Northern Unit Refurbishments

[superkev]

And 150268 that was moved by road to doncaster from Kilmarnock.

Interesting. I suppose with the PRM work coming to an end and all the new trains reducing refurb work companies like Wabtek will prob have to downsize. Haven't they announced closure of Kilmarnock and job cuts at Doncaster.
Presumably today's moves to Wolverton where Portabook 156 as Eastleigh seem to do the ex Scotrail angel ones.
K

 

[St. Paddy]

156447/49/85 still to go into works.

Do you know i 156460 went to Wolverton today and what came back?

 

[3973EXL]

Do you know i 156460 went to Wolverton today and what came back?

156460 reported in the urgent TOPS requests
156464 25/04 156461 28/05 were already at Wolverton, so I would expect the return was 464.

Photos now on Flickr of 156464 Wolverton - NH 17/06.

 

[py_megapixel]

Are 323s due for the "Digital Train Mods" (i.e. USB sockets, CCTV and LCD displays)? Or is that not happening?

 

[superkev]

156460 reported in the urgent TOPS requests
156464 25/04 156461 28/05 were already at Wolverton, so I would expect the return was 464.

There are also couple of 156s at Holbeck for various enhancements. I belive they where swapped last weekend.
K

 

[_toommm_]

Are 323s due for the "Digital Train Mods" (i.e. USB sockets, CCTV and LCD displays)? Or is that not happening?

Not that I’m aware of. I believe their extent of their digitalisation is the TrainFX PIS; although I thought they already had CCTV??

 

[py_megapixel]

Not that I’m aware of. I believe their extent of their digitalisation is the TrainFX PIS; although I thought they already had CCTV??

But it was a franchise pledge to have charging points on all trains wasn't it?
(Of course, the conditions of the franchise may have gone out of the window with the OLR takeover)

 

[St. Paddy]

156460 reported in the urgent TOPS requests
156464 25/04 156461 28/05 were already at Wolverton, so I would expect the return was 464.

Thanks, that’s what I thought

 

[_toommm_]

But it was a franchise pledge to have charging points on all trains wasn't it?
(Of course, the conditions of the franchise may have gone out of the window with the OLR takeover)

I've not seen anything personally to say the 323s were getting the USB chargers, although I could be wrong!

 

[jonesy3001]

Interesting. I suppose with the PRM work coming to an end and all the new trains reducing refurb work companies like Wabtek will prob have to downsize. Haven't they announced closure of Kilmarnock and job cuts at Doncaster.
Presumably today's moves to Wolverton where Portabook 156 as Eastleigh seem to do the ex Scotrail angel ones.
K

156460 there's a picture on Facebook

 

[LOL The Irony]

Are 323s due for the "Digital Train Mods" (i.e. USB sockets, CCTV and LCD displays)? Or is that not happening?

Every train is due for them once they're all PRM'd last time I checked.

 

[py_megapixel]

I've not seen anything personally to say the 323s were getting the USB chargers, although I could be wrong!

Not so much the 323s specifically; rather a generic claim that all trains operated after a certain date would have them (along with WiFi). Though I also could be wrong about that.

Edit: it seems that the free WiFi and in-seat power thing only refers to the new stock, at least at the moment. It's entirely possible that addition of this on refurbished stock (other than the Sprinters which were already tabled to get it) has quietly been removed at some point.

 

[3973EXL]

Sat 20/06 STP moves Heaton
Heaton - Eastleigh
Crewe - Heaton - Crewe

Realtime Trains | Departures from Heaton T&R.S.M.D. all day on 20/06/2020

Train information at Heaton T&R.S.M.D. all day on 20/06/2020. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[simon7929]

Yes there is a pic on FB of 460 heading for Wolverton yesterday. So just the three ex ScotRail ones left for a full refurb.

 

[py_megapixel]

Are any 156s left with the Serco Abellio striped seat covers? Quite a number were running around with Northern interior paintwork and PRM mods but old seat covers before lockdown.

 

[158757]

Updated lists 18/06/20, corrections welcome. I know more 156's have been through Holbeck but unsure on numbers, it appears they are just receiving seat frame repainting and flooring and seat cover replacement, not Digital Train Mods, I've been unable to find any clear photos. The telltale giveaway if they've had the digital train mods would be the addition of a front facing camera in the secondmans side cab window. I think so far gone through are 156438, 156480, with 156463 and 156484 currently in. 156468 and 156451 already have the new seat covers fitted on separate occasions, I'm not sure if they'll go down to have their seat frames repainted in black. I'm also aware of various 150's going to and from Crewe but until they come back, it's hard to tell if it's just for CET tank fitment or refurbishment, except if they've already had interior work done.

Key

Liveries

Northern livery with logos
Unbranded Northern livery
Old Serco-Abellio Northern purple
Unbranded First Scotrail Barbie
Unbranded First Great Western Blue
Unbranded Great Western Railway Green
158860 has thank you NHS livery

Units in italic are not PRM compliant but have received dispensation
# – Digital Train Modifications complete (USB, CCTV, additional PIS screens)
NCM - Northern Connect Mods (Seat reservations)
FGW – First Great Western
Prototype refurbishment – light blue seat backs, Arriva turquoise grab poles, cream coloured end walls


150001 - Unrefurbished, GWR moquette Ashbourne seats
150002 - Unrefurbished, GWR moquette Ashbourne seats

150101 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150102 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150103 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150104 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150105 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150106 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150107 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150108 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150109 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150110 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150111 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150112 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150113 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150114 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150115 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150116 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150117 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150118 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150119 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150120 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150121 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats
150122 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats
150123 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150124 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150125 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150126 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150127 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats
150128 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats
150129 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats
150130 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150131 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats
150132 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150133 – Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150134 – Refurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150135 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150136 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150137 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150138 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150139 – Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150140 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150141 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150142 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150143 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150144 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150145 – Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150146 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150147 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150148 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150149 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150150 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats

150120,123 retain Silverlink NSE blue wall carpet
150136 has several rows of seats in airline layout

150201 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150203 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150204 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150205 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150206 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150209 - Unrefurbished, FGW moquette Ashbourne seats (no toilet)
150210 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150211 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150214 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150215 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150218 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
# 150220 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
150222 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150223 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
150224 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150225 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
150226 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Ashbourne seats
150228 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150268 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats (in works, Doncaster)
# 150269 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150270 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
# 150271 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150272 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
# 150273 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150274 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Ashbourne seats
# 150275 – Refurbished (prototype style), new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150276 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150277 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats

150205 has a row of seats that were incorrectly fitted in a bay layout on refurb

155341 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
155342 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
155343 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
155344 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
155345 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
155346 - Refurbished (prototype style), new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
155347 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats

# 156420 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 156421 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156423 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 156424 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
156425 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156426 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156427 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 156428 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156429 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156438 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156440 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156441 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156443 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156444 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156447 - Unrefurbished, old First purple moquette Ashbourne seats
156448 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156449 - Unrefurbished, old First purple moquette Ashbourne seats
# 156451 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156452 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
156454 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156455 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156459 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156460 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats (in works, Wolverton)
156461 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats (in works, Wolverton)
156463 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats (in works, Holbeck)
156464 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156465 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats (in works, Eastleigh)
# 156466 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
156468 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156469 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156471 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156472 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156475 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156479 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156480 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156481 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156482 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156483 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156484 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats (in works, Holbeck)
156485 - Unrefurbished, old First purple moquette Ashbourne seats
156486 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156487 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156488 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156489 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156490 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156491 - Refurbished, old purple moquette Richmond seats
156496 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats (in works, Eastleigh)

Refurbished 156 units with Richmond seats but old purple moquette seats (and 156468) retain floor carpet, this is replaced during work at Holbeck

158752 - Refurbished (prototype style), dark blue moquette MTB seats
158753 - Refurbished (prototype style), dark blue moquette MTB seats
158754 - Refurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158755 - Refurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158756 - Refurbished (prototype style), dark blue moquette MTB seats
158757 - Refurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158758 - Refurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158759 - Refurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats

158782 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158784 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158786 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158787 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158789 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158790 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158791 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158792 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158793 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158794 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158795 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158796 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats (in works, Crewe)
158797 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158815 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
158816 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats (in works, Bristol Barton Hill)
158817 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158842 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
158843 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats
158844 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
# 158845 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats, NCM complete
158848 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158849 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats, NCM complete
158850 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158851 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158853 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158855 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158859 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats (in works, Crewe)
158860 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158861 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette MTB seats
158867 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158868 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158869 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158870 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158871 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158872 - Unrefurbished, old purple moquette Chapman seats

158901 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158902 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158903 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158904 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158905 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158906 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158907 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158908 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158909 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158910 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats

158752 has cream coloured end walls instead of navy blue

158752-759, 782, 867-871 retain the parcels cupboard in the 57 end vehicle

# 170453 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170454 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170455 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170456 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170457 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170458 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170459 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170460 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170461 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170472 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170473 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170474 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170475 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170476 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170477 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats
# 170478 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Chapman seats

170453-458 retain an old first class section (declassified) at each end of the train

Key

Liveries

Northern livery with logos
Unbranded Northern livery
Old Serco-Abellio Northern purple
Unbranded Thameslink White/Blue

FCC - First Capital Connect
Units not in bold are now off lease
Units in italic are not PRM compliant but have received dispensation (except 319373)

319361 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319362 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319363 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319364 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319365 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319366 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319367 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319368 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319369 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319370 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
319371 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319372 – unrefurbished, FCC moquette seats and interior
319373 – unrefurbished, FCC moquette seats and interior
319374 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319375 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319376 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319377 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319378 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319379 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319380 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319381 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
319382 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319383 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319384 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
319385 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
319386 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319446 – unrefurbished, FCC moquette seats and interior

769424 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769431 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769434 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769442 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769448 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769450 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769456 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats
769458 – refurbished, FCC moquette seats

319367 has additional PIS screens fitted although never used
319446 and all Northern 769s retain a declassified first class section

323223 – unrefurbished, old purple moquette seats
323224 – unrefurbished, old purple moquette seats
323225 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats (in works, Wolverton)
323226 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323227 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323228 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323229 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323230 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323231 – unrefurbished, old purple moquette seats
323232 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323233 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323234 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323235 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats (in works, Wolverton)
323236 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323237 – unrefurbished, old purple moquette seats
323238 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323239 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats

333001 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333002 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333003 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333004 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333005 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333006 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333007 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333008 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333009 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats (in works, Derby RTC for Bogic Bolster crack repairs)
333010 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333011 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333012 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333013 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333014 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333015 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333016 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats

 

[Jamesrob637]

So, of diesel units which serve my line, we're down to ten 150s still in 2000s Northern livery and no 156s. Probably fewer than ten in reality if some are in workshops.
Electrics-wise there is still the odd 323 kicking about in old livery but will be gone likely by late-July or August. 319s are only occasional and 331s are abundant, often in pairs (Blackpool to Hazel Grove).

 

[Harvey B]

Apologies if this has been answered but are the 333s going to get these digital train modifactions or will they not?

 

[Adam0984]

Yeah the 333s are getting a new PIS system and will get the charging eventually

 

[Dan15812]

Doesn't appear to be a very consistent job! Must be a logistical nightmare for the company to know which unit received what!

Will all 158, 156, 150 share the same common interior at some point?

 

[py_megapixel]

Doesn't appear to be a very consistent job! Must be a logistical nightmare for the company to know which unit received what!

Will all 158, 156, 150 share the same common interior at some point?

The plan as far as I'm aware is that 158s will get the new Fainsa "ironing board" seating, 156s will retain their old 2+2 seating and 150s their old 3+2 seating. Honestly the 158s had the best seating of the Sprinters anyway so I'm unsure why they needed to replace them if they are leaving the much less comfortable 150 and 156 seats alone. However, that plan might have changed.

 

[superkev]

Doesn't appear to be a very consistent job! Must be a logistical nightmare for the company to know which unit received what!

Yes, with so many units in differing states of refurb and of course also CET tank fitment must be very difficult keep track of what's what.
Re CET tanks presumably someone must have a list so depots know which units need emptying.
K

 

[superkev]

Wolverton to Nevill hill booked sat only. See of it runs.

Realtime Trains - FRGT 0808 Wolverton Centre Sidings to Newton Heath T.M.D.

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

.
K

 

[Adam0984]

Looks like 150223 on the Wolverton to Neville Hill 150137 and 150145 'should' be Crewe to Newton Heath
156496 looks to be delayed again so probably not returning from Eastleigh this week

 

[Halish Railway]

Honestly the 158s had the best seating of the Sprinters anyway so I'm unsure why they needed to replace them if they are leaving the much less comfortable 150 and 156 seats alone.

It was a franchise commitment to get the 158s to the same standard as the 195s/331s as they will both operate Connect services.

To be honest, I think that the Fainsa seats are far better than the old seats as they have far more legroom. I also think that the Fainsa seats should also have been fitted to the 155s and 156s.

 

[Harvey B]

Yeah the 333s are getting a new PIS system and will get the charging eventually

Thats good to know, will Martin Oldfield be staying or will he be replaced?

 

[py_megapixel]

To be honest, I think that the Fainsa seats are far better than the old seats as they have far more legroom.

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you. I have long legs and original 158 legroom is, while not great, perfectly adequate. In contrast, the replacement of the original 158 seats with Fainsas represents a massive step down in comfort.

I also think that the Fainsa seats should also have been fitted to the 155s and 156s.

That I do agree with, and I would extend that to the 150s as well. I find all Sprinter seats with the exception of 158s awful to be honest.

 

[Adam0984]

Thats good to know, will Martin Oldfield be staying or will he be replaced?

He'll be going and it will be the trainfx voice. The current voice was meant to have gone years ago and they recorded a new voice including Apperley Bdg and Kirkstall Forge but the memory on the PIS system wasn't big enough to take them so remained as they were

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you. I have long legs and original 158 legroom is, while not great, perfectly adequate

The issue with the original 158s is the design of the seat. There are two issues that affect legroom far more than the spacing.

One is that the seat has a "niche" in the middle with very thick supports at the sides, so if you're tall but quite skinny (or at least your legs are) you can gain something like an extra 2" of space over someone with thick rugby player/cyclist like legs like me.

The other one is that the very steep rake of the seat means that if you have a long lower leg your knees hit higher up and so you have less effective legroom.

Personally, I prefer the ironing boards, though Grammer IC3000s (as TfW, ScotRail and EMT used) or E3000s would be even better.

 

[py_megapixel]

The issue with the original 158s is the design of the seat. There are two issues that affect legroom far more than the spacing.

One is that the seat has a "niche" in the middle with very thick supports at the sides, so if you're tall but quite skinny (or at least your legs are) you can gain something like an extra 2" of space over someone with thick rugby player/cyclist like legs like me.

The other one is that the very steep rake of the seat means that if you have a long lower leg your knees hit higher up and so you have less effective legroom.

Personally, I prefer the ironing boards, though Grammer IC3000s (as TfW, ScotRail and EMT used) or E3000s would be even better.

I see where you're coming from now. My legs are quite thin so they do fit in the niche in the middle, and I welcome the extra padding.

I find IC3000s very comfortable but the high headrests give a somewhat claustrophobic feel. As for E3000s I find them some of the most comfortable seats on the network; the only thing I dislike about them is the drab grey colour of the seat backs, though that can probably be changed based on operator specifications and Northern would probably have gone for black.