GrimShady
Established Member
- Joined
- 13 Dec 2016
- Messages
- 1,740
You can check her voting history here :
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/11971/jo_swinson/east_dunbartonshire/votes
No need, I'm well aware of what or local MP had been up to.
You can check her voting history here :
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/11971/jo_swinson/east_dunbartonshire/votes
Nope, I simply haven't got round to listing her great many trespasses. It may actually be easier to list any actual truths.
Do you remember ANYTHING about the coalition government? How about the tuition fees she promised to vote against to name one?
Have you been watching the grilling she's been getting from Neil and Marr?
Compared to the other choices available, merely being annoying is a positive.
At least Conservatives and Labour are sticking to representing the core of people who generally vote for them. The Liberal Democrats are neither liberal nor democrats any more.
The please, either list some lies that Jo Swinson has told, or retract your claim that she is a liar.
If you do neither of these things then everyone who reads these last few posts will see that you are making a statement (and quite a slanderous one at that) for which you are unable, when challenged, to provide any evidence. The only plausible inference from that is that you are knowingly stating something that is untrue.
So which option are you going to take?
I remember the coalition Government well. I remember Jo Swinson supporting a number of policies that I fundamentally disagree with. I even remember that the LibDem support for those policies was one reason why I swapped my allegiance to Labour, after having voted LibDem in 2010. However, supporting policies that you disagree with does not make someone a liar. What makes someone a liar is - ummm - telling lies. If you are unable to give examples of actual *lies* that Jo Swinson has told, then it is wrong of you to say that she is a liar.
No, I didn't see them, but I read about them? Why? Did she tell any lies in them? If so, can you tell me what they were?
Hmmm I'll take option one please
https://en-gb.facebook.com/Channel4...ted-to-increase-tuition-fees/733567253727665/
"We shouldn't have voted to increase tuition fees... because we'd said we wouldn't do it." Pretty sure there's a picture of her somewhere proudly displaying such a pledge.
There's many more like it........Slanderous, good one!
Didn't she also say she'd respect the vote on brexit? Another good one!
Did someone say 'Woke'? It's all BS really. I'd love to be so anarchistic to tick the fabled None Of The Above option on the ballot as really, you cannot vote for the Whitehall civil servants that really dictates policy. All those Sir Huffington-Blowers(!) that we never hear of in the papers that are unelected, y'know?
I better shuttup....
Aren’t those examples of hypocrisy, rather than outright lies? I believe she has explained that she was “wrong” before and now thinks differently.
Pathetic, nonetheless.
She pledged not to increase the fees and as soon as she got a bit of power.....up came the two fingers. I fully appreciate she now admits that was wrong but I suspect only because it serves her purpose...to be PM, well we all know that's never going to happen.
No different from the rest and IMO totally untrustworthy.
Hmmm I'll take option one please
https://en-gb.facebook.com/Channel4...ted-to-increase-tuition-fees/733567253727665/
"We shouldn't have voted to increase tuition fees... because we'd said we wouldn't do it." Pretty sure there's a picture of her somewhere proudly displaying such a pledge.
Didn't she also say she'd respect the vote on brexit? Another good one!
LibDemManifesto2017 said:That’s why, when the terms of our future relationship with the EU have been negotiated (over the next two years on the Government’s timetable), we will put that deal to a vote of the British people in a referendum, with the alternative option of staying in the EU on the ballot paper.
But has she actually lied or has she merely changed her position in order to garner the maximum number of votes when it suited her?
For the record, I despise the Lib Dems with a passion.
A good attempt. But that's not a lie. A lie is, saying something that you know at the time you say it is not true. You have just quoted Jo Swinson expressing regret at a past decision of the LibDems, when they promised to do something but subsequently changed their minds (in somewhat understandable circumstances, since they were in the position of having to make compromises as part of a coalition Government). Promising to do something and then later on changing your mind is a broken promise, not a lie (unless you were actually intending to break the promise at the time you made it). And expressing regret at a past decision that was made when someone else was the leader of your party is certainly not lying.
Well she wasn't an MP at the time of the EU referendum. In 2017 she stood on a manifesto that clearly stated:
As far as I'm aware, her stance in Parliament since then was consistent with that manifesto. And of course the LibDems are going into this election with a different manifesto policy on Europe. Again, I don't see any sign of any lies there.
Do you have any examples of Jo Swinson saying anything that actually IS a lie?
Hmmmm. Expected reply I supposeGood night in the pub, was it?
Very eloquently put lol but yeah it's the same thing is it not? Let's not forget it wasn't years down the line she changed her mind, It was literally the first few weeks after gaining power. Maybe a betrayal if it makes it sound better? Which is worse?
I just like arguing about semantics.
I’ll come clean and say I basically agree with you - a betrayal is far worse than a lie. The Lib Dems betrayed their core vote for a sniff of power in 2010, and will do so again at the drop of a hat.
I can respect a liar more than a betrayer, so long as his lies are delivered with some eloquence and panache, I guess that explains why I’ll be voting Tory at this election .
Although I’m disappointed with BoJo’s oration - for such an intelligent, eloquent man he has fallen well short of my expectations.
He’d best avoid that Andrew Neil grilling at all costs.
I’m sure she is, but she’s running the worst campaign of the whole shebang.
I get the feeling that some of that is she's had more media exposure recently and thus more opportunity to alienate people (or have mud slung at her), whereas the leaders of the Conservative and Labour parties had already alienated significant portions of the electorate before the election was called.I try and keep up from here in the USA but sounds like I am hopelessly out of touch.
She will literally say or do anything for power. Her track record has been deplorable. Totally untrustworthy, much more so than the other clowns standing for election.
There has been alot of goodwill towards the Lib Dems with their strong Remain stance in recent months but the public have seen Swinson up close over the past few weeks and don't like what they see.
Good God! Any experience of being a Spin Doctor?
She signed her name on the pledge! She said she would vote to cap the fees and then done a complete 180.....AND voted to raise them.
That's what you call a LIE, the truth is there for all to see. Try and convince those students caught up in her LIES it was only a broken promise, lets see what kind of backlash you'll get.
I just baffles me why anyone would want to defend someone like that.
Worse than that is his record on Heathrow. Having promised to lie down in front of the bulldozers, when the crucial vote came up he engineered himself a trip to Afghanistan in order to avoid it. This would have required considerable extra security in such a high-risk location. So he's actually putting our forces in harm's way to avoid personal and political embarrassment.For instance Boris Johnson has said a lot of negative stuff about HS2, as it goes down well with his constituents. Yet he has NEVER voted on it. The reason being is that his party wants him to vote in favour.
I support Labour and I'm voting Labour in this election.
Out of interest would that be because of, or in spite of, Corbyn?
Haha! No, but I can be quite a stickler for accuracy and people not saying untrue things.
So you're still calling her a liar, even though it's becoming increasingly obvious that you cannot find a single time when she has apparently told a direct lie. Can you really not see how wrong that is? Can you not see how that makes YOU the person who is telling a lie (about Jo Swinson)?
Bottom line is: 9 years ago, the LibDems made a pledge on what they would do on tuition fees. They did so at a time when Jo Swinson was not leader of the party - she was one a large number of MPs - and as far as I can make out, a fairly junior one at that - so you're already on pretty shaky ground when you try to blame Jo Swinson for what the LibDems did at that time. If anyone is to blame, it's surely Nick Clegg, who no longer represents the LibDems. The LibDems changed their minds very quickly after the election when faced with the unexpected situation of having to negotiate a coalition Government. To some extent, that's the nature of politics: You have to respond to changing circumstances, and that means, you have to sometimes change your mind about things in order to achieve those changes that are achievable in the circumstances. I think it's very arguable (although a bit subjective) that the LibDems were too ready to compromise on this issue given how big a deal they'd made of it before the election. But that's not at all the same thing as lying. My own sense is the LibDems were very naive not to realise how their tuition fee reversal would be seen, but they were probably genuinely trying to achieve the best they could from being the minor partner in a a coalition situation rather than being deliberately deceptive.
You may well feel justifiably angry at that ONE decision that the LibDems made 9 years ago (and which it seems unlikely that Jo Swinson herself had much to do with, other than going along with what more senior figures at the time decided on). But I think you're making a much bigger deal out of it than it is in 2019 - and it certainly doesn't justify your saying things that appear to be not true.
Yet on a different thread, you appear to be defending Donald Trump, whose record - not only on repeatedly telling verifiable lies, but also on making dangerous policy decisions that massively damage millions of people's lives and it seems also on direct corruption - makes Jo Swinson look like a shining angel. I imagine it would baffle quite a lot of people why anyone would want to defend Donald Trump.
I don't particularly support Swinson - like I said, I support Labour and I'm voting Labour in this election. But I think you're making her out to be far worse than she really is.
It's a crowded field though! Nicola Sturgeon is the only grown-up in the room, on top of her subject and clamps down straightaway on any nonsense discovered about SN candidates, no matter how far in the past. I'm voting for Andrew George in St Ives almost despite him standing as a Lib Dem, and display his poster which, yes, is in LD colours but makes no mention of the party, and his leaflets are equally sparing of the party name, despite his winning four times at General Elections for them! Swinson's been to the adjoining constituency, but not come here, with a Con majority over LD of 320. Now I hear Norman Lamb's old seat in Norfolk, LD for donkeys', is thought to be going to either Con or Lab. Lady Bracknell would have some sage advice for her!I’m sure she is, but she’s running the worst campaign of the whole shebang.
I simply do not see him a the devil incarnate that others do.
He is certainly not the devil incarnat however he doesn't help himself, as he positions himself as a patriotic person, however when he was called up to serve in Vietnam he avoided service.
Not just once, but 5 times.
Feel free to criticise him for not being someone who want to give people healthcare (which given that he's a Republican is unsurprising), however given that most Trump supporters voted him as the President because they saw him a Patriotic.
Would you consider someone who appears to have deliberately avoided serving in the military when many others did as Patriotic?
Trump is now accused, on very strong evidence, of withholding military aid agreed by Congress for Ukraine, where war with Russia could break out any time. His motive is simply to do down a political opponent.Who's defending Trump? I simply do not see him a the devil incarnate that others do. As I pointed there's been many more dangerous leaders in the world for the last century than an old business man who sometimes fudges his lines. Also not being on the Anti Trump bandwagon that most people are I'm not aware of every little thing said.
Sorry but you're wrong, Swinson is not to be trusted and is unelectable, this is coming from a member of her constituency where she's not very popular at the moment.