Polar Express to operate from Euston, Christmas 2024

[matt]

I'd assume it'll be a steam loco on the London end of the train so passengers see a steam loco when they board with a Class 47 or similar on the other end. This is how the Vintage Trains one works in Birmingham, the steam loco is on the blocks at Moor Street.

 

[Backroom_boy]

I'd assume it'll be a steam loco on the London end of the train so passengers see a steam loco when they board with a Class 47 or similar on the other end. This is how the Vintage Trains one works in Birmingham, the steam loco is on the blocks at Moor Street.

Is steam allowed at the London end? It's pretty enclosed

 

[matt]

Is steam allowed at the London end? It's pretty enclosed

Unless anything has changed recently then yes.

 

[Kite159]

I guess the charter can use platform 16 at Euston which is out of the way from the rest of the station in terms of crowd management.

 

[james_the_xv]

If the set is based at Southall I'd imagine they'll coal it for the day before service and use the diesel to provide most the traction power to save Coal, but I cant imagine a brimmed water tank will last a whole day? Presume access at Euston for water is nil and water stops through the day will be needed somewhere?

 

[Class15]

Are there any updates on this?

 

[Phil Neal]

What would you like to know? I will try an answer if it isn’t to detailed. Obviously movements will be on real time trains at some point.

 

[Class15]

What would you like to know? I will try an answer if it isn’t to detailed. Obviously movements will be on real time trains at some point.

Where they are going from Euston and what locos.

 

[Phil Neal]

All I know is that it will be upto wembley yards and back round, we will have a WCRC 47 on the far end, and a Riley black 5 on the buffers. The exact traction is TBC at the moment. Stock will be housed in Southall, and we have a watrering stop built into a "North Pole" stop.

We will be controlling access at the bottom of the ramp, but I may be able to arrange platform access to a few people if there is interest.

 

[12LDA28C]

All I know is that it will be upto wembley yards and back round, we will have a WCRC 47 on the far end, and a Riley black 5 on the buffers. The exact traction is TBC at the moment. Stock will be housed in Southall, and we have a watrering stop built into a "North Pole" stop.

We will be controlling access at the bottom of the ramp, but I may be able to arrange platform access to a few people if there is interest.

Or a 57 no doubt, dependent on what is available as long as it is ETS fitted.

 

[Class15]

All I know is that it will be upto wembley yards and back round, we will have a WCRC 47 on the far end, and a Riley black 5 on the buffers. The exact traction is TBC at the moment. Stock will be housed in Southall, and we have a watrering stop built into a "North Pole" stop.

We will be controlling access at the bottom of the ramp, but I may be able to arrange platform access to a few people if there is interest.

Thanks. That’s exactly what I wanted to know.

 

[Russel]

Why can I see this being London's answer to Glasgow's "Willy's Chocolate Experience"...?

 

[Deepgreen]

The feedback on their offerings on various heritage lines is generally glowing and 5*

Maybe but they don't leave from a ghastly semi-underground terminus and wander through grim suburbs to a siding in an industrial estate, and return. With GWR using Euston next year, no doubt this won't be repeated then.

 

[renegademaster]

All I know is that it will be upto wembley yards and back round, we will have a WCRC 47 on the far end, and a Riley black 5 on the buffers. The exact traction is TBC at the moment. Stock will be housed in Southall, and we have a watrering stop built into a "North Pole" stop.

We will be controlling access at the bottom of the ramp, but I may be able to arrange platform access to a few people if there is interest.

Up the WCML slows/Watford DC or some way bit more meandering? Not sure there is a way to make it more exciting a route without a reversal

 

[172007]

Not sure why posters seem to think the journey or more actually the route the train takes has Amy baring on anything. The experience is a real steam train that the Children gets to see, once departed the entire experience is within the carriages with professional actors playing the role of the characters in the film. It's train carriage based theatre on the move and that is all.

 

[deltic]

Maybe but they don't leave from a ghastly semi-underground terminus and wander through grim suburbs to a siding in an industrial estate, and return. With GWR using Euston next year, no doubt this won't be repeated then.

As @172007 explains the experience is nothing to do with the route the train takes but the onboard activities aimed at children.

 

[fgwrich]

Not sure why posters seem to think the journey or more actually the route the train takes has Amy baring on anything. The experience is a real steam train that the Children gets to see, once departed the entire experience is within the carriages with professional actors playing the role of the characters in the film. It's train carriage based theatre on the move and that is all.

Indeed, I think the point of this being the 'Polar Express' is lost on some on here i.e not an enthusiasts special but one for children who will most likely be aged 5-10 and excited to see Father Christmas & take a steam train to the North Pole* and back.

*Even if it's not the North Pole, Hitachi has that so Wembley will have to do instead

 

[DanNCL]

Is this the same people that were behind the Polar Express at Weardale?

If so, they’ve got a good reputation and they know what they’re doing, but the southern WCML is worlds away from any heritage line. Heritage lines will have a (usually rural) station dressed up as as ‘the North Pole’ where people get off to meet Santa as part of the experience.
Going to a freight yard in suburban London where the passengers will have to stay on the train simply won’t have the same feel to it no matter how good the actors onboard are.

The boarding process is also a key part of the experience, Heritage railways can throw all of their resources into making it a good experience. There’ll be people in costume to greet passengers the second they enter the station and the whole thing will be an experience from the moment they step into the station to the moment they leave.
Euston simply can’t match that or indeed come anywhere close. Even if they do manage to avoid the last minute platform announcement and rush, they’ll have to confine the ‘experience’ to the platform they’re using and the train. The passengers will have to navigate the crowded concourse at Euston before they meet a single person in costume and again as soon as they’re off the train they’ll have to navigate the crowded concourse.

Might not seem like big issues but when you add them all together, there’s simply no comparison between the type of operation a heritage line can do for this and anything possible from any London terminal.

On the other hand the traction doesn’t really matter. The passengers will only see the buffer stops end of the train at Euston, so simply have something Steam there even if its not actually powering and stick whatever is convenient on the other end, the kids won’t see it so it doesn’t matter if it’s a scruffy 57 powering the train

 

[Mollman]

Is this the same people that were behind the Polar Express at Weardale?

If so, they’ve got a good reputation and they know what they’re doing, but the southern WCML is worlds away from any heritage line. Heritage lines will have a (usually rural) station dressed up as as ‘the North Pole’ where people get off to meet Santa as part of the experience.
Going to a freight yard in suburban London where the passengers will have to stay on the train simply won’t have the same feel to it no matter how good the actors onboard are.

The boarding process is also a key part of the experience, Heritage railways can throw all of their resources into making it a good experience. There’ll be people in costume to greet passengers the second they enter the station and the whole thing will be an experience from the moment they step into the station to the moment they leave.
Euston simply can’t match that or indeed come anywhere close. Even if they do manage to avoid the last minute platform announcement and rush, they’ll have to confine the ‘experience’ to the platform they’re using and the train. The passengers will have to navigate the crowded concourse at Euston before they meet a single person in costume and again as soon as they’re off the train they’ll have to navigate the crowded concourse.

Might not seem like big issues but when you add them all together, there’s simply no comparison between the type of operation a heritage line can do for this and anything possible from any London terminal.

On the other hand the traction doesn’t really matter. The passengers will only see the buffer stops end of the train at Euston, so simply have something Steam there even if its not actually powering and stick whatever is convenient on the other end, the kids won’t see it so it doesn’t matter if it’s a scruffy 57 powering the train

I think it will be aimed at those who are unable or can't afford to get to a heritage railway. Marylebone might have been a more attractive station to leave from (King's Cross already having connections with a certain other fictional train) but unlikely to have the capacity or an easy terminal point at the 'country end'.

 

[12C]

Is this the same people that were behind the Polar Express at Weardale?

If so, they’ve got a good reputation and they know what they’re doing, but the southern WCML is worlds away from any heritage line. Heritage lines will have a (usually rural) station dressed up as as ‘the North Pole’ where people get off to meet Santa as part of the experience.
Going to a freight yard in suburban London where the passengers will have to stay on the train simply won’t have the same feel to it no matter how good the actors onboard are.

Having done the Polar Express with our kids at a couple of preserved lines, you don’t usually get off the train at the other end. The train passes a ‘North Pole’ scene set up trackside, usually complete with Santa waving. It then stops to change direction, everyone stays on the train and Santa appears on board, making his way through to see the kids on the return journey.

I guess the ‘North Pole’ scene could be set up in a freight yard, although Santa will likely need PTS and Hi-Viz to be waving from trackside!

 

[Russel]

Maybe but they don't leave from a ghastly semi-underground terminus and wander through grim suburbs to a siding in an industrial estate, and return. With GWR using Euston next year, no doubt this won't be repeated then.

You're assuming the train does actually leave from the ghastly, semi-underground terminus!

We all know how often the WCML falls apart, Euston seems to be plunged into chaos on an almost weekly basis...

 

[DarloRich]

Why can I see this being London's answer to Glasgow's "Willy's Chocolate Experience"...?

How did it work in Edinburgh last year? Why do posters here have to be so endlessly negative about anything slightly different?

Indeed, I think the point of this being the 'Polar Express' is lost on some on here i.e not an enthusiasts special but one for children who will most likely be aged 5-10 and excited to see Father Christmas & take a steam train to the North Pole* and back

Exactly -it is a kids day out. Family fun with a steam train in an area with few accessible steam railways. I suspect it will do well bookings wise

We all know how often the WCML falls apart, Euston seems to be plunged into chaos on an almost weekly basis...

Being steam hauled it should be ok OHLE wise.

 

[renegademaster]

The poor marketing of heritage railways is really shown when Londoners think Heritage railways arent accsessiable for them . From St Pancras you can get to Grand Central, Nene Valley and Bluebell by direct train in roughly an hours time, Spa valley with a change at london bridge and Chinor and Princess with a bus to Marylebone

 

[Russel]

The poor marketing of heritage railways is really shown when Londoners think Heritage railways arent accsessiable for them . From St Pancras you can get to Grand Central, Nene Valley and Bluebell by direct train in roughly an hours time, Spa valley with a change at london bridge and Chinor and Princess with a bus to Marylebone

If it's outside of zone 6, it doesn't exist...

 

[12C]

Very few people booking this will be remotely interested in visiting Heritage railways, just like the majority who book the Polar Express on preserved lines would be unlikely to visit at any other time. They go because it’s the Polar Express, which has become one of these ‘must do’ Americanised Christmas traditions like the naughty elf and expensive Xmas Eve boxes. It doesn’t matter where it’s based or what route it takes (it has been known on occasions to not go anywhere at all, and the website warns this is a possibility). It’s all about the experience on the train, which is basically a theatre production in each coach.

 

[A S Leib]

From St Pancras you can get to Grand Central, Nene Valley and Bluebell by direct train in roughly an hours time, Spa valley with a change at london bridge and Chinor and Princess with a bus to Marylebone

Or four stops east on the sub-surface lines, another train then a bus from Epping or Shenfield to Ongar, which isn't leaving the area covered by Oyster apart from the bus.

 

[47434]

Maybe but they don't leave from a ghastly semi-underground terminus and wander through grim suburbs to a siding in an industrial estate, and return. With GWR using Euston next year, no doubt this won't be repeated then.

Presume from this you have never actually been on a Polar Express train ride? As odd as it sounds to the enthusiast community, it isn't focused on the scenery (which you can't see in the dark anyway), mileage, engines etc. The experience is wholly 'internal' once the passengers are on board and believe me, the kids (and most of the adults) absolutely love it. Theatre on wheels.

Is this the same people that were behind the Polar Express at Weardale?

If so, they’ve got a good reputation and they know what they’re doing, but the southern WCML is worlds away from any heritage line. Heritage lines will have a (usually rural) station dressed up as as ‘the North Pole’ where people get off to meet Santa as part of the experience.
Going to a freight yard in suburban London where the passengers will have to stay on the train simply won’t have the same feel to it no matter how good the actors onboard are.

The boarding process is also a key part of the experience, Heritage railways can throw all of their resources into making it a good experience. There’ll be people in costume to greet passengers the second they enter the station and the whole thing will be an experience from the moment they step into the station to the moment they leave.
Euston simply can’t match that or indeed come anywhere close. Even if they do manage to avoid the last minute platform announcement and rush, they’ll have to confine the ‘experience’ to the platform they’re using and the train. The passengers will have to navigate the crowded concourse at Euston before they meet a single person in costume and again as soon as they’re off the train they’ll have to navigate the crowded concourse.

Might not seem like big issues but when you add them all together, there’s simply no comparison between the type of operation a heritage line can do for this and anything possible from any London terminal.

On the other hand the traction doesn’t really matter. The passengers will only see the buffer stops end of the train at Euston, so simply have something Steam there even if its not actually powering and stick whatever is convenient on the other end, the kids won’t see it so it doesn’t matter if it’s a scruffy 57 powering the train

No, nothing to do with Weardale. Same folk who run the Wensleydale, Spa Valley and South Devon ops and are very very good at it

 

[SuspectUsual]

Very few people booking this will be remotely interested in visiting Heritage railways, just like the majority who book the Polar Express on preserved lines would be unlikely to visit at any other time.

Indeed, and in the case of the Wensleydale one Polar Express passengers are actively prevented from seeing anything else of the preserved railway. Parking is off site at the rest area off the A1(M), shuttle bus to Leeming Bar station, onto the train, up the line and back, and exit through the gift shop.

But that's exactly what the pyjama-clad hordes want, and its incredibly popular and lucrative, and effectively underpins the Wensleydale playing trains for the other 10 or 11 months of the year

 

[47434]

But that's exactly what the pyjama-clad hordes want, and its incredibly popular and lucrative, and effectively underpins the Wensleydale playing trains for the other 10 or 11 months of the year

Intrigued what you mean by ''playing trains"

 

[DanNCL]

No, nothing to do with Weardale. Same folk who run the Wensleydale, Spa Valley and South Devon ops and are very very good at it

That is the same people I’m referring to then, they’re not involved with Weardale now but they were historically. They moved their North East operation of the Polar Express from Weardale to Wensleydale several years ago, presumably as Wensleydale can provide a steam loco whereas Weardale can’t.

I agree they’re very very good at it.

Intrigued what you mean by ''playing trains"

That’ll be the standard heritage service, which on a lot of lines especially if steam is involved costs more to run even with volunteers than it generates in revenue.