporary timetables with effect from July 20th. They mostly look to involve Blackpool and Scarborough routes
Thank you, but it’s still only every two hours to and from Scarborough, however, and this is a big step in the right direction, a Hull to Bridlington service is started from that date. So, I’ll accept that improvement, but I hope we get a hourly service up to Scarborough once more before much longer.
Just seen that poor old Arram gets its train back from that date too.
 
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