Proposals to reopen Exeter to Plymouth via Okehampton

[59CosG95]

Moderator note: Split from

Preliminary Work on Okehampton Line: progress updates

Are the public announcements of funding for an infrastructure project made weeks or even months after the actual decision has been made? The least vague mention for Okehampton has been 'early 2021' for a funding decision. So, why are NR and their contractor Quattro working on the line if there...

www.railforums.co.uk

Not sure if anyone on here's seen the NRWG (Northern Route Working Group) blog lately, but this is their latest post. https://northernrouteworkinggroup.w...ll-transform-transport-across-the-south-west/

Devon ‘Green Main Line’ reopening will transform transport across the South West​

Reopening the ‘Northern Route’ throughout from Exeter to Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock will provide transformative transport links to large parts of Devon and Cornwall, including direct trains to London, says the group examining a reopened electrified main line railway between Exeter and Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock.

Tavistock Okehampton Reopening Scheme (TORS) says the full reopening of the route will improve access to Plymouth, Exeter and beyond for communities in West, Mid and North Devon and North Cornwall in addition to Exeter and Tavistock, improving access to education and jobs, as well as serving the growing leisure and tourism market. It will also improve transport connectivity in Dorset. By extending existing Waterloo-Exeter trains over the reopened railway to Plymouth, TORS argues that the connectivity and benefits would be higher than any previous proposals. The existing services from Plymouth to Gunnislake and Exeter to Barnstaple would be retained and enhanced, while express bus links to Torrington, Holsworthy, Launceston/Bude and Wadebridge/Padstow from the railway could provide faster public transport links in those areas than ever before.

The ‘Northern Route’ – or ‘Dartmoor Line’ as the section to Okehampton is being formally named – could also act as a diversionary route when the coastal main line is closed by extreme weather or for maintenance – and by enabling longer closures of this route for engineering works to take place, make Network Rail’s wider resilience programme cheaper, easier and more effective.

There is also considerable potential, says TORS, for freight trains to take long-distance lorries off the roads by providing an all-weather route. Trains of supermarket products already run to Inverness, and the distances from distribution hubs to Devon and Cornwall mean similar trains could cut lorry miles and reduce carbon emissions in the South West.

TORS envisages that the existing Exeter to Okehampton and Bere Alston to Plymouth railways would be upgraded with double track and in cab signalling, with a rebuilt railway through Dartmoor and Tavistock. The route would be electrified throughout. Costs are still being determined, but TORS expects full reopening and route upgrades to be comparable with or less than other major transport schemes on a cost-per-mile basis. In 2014, Network Rail estimated the cost of a full double-track railway at £875m, with a 66% contingency.

A two-stop journey time of 65 minutes is achievable on the electrified railway, with non-stop journey times of 59 minutes between Exeter and Plymouth. Journey times from Okehampton to Exeter of 22 minutes, Tavistock to Plymouth of 22 minutes and non-stop of 59 minutes between Plymouth and Exeter will boost a huge area of Devon and Cornwall, improve social inclusion, provide wide-ranging environmental benefits and many new jobs.
TORS director Jim Collins – who was also Strategic Rail Authority Head of Franchise Planning, Managing Director of Thameslink and Manager of Plymouth and Cornish railways – says: “While there is further work to be done on the fine detail of the timings, we are confident in our analysis. The strategic impact of the full route reopening would be very significant under our proposals, and would actually help Network Rail’s long-term resilience programme for the coastal main line, which remains the region’s overwhelming transport priority.”

Fellow TORS director Andrew Roden – a Cornwall-based railway journalist who led 2005’s campaign to save the ‘Night Riviera’ sleeper train from closure – added: “Reopening of this route has been examined for many years but has always foundered on the grounds of operating costs and revenues or journey times. This proposal developed by rail industry experts is based on solid and proven engineering and operating experience – and while much work needs to be done in a Strategic Outline Business Case, this railway has the potential to transform the economies of huge parts of Devon and Cornwall, with diversionary capability for the main line a very welcome bonus.”

Jon Shaw, Professor of Transport Geography at Plymouth University and TORS’ third director, has studied the impact of climate change on the coastal main line at Dawlish, and concluded that by 2080, under current low emissions scenarios the coastal railway could be disrupted for up to 84 days per year. Scientific opinion is increasingly of the view that the high emissions scenario is more likely, with a total of 120 days of disruption per year by 2080. He said: “We do not believe there is another single scheme in the UK which offers a better transport response to climate change caused by global warming: this is where sea level rises are biting hardest on our transport network."

TORS is now seeking funding for development of a Strategic Outline Business Case, which will enable outstanding work on route options, service plans, environmental and social benefits and community and stakeholder engagement to take place.
Ends
Notes to editors
The Exeter-Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock railway closed as a through route in 1968, with stubs retained from Exeter to Meldon and Plymouth to Bere Alston (for the Gunnislake branch) to serve local communities and businesses. The passenger service from Okehampton to Exeter is expected to be reinstated next year.
Tavistock Okehampton Reopening Scheme CIC (TORS) is a formal body set up by members of the expert Northern Route Working Group, which has spent the last year examining the case. All work has been done on a pro bono basis to develop the case for a Strategic Outline Business Case and further work.
Summary of scheme benefits

• A huge boost in transport connectivity to Mid, West, and North Devon and North Cornwall, leading to major improvement in social inclusion and access to work and education for those unable to drive or without a car.
• A permanent and coherent response to the challenge of climate change.
• Gives Network Rail the ability to close the coastal main line for longer to undertake its long-term resilience programme by diverting trains onto the reopened railway. This capability will make the interventions necessary cheaper, quicker and more effective, providing South Devon and Torbay with a more reliable railway far quicker than if the ‘Northern Route’ was not open.
• Reduced road congestion and accidents on the A386 road between Tavistock and Plymouth, lower road traffic in and around Dartmoor and fewer lorry movements with potential for freight trains
• Lower CO2 emissions from transport by operation of electric trains.
• Opening the full through route will be much more viable economically than operating separate stubs from Exeter to Okehampton and Tavistock to Plymouth. It is the only way the full benefits of serving Tavistock and Okehampton by rail can be realised.

Summary of the scheme

• Core hourly daytime service to be provided by extension of South Western Railway London Waterloo-Exeter services to run to Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock to maximise passenger benefits and reduce additional rolling stock requirements; extra peak time trains possible if needed.
• Route to be electrified throughout with in cab signalling and engineered to accommodate potential freight traffic which is currently deterred by perceived fragility of the coastal main line and steep gradients west of Newton Abbot.
• Non-stop journey time from Exeter to Plymouth of 59 minutes; Exeter to Okehampton journey times of c22 minutes; Okehampton to Tavistock of c19 minutes, and Tavistock to Plymouth of c22 minutes.
• Surge capacity in diversionary mode by ‘flighting’ trains of 3-4 trains per hour max.
• Double-track railway from Exeter to Okehampton/Meldon, single track (extent to be confirmed in SOBC) through parts of Dartmoor to limit environmental impact; double track from Tavistock to Plymouth.
• Potential for express connecting bus links from Okehampton serving Torrington, Holsworthy, Launceston/Bude, and Wadebridge/Padstow to provide faster East-West journeys from Exeter and beyond to those places than is currently possible by public transport.
• Existing Gunnislake and Barnstaple branch services retained in full and enhanced.
• Potential east-west chord line at Cowley Bridge Junction providing a direct connection from the Great Western Main Line from Taunton to Exeter, allowing trains to avoid congestion at Exeter St David’s station, and opening significant new through journey opportunities.

Illustrative timetable and connections of TORS scheme

Very intriguing IMO that the route is proposed to be electrified...

 

[Railwaysceptic]

Very intriguing IMO that the route is proposed to be electrified...

I can only assume they expect electrification to reach Exeter in the foreseeable future. Why they assume that is anyone's guess.

 

[AndrewE]

Pity it finishes with

TORS is now seeking funding for development of a Strategic Outline Business Case, which will enable outstanding work on route options, service plans, environmental and social benefits and community and stakeholder engagement to take place.

Just get on and do it! You can over-think these things.

 

[59CosG95]

I can only assume they expect electrification to reach Exeter in the foreseeable future. Why they assume that is anyone' guess.

In fairness, the South Devon banks were, IIRC, proposed for discrete electrification in the inter-war period (though I can't find any sources close to hand).
And similar electrification has been done elsewhere - the North Island Main Trunk (NIMT) in New Zealand has a 256 mile long isolated 25kV section. There's then a 54.1 mile gap from Hamilton to Papakura (the current southern limit of Auckland's suburban OLE), and a 50.2 mile gap between Palmerston North & Waikanae (the northern limit of Wellington's 1.6kV DC electrified network).

Little to no reason why a similar staging can't be used for Exeter - Okehampton - Tavistock - Plymouth.

 

[Irascible]

Frieght, really?

Can we put discussion of that proposal in it's own thread, maybe? it's not really related to what's actually going on right now.

 

[yorkie]

Can we put discussion of that proposal in it's own thread, maybe? it's not really related to what's actually going on right now.

Agreed. Done.

If anyone spots any off topic posts (and/or any posts that are speculative in nature in non-speculative areas) please report the first off topic post using the report button. If further posts are off topic, please include details of these in the report. Thanks!

 

[Bald Rick]

Oh dear. Another answer looking for a question. Jim really should know better. He must be bored of retirement.

Just get on and do it! You can over-think these things

I’d really rather hope that anyone thinking of spending a billion quid or more of taxpayers’ cash did do a lot of thinking before they spent it. Especially on delivering an hourly service.

 

[tbtc]

Reopening the ‘Northern Route’ throughout from Exeter to Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock will provide transformative transport links to large parts of Devon and Cornwall, including direct trains to London, says the group examining a reopened electrified main line railway between Exeter and Plymouth via Okehampton and Tavistock.

Tavistock Okehampton Reopening Scheme (TORS) says the full reopening of the route will improve access to Plymouth, Exeter and beyond for communities in West, Mid and North Devon and North Cornwall in addition to Exeter and Tavistock, improving access to education and jobs, as well as serving the growing leisure and tourism market. It will also improve transport connectivity in Dorset. By extending existing Waterloo-Exeter trains over the reopened railway to Plymouth, TORS argues that the connectivity and benefits would be higher than any previous proposals. The existing services from Plymouth to Gunnislake and Exeter to Barnstaple would be retained and enhanced, while express bus links to Torrington, Holsworthy, Launceston/Bude and Wadebridge/Padstow from the railway could provide faster public transport links in those areas than ever before.

The ‘Northern Route’ – or ‘Dartmoor Line’ as the section to Okehampton is being formally named – could also act as a diversionary route when the coastal main line is closed by extreme weather or for maintenance – and by enabling longer closures of this route for engineering works to take place, make Network Rail’s wider resilience programme cheaper, easier and more effective.

There is also considerable potential, says TORS, for freight trains to take long-distance lorries off the roads by providing an all-weather route. Trains of supermarket products already run to Inverness, and the distances from distribution hubs to Devon and Cornwall mean similar trains could cut lorry miles and reduce carbon emissions in the South West.

TORS envisages that the existing Exeter to Okehampton and Bere Alston to Plymouth railways would be upgraded with double track and in cab signalling, with a rebuilt railway through Dartmoor and Tavistock. The route would be electrified throughout. Costs are still being determined, but TORS expects full reopening and route upgrades to be comparable with or less than other major transport schemes on a cost-per-mile basis. In 2014, Network Rail estimated the cost of a full double-track railway at £875m, with a 66% contingency.

Sounds fantastic - the people proposing this project think it'd be amazing - case closed!

An "all-weather" route through Dartmoor, an area famous for its constant and predictable climate... with no mention of spending money on the line north of Exeter that is rather prone to flooding... making the SWR Waterloo services even less reliable by combining the existing single track sections with an additional three hours worth of journey on the round trip (because, of course, any Okehampton proposal requires a Waterloo service because That's How Things Were A Hundred Years Ago)...

It's funny how these kind of proposals seem to keep making things as complicated as possible to try to bamboozle you with arguments in favour - e.g. apparently there's a market for high speed buses to various nearby villages, but let's hope that nobody notices that Tavistock to Okehampton is such an insignificant market that it can't sustain a commercial minibus service - let's hope that nobody questions like "why we can't just save a billion pounds and run high quality coach service from Tavistock to Okehampton instead"? If the idea is that people in Padstow etc will "railhead" at stations on this magic new line then how come they can't similarly get a coach service to connect at an existing station on the Barnstaple/ Bere Alston lines? People in Bodmin are going to sit on a coach to Okehampton to get on a train?

The thing that frustrates me here is that Okehampton could have had a regular service to Exeter without much fuss years ago (given that the Sunday service has run for some time) - it's in commuting distance, whilst it's not a top priority for re-opening, it's not a ridiculous idea to have an hourly 150 running from Okehampton into Exeter...

...similarly, Tavistock to Bere Alston (for Plymouth) seems sensible - there's a frequent commercial bus service from Tavistock to Plymouth so there's clearly a market there, again, it's good commuter distance. For the cost of about ten miles of new track and a couple of Sprinters, we could give both Okehampton and Tavistock an hourly service to their nearest big city (i.e. an Okehampton to Exeter shuttle and a Tavistock to Plymouth shuttle) - it wouldn't be particularly complicated, it could be delivered without breaking the bank. However, the boring everyday demand for such services has been sidelined because any proposal in the area seems to be focussed on some LSWR fantasy, a grandiose scheme involving Waterloo services, being a handy diversionary route a few weekends a year... if only we could focus on short simple projects, we could have implemented them by now.

Instead, this aversion to buffer stops and apparent addiction to complicated mega-schemes means nothing actually gets done. Instead, we'll focus resources on small scale schemes like Ebbw Vale/ Fleetwood/ Ashington/ Portishead, where an unremarkable Sprinter could run along an unremarkable siding to provide a reliable means of transport for unremarkable everyday journeys (e.g. people travelling to the nearest big city) - that's the kind of market that rail actually does well at, however much it must pain a certain type of crayola-addict!

 

[MarkyT]

In fairness, the South Devon banks were, IIRC, proposed for discrete electrification in the inter-war period (though I can't find any sources close to hand).
And similar electrification has been done elsewhere - the North Island Main Trunk (NIMT) in New Zealand has a 256 mile long isolated 25kV section. There's then a 54.1 mile gap from Hamilton to Papakura (the current southern limit of Auckland's suburban OLE), and a 50.2 mile gap between Palmerston North & Waikanae (the northern limit of Wellington's 1.6kV DC electrified network).

Little to no reason why a similar staging can't be used for Exeter - Okehampton - Tavistock - Plymouth.

Taunton to Plymouth I think was considered as an electrified 'island', covering the steepest bits, avoiding much steam double-heading, freight splitting etc. They'd have probably used DC pre WW2, maybe 1.5kV. The Dawlish Avoider was being planned around the same era, so that may have solved any sea wall electrification problems.

 

[21C101]

Sounds fantastic - the people proposing this project think it'd be amazing - case closed!

An "all-weather" route through Dartmoor, an area famous for its constant and predictable climate... with no mention of spending money on the line north of Exeter that is rather prone to flooding... making the SWR Waterloo services even less reliable by combining the existing single track sections with an additional three hours worth of journey on the round trip (because, of course, any Okehampton proposal requires a Waterloo service because That's How Things Were A Hundred Years Ago)...

It's funny how these kind of proposals seem to keep making things as complicated as possible to try to bamboozle you with arguments in favour - e.g. apparently there's a market for high speed buses to various nearby villages, but let's hope that nobody notices that Tavistock to Okehampton is such an insignificant market that it can't sustain a commercial minibus service - let's hope that nobody questions like "why we can't just save a billion pounds and run high quality coach service from Tavistock to Okehampton instead"? If the idea is that people in Padstow etc will "railhead" at stations on this magic new line then how come they can't similarly get a coach service to connect at an existing station on the Barnstaple/ Bere Alston lines? People in Bodmin are going to sit on a coach to Okehampton to get on a train?

The thing that frustrates me here is that Okehampton could have had a regular service to Exeter without much fuss years ago (given that the Sunday service has run for some time) - it's in commuting distance, whilst it's not a top priority for re-opening, it's not a ridiculous idea to have an hourly 150 running from Okehampton into Exeter...

...similarly, Tavistock to Bere Alston (for Plymouth) seems sensible - there's a frequent commercial bus service from Tavistock to Plymouth so there's clearly a market there, again, it's good commuter distance. For the cost of about ten miles of new track and a couple of Sprinters, we could give both Okehampton and Tavistock an hourly service to their nearest big city (i.e. an Okehampton to Exeter shuttle and a Tavistock to Plymouth shuttle) - it wouldn't be particularly complicated, it could be delivered without breaking the bank. However, the boring everyday demand for such services has been sidelined because any proposal in the area seems to be focussed on some LSWR fantasy, a grandiose scheme involving Waterloo services, being a handy diversionary route a few weekends a year... if only we could focus on short simple projects, we could have implemented them by now.

Instead, this aversion to buffer stops and apparent addiction to complicated mega-schemes means nothing actually gets done. Instead, we'll focus resources on small scale schemes like Ebbw Vale/ Fleetwood/ Ashington/ Portishead, where an unremarkable Sprinter could run along an unremarkable siding to provide a reliable means of transport for unremarkable everyday journeys (e.g. people travelling to the nearest big city) - that's the kind of market that rail actually does well at, however much it must pain a certain type of crayola-addict!

You underestimate the Popular Front for Restoration of the Withered Arm at your peril.

Things have moved on since their committee meetings were held in a phone box in Camelford.

Alas no one turned up to the tracklifting session at Dawlish, but their resident raindancer has never stopped going on about his success in producing that 2014 storm.

 

[The Planner]

Never mind the splitters, the Withered Arm restoration popular front....

 

[Taunton]

Taunton to Plymouth I think was considered as an electrified 'island', covering the steepest bits, avoiding much steam double-heading, freight splitting etc. They'd have probably used DC pre WW2, maybe 1.5kV. The Dawlish Avoider was being planned around the same era, so that may have solved any sea wall electrification problems.

3kV actually; it was a common choice worldwide in the 1930s. Merz & McLellan, electrical engineering consultants, produced a substantial plan for the GWR board about it. There was a government scheme at the time to end the tax on rail tickets that existed until then, if the funds were spent on capital improvements.

Dawlish (and Dainton and others) diversions have a longer pedigree, there have been multiple plans over time, the nearest came in the early 1900s, but the long-running feud between Grierson (Chief civil engineer) and Churchward (Chief loco engineer) saw the latter convince the board that his locomotives could handle it. Until that time there were still single track sections at Dawlish (held the City of Truro run up by a few minutes).

 

[Dave Beeching]

Never mind the splitters, the Withered Arm restoration popular front....

How much do you have to hate the Romans BR Western Region to become a member?

 

[Bald Rick]

Never mind the splitters, the Withered Arm restoration popular front....

Witheredarm Tavistock Front
WTF

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Dec 2020 ==

The thing that frustrates me here is that Okehampton could have had a regular service to Exeter without much fuss years ago (given that the Sunday service has run for some time) - it's in commuting distance, whilst it's not a top priority for re-opening, it's not a ridiculous idea to have an hourly 150 running from Okehampton into Exeter...

Next year (albeit not hourly).

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

It is not much of a report is it? The group have been trailing this for months - I was expecting at least some analysis of the options and costs. I assumed at first that the post yesterday was just the press release, but I looked in vain for any link to download a full report. Their Facebook page has a few more snippets - Meldon Viaduct will need a new structure alongside the old one. As for Tavistock, they are 'agnostic in the sense that whatever alignment best balances the needs of the railway and the town is the one which makes most sense'. You don't say - i.e. they haven't the foggiest idea. Any idea of a by-pass route for Tavistock is pure fantasy - the old-route would have to be used with a CPO to remove the offending, blocking property. My fear is this will distract from the eminently sensible proposal to reopen the line from Bere Alston to Tavistock, with a station on the outskirts of the town.

 

[Thebaz]

The thing that frustrates me here is that Okehampton could have had a regular service to Exeter without much fuss years ago (given that the Sunday service has run for some time) - it's in commuting distance, whilst it's not a top priority for re-opening, it's not a ridiculous idea to have an hourly 150 running from Okehampton into Exeter...

You seem to be unaware that this is exactly what is currently happening (well not the 150 bit, or the hourly bit). The service is due to start next May.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Dec 2020 ==

And yes, Tavistock to be Bere Alston should be done too. I thought that this was a gimme at one stage a couple of years back?

 

[Irascible]

And yes, Tavistock to be Bere Alston should be done too. I thought that this was a gimme at one stage a couple of years back?

I seem to remember the costs have spiralled out of current economic sense, although don't quote me on that because I didn't look it up.

Tavistock station is in private hands, but other than that isn't there only the Council building on the formation ( north of the station too ). All that bridgework though, wonder what state that's really in.

 

[Bald Rick]

The service is due to start next May year

Corrected

And yes, Tavistock to be Bere Alston should be done too. I thought that this was a gimme at one stage a couple of years back?

It was never a ‘gimme’ as no one has ever committed anything other than minor funding to it. The latest estimate was done reasonably well, unlike the previous ones.

 

[21C101]

I seem to remember the costs have spiralled out of current economic sense, although don't quote me on that because I didn't look it up.

Tavistock station is in private hands, but other than that isn't there only the Council building on the formation ( north of the station too ). All that bridgework though, wonder what state that's really in.

The old Tavy station was up for sale recently as was Brentor. Don't know who bought it.

In any case unless and until the line reopens right through to Okehampton the new station will be south of the town on the A386 where it can have a car park and no 1 in 4 walk up from the town centre to get to it.

Ever rising estimates from NR to reopen it put the whole thing on hold as the gap between developer pot and cost became a chasm, so it will be interesting to see what project speed can achieve in bringing costs down.

As to structures, aside from the missing bridge over the A386 and a missing occupation bridge at Sourton the structures (except the cassandra crossing Meldon Viaduct) are solid granite stone structures and in very good condition and even Meldon Viaduct has bern extensively refurbished. Much debate about whether it could carry trains again though. (I suspect yes, but with a 20mph speed restriction further refettling and or strengthening done but the cyclists would be upset)

 

[43096]

Witheredarm Tavistock Front

I'm going to launch a similar scheme called the Tavistock Front for the Witheredarm.

 

[21C101]

Have to say that to my mind the biggest impediment to rebuilding Waterloo to Plymouth as a full blown main line would be getting space for the trains north of Basingstoke.

With Crossrail (if it ever opens) an hourly Paddington - Reading - Newbury - Westbury - Castle Cary - Yeovil - Axminster - Honiton - Exeter - Crediton thtn alternately to Oke - Tavy - Plymouth /Barnstaple and Bideford would seem a better idea, especiall if common sense prevails and the heathrow express gets canned and replaced with four more crossrails being extended to Heathrow T5 freeing up four more fast line paths into Padd.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Dec 2020 ==

I'm going to launch a similar scheme called the Tavistock Front for the Witheredarm.

Tavistock Withered Arm Trainfront has a more memorable Acronym

 

[43096]

Tavistock Withered Arm Front has a more memorable Acronym

Maybe change the Front to something beginning with another letter?

 

[21C101]

Maybe change the Front to something beginning with another letter?

I just edited and did.

Tavistock Withered Arm Trainfront.

 

[swt_passenger]

I just edited and did.

Tavistock Withered Arm Trainfront.

There’s an American airline refreshment joke in there somewhere as well...

 

[83A]

And yet again the giant Elephant in the room (or Meldon Viaduct as its known) seems to get underestimated as a blocker to this project. That and as a diversion route would mean two reversals for a Paddington to Penzance train.

Open to Okehampton, Open to Tavistock if you must. Leave the middle bit for the sheep and moss. Focus on stopping Dawlish falling in the sea... job done.

 

[Bald Rick]

Ever rising estimates from NR to reopen it

Not so. NR has only done one estimate, and that was for the west of Exeter Resilience study, as quoted above at £875m, at 2014 prices. That will be over £1bn in todays prices, £1.25bn or so in cash prices.

NR hasn’t estimated the Bere Alston - Tavistock ‘only’ reopening. If it had been asked to, the estimates would have been rather better at the outset, and West Devon Borough Council might have made a more informed decision about the housing development intended to pay for it.

The issue with Tavistock is the inevitable argument about the specification. Is it to be a cheap as chips single track ‘light’ railway, like Borders? That would be about £100m or so. Or should it be built to be ready to be a main line - twin track, higher spec railway, which would be about half as much again.

I'm going to launch a similar scheme called the Tavistock Front for the Witheredarm.

That acronym is already taken, across the Bristol Channel

 

[Irascible]

And yet again the giant Elephant in the room (or Meldon Viaduct as its known) seems to get underestimated as a blocker to this project. That and as a diversion route would mean two reversals for a Paddington to Penzance train.

Open to Okehampton, Open to Tavistock if you must. Leave the middle bit for the sheep and moss. Focus on stopping Dawlish falling in the sea... job done.

I'm curious how much a new 600ft ( let's include the approaches ) viaduct would cost these days ( and then how much more building it in a national park would cost too ) - especially compared with say, driving through the middle of Tavistock.

Also, anyone recosted the 30s Dawlish Avoider plan, given a fair amount of work had already been done on it ( the plan, not the execution! ).

 

[Bald Rick]

I'm curious how much a new 600ft ( let's include the approaches ) viaduct would cost these days ( and then how much more building it in a national park would cost too ) - especially compared with say, driving through the middle of Tavistock.

Also, anyone recosted the 30s Dawlish Avoider plan, given a fair amount of work had already been done on it ( the plan, not the execution! ).

Viaduct - thick end of £100m I’d say, given the sensitivity of the local environment.

Dawlish Avoider - various options in here:

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/West-of-Exeter-Route-Resilience-Study.pdf

 

[stuu]

I seem to remember the costs have spiralled out of current economic sense, although don't quote me on that because I didn't look it up.

It went from the original developer/council estimate of £16m, to the actually costed sum of £90m (IIRC). They for some reason hadn't included a number of things in their costs originally, including the necessary upgrades to the signalling on the existing railway

 

[Irascible]

Viaduct - thick end of £100m I’d say, given the sensitivity of the local environment.

Dawlish Avoider - various options in here:

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/West-of-Exeter-Route-Resilience-Study.pdf

TYVM. The GWR 1935 idea looks vaguely like C5 but not near enough to be of any use, I guess. Land sold & powers lapsed anyway. The Teign Valley option looks suspiciously underestimated