Old couple walk into Quiet Zone, immediately start constant conversation

[dk1]

Just do away with with quiet coach all together. They cause nothing but arguments & are a pain in the backside for the traincrew to police.

 

[bramling]

What "rule"? I have never seen a rule that states there has to be total silence in the "Quiet" carriage. If you want that I suggest you travel by car.

Have a look at this https://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/quiet-zone

Compared to other TOCs Chiltern have a quite detailed set of guidelines for what is and isn't acceptable inside the quiet coach. You'll note they even use the word "rules", and although they're not looking towards total silence they're not far off, in particular that talking is pretty well not allowed.

In my experience Chiltern's quiet areas tend to be comparatively well respected compared to other TOCs. One suspects this may be thanks to the generally more-respectable-than-average areas they run through.

 

[All Line Rover]

This has reminded me that there are quite a number of TOCs with short trains that have quiet zones. Chiltern, c2c, SWT, possibly Greater Anglia. The shortest "intercity" trains with quiet zones are, however, VTWC's Voyagers (all 5-car).

 

[All Line Rover]

Just do away with with quiet coach all together. They cause nothing but arguments & are a pain in the backside for the traincrew to police.

Why not charge for use of a quiet zone on long distance TOCs?

 

[Loop & Link]

On the 07:17 from Preston to New St and there hasn't been a moment of silence from them, utterly ridiculous an d disrespectful.

I know its not the 'Silent Zone' but if you want to gas away constantly why not sit in the standard zone?

Did you confront them then, if it was such an issue?....

 

[dk1]

Why not charge for use of a quiet zone on long distance TOCs?

I just think that's a step too far. It really is a headache now. Most people have some sort of phone & although I find it entertaining & passes the time to see people kick off at others & get on their high horse, it causes unnecessary issues.

 

[All Line Rover]

I just think that's a step too far. It really is a headache now. Most people have some sort of phone & although I find it entertaining & passes the time to see people kick off at others & get on their high horse, it causes unnecessary issues.

No different from first class, I would argue. A small charge wouldn't work on DOO services, though first class is equally useless on such services.

 

[dk1]

No different from first class, I would argue. A small charge wouldn't work on DOO services, though first class is equally useless on such services.

Far too much grief for the poor guard on busy services. I wouldn't bother.

 

[HowardGWR]

Did you confront them then, if it was such an issue?....

I don't think we are going to be informed, pity. It's not as though they were bovver boys.

 

[Pinza-C55]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WJXHY2OXGE

 

[SpacePhoenix]

@Pinza-C55

Youtube videos can be embedded with youtube tags, the bit after the v= is what you place inbetween the tags

 

[bramling]

Just do away with with quiet coach all together. They cause nothing but arguments & are a pain in the backside for the traincrew to police.

To be fair, they're a great thing, *if they can't be made to work*.

To my mind there are two issues:
1) TOCs simply don't lay down the ground-rules clearly and visibly enough.
2) Some people can't see beyond the end of their nose and don't take any notice.

The first of those should be easy to resolve with clear signage, and easy-to-interpret guidelines laid down for what is and isn't acceptable - along the lines of what can be found on Chiltern's website. This would make it easier for traincrew when an issue develops, as it takes away the current uncertainty and scope for different interpretations or what is and isn't allowed.

Sure we're never going to fully deal with the second of those, but if we can influence just a proportion to moderate their behaviour then it would help.

Traincrew have always got the option to move people around providing the service isn't full to capacity, so with the right people skills it should still be easier to resolve than a ticketing dispute, which is part of the bread-and-butter of a guard/train manager/senior conductor/etc's role.

 

[Llanigraham]

Have a look at this https://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/quiet-zone

Compared to other TOCs Chiltern have a quite detailed set of guidelines for what is and isn't acceptable inside the quiet coach. You'll note they even use the word "rules", and although they're not looking towards total silence they're not far off, in particular that talking is pretty well not allowed.

In my experience Chiltern's quiet areas tend to be comparatively well respected compared to other TOCs. One suspects this may be thanks to the generally more-respectable-than-average areas they run through.

And was the OP on one of their trains?
If not, not relevant.

 

[BestWestern]

I think that I must have misunderstood the rules about quiet carriages - I understand that mobile phones are banned, as would be extraneous music or other artificial noise, but I did not realise that conversation is also forbidden.

It's tricky to grasp why one person on a mobile would be generally accepted as not okay, but a group of 2/3/4 people having a chat at normal conversational volume for the entire journey is fine. Doesn't really add up, surely?!

 

[dk1]

It's tricky to grasp why one person on a mobile would be generally accepted as not okay, but a group of 2/3/4 people having a chat at normal conversational volume for the entire journey is fine. Doesn't really add up, surely?!

Exactly. I never understand why we cater so much for the minority. Most people want to talk, make noise, use phones etc. Those that cannot hack being out in the big wide noisy world should either remain in the confines of there home or travel in solitude in their own private vehicle. Public transport is what it says on the tin.

 

[BestWestern]

Exactly. I never understand why we cater so much for the minority. Most people want to talk, make noise, use phones etc. Those that cannot hack being out in the big wide noisy world should either remain in the confines of there home or travel in solitude in their own private vehicle. Public transport is what it says on the tin.

Well, we shall have to agree to disagree then! A quiet coach is rather like First Class - many people who don't use it feel that it's not needed, but if you do use then it you bl**dy well play by the rules!

 

[dk1]

Well, we shall have to agree to disagree then! A quiet coach is rather like First Class - many people who don't use it feel that it's not needed, but if you do use then it you bl**dy well play by the rules!

First & Standard I can accept & happily tolerate. Anything else, just like the disastrous Silver Standard that INTERCITY tried to complicate same train travel with is Just going that step to far.

 

[All Line Rover]

On a Pendolino, designating 46 of the 444 standard class seats as a quiet zone, in the smallest carriage at the end of the train, doesn't seem to me to be catering "too much" for a minority. If avoiding the quiet zone is a struggle, surely having 4 (ish) of the 11 carriages designated as first class (for another minority group) is a daily headache for VTWC staff?

 

[dk1]

On a Pendolino, designating 46 of the 444 standard class seats as a quiet zone, in the smallest carriage at the end of the train, doesn't seem to me to be catering "too much" for a minority. If avoiding the quiet zone is a struggle, surely having 4 (ish) of the 11 carriages designated as first class (for another minority group) is a daily headache for VTWC staff?

I disagree with that. Class differential is something I don't mind it's the separating the same class I have issues with. Perhaps we should bring back 3rd or sub-standard class for those who want a quiet life.

 

[All Line Rover]

I disagree with that. Class differential is something I don't mind it's the separating the same class I have issues with. Perhaps we should bring back 3rd or sub-standard class for those who want a quiet life.

Then I suggest that quiet zones are re-designated as "quiet class".

Some people sometimes like a spacious seat with a table. Some people sometimes like a quiet travel environment. Some people sometimes like both.

Quiet zones might not be charged for given the nil cost (a few stickers excepted) of providing them, but I've nothing against a small charge on long distance services in recognition of the fact that a service, beyond merely providing a seat, is being offered.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

I think the issue is that whilst *most* people are quite capable of holding a conversation without their voice carrying to the extent that it irritates others, as usual *a minority* of people feel it is quite acceptable to shout their business far and wide. Unfortunately it always seems to be that the people with the most annoying voices and the most inane conversation seem to fit in the latter category.

An eastbound journey on the Newcastle/Carlisle line can be a trying experience on a weekend mid-morning, full of kids on their way to a day at the MetroCentre repetitively shrieking pointless village gossip at each other - X has just got together with Y, X has just got a lovely new pair of shoes, X is shagging Y behind Z's back, X has just fallen out with her parents, X has just been suspended from school for kicking a teacher, X has just left facebook, X posted something abusive on Y's twitter, etc etc etc.

Don't forget the endless "And I was like", "she was like", "he was like" on a constant loop too from the so called university educated lot who it seems that they have had their brain removed and replaced with a defective replacement.

 

[andythebrave]

Crossed one off my bucket list last year, the far north line. Beautiful it was too.
Except for the family at the next table who spent the whole (not an exaggeration) southbound journey from Thurso talking loudly about what they were going to have at KFC when they got to Inverness.
Yes, four hours for a 2 minute subject.

 

[HowardGWR]

Travel by car or don't travel. At the petrol station, one can come across no-needers, but it's just a brief interlude before one retreats gratefully back to one's mobile cocoon.

 

[fizzwheel]

I'm a frequent quiet coach user.

Quiet Coach + Noise cancelling headphones =

in the morning I can go back to sleep

In the evening I get some peace and quiet after being in the office all day.

To be fair on the GWR HST the quiet coach is reasonably well observed, particularly in the mornings, when its the same group of people in there each day.

Evenings can be worse especially in the summer during school holidays.

The trouble is there is a conflict, commuters like me who want some quiet after a day in the office and holiday makers who are excited to be off on their holiday.

I haven't looked at the GWR booking engine, but I would imagine based on what I have seen, that it doesn't make it obvious when you reserve a seat that the quiet coach is just that and that's where some of the problem lies.

Once you have sat down in coach A and noticed the quiet ambience, its a bit late to get up and find another seat if you don't want to sit in there especially if the train is packed as it often is.

I've not seen the TM turf anybody out for excessive noise, But one fellow passenger did ask one guy who was having a very loud phone call aka business meeting "do you realise you are in the quiet coach, I sat here because I wanted quiet not because I wanted to listen to your phone call"

to be fair the guy did get up and move.

I like the quiet, I realise I am pushing it a bit with my headphones on, but I have checked and they are closed back so no sound leaks out.

I'd happily pay a bit extra for it, but then I'd want it enforced properly which then brings conflict for the TM.

Some people are just selfish and I think some people don't realise despite the fact I think its well signed that it is the quiet coach and the majority of TM's also announce that coach A is the quiet coach and to not use mobiles phones and to keep noise to the minimum.

I'd be pee'd off if they took it away to be honest.

 

[boxy321]

I would like a "feet on seats" coach and then all the thoughtless ones that do this could sit together in their own filth, and leave the other coaches for those that don't want to risk dog poo on their clothes.

I'm all for a proper scum class, like third.

No carpets or upholstery, all seats opposed for use as foot rests. People encouraged to use speakerphone mode 'Apprentice' style. And half the carriage prepared for bikes.

 

[boxy321]

On Saturday I took a London Midland 323 for the first time- I was amused to see that the area immediately behind the cab was labelled up as the quiet zone!

The quiet zone on Chiltern is directly in front of (behind) the class 68 loco!

 

[bramling]

They have done for years, never enforced, with a tiny, almost invisible sign on the 323s.

I wonder if the quiet area on the 323s is more of a legacy from when the units had those awful TV screens. I seem to remember the area behind the cabs was the only place without them.

 

[bramling]

Exactly. I never understand why we cater so much for the minority. Most people want to talk, make noise, use phones etc. Those that cannot hack being out in the big wide noisy world should either remain in the confines of there home or travel in solitude in their own private vehicle. Public transport is what it says on the tin.

Is it the minority though? Apart from journeys like Skegness, most train passengers quietly sit and get on with their own thing, be it using a device, reading a book, sleeping, looking out of the window, or whatever. The typical scenario, especially in commuter areas, is a carriage mainly full of quiet or silent people with a small proportion making a noise in one way or another. The fact that TOCs introduced quiet carriages in the first place suggests there must have been some demand for them.

The root cause of any issue is that a minority of people have no idea how to conduct themselves in public without imposing themselves on others, this is a harder issue to solve, and isn't just confined to the railway.

 

[D365]

I'm all for a proper scum class, like third.

You'd better be careful there, some posters would suggest that the Class 387, 700 etc. are a scum class in their own right...

 

[RichmondCommu]

On the 07:17 from Preston to New St and there hasn't been a moment of silence from them, utterly ridiculous an d disrespectful.

I know its not the 'Silent Zone' but if you want to gas away constantly why not sit in the standard zone?

Oh great another forum member who hates old people.