Scotrail Class 385 Discussion

[GrimShady]

I hate first class table lamps (at least on the 158s. Not sure I've encountered them elsewhere).
They block up the table, leaving less room for the multiple laptops that the occupants want to put there!

170s have them, can't remember seeing them on 158s. They don't have to be in the way with some attention to detail when designing or fitting them.

 

[Bikeman78]

Do you have a time for this?

1655 Glasgow to Gourock on Saturdays is a 318 or 320.

 

[alangla]

Personally I couldn't care less what a train/unit looks like.....as long as it gets me from "A to B"...that all I care about.

This is it basically. Journey times on the E&G are shorter than some SPT land commutes, plenty of room, clean, reliable, decent heating/cooling & blisteringly quick on the 0-100mph dash are all that really matter. This ain't the InterCity route of the 1980s and before

 

[GrimShady]

This is it basically. Journey times on the E&G are shorter than some SPT land commutes, plenty of room, clean, reliable, decent heating/cooling & blisteringly quick on the 0-100mph dash are all that really matter. This ain't the InterCity route of the 1980s and before

Actually the journey was shorter with the 27 Push/Pull formations (non stop) of around 43 minutes.

Things should be improving not regressing, no reason for it not too in 40 years since the Swindon DMUs went.

 

[alangla]

True, but there are far more intermediate passengers (e.g. Croy car park of a morning) and far more passengers overall, so I guess something has to give. You're right though that the experience for end to end passengers was probably better on the push-pull stock

 

[superkev]

Presumably when all Edinburgh Glasgow are 385's some thought could be given to shaving a few minutes off to better the 45min.of the 1970's. Pity the line speed is little changed.
K

 

[Agent_Squash]

Presumably when all Edinburgh Glasgow are 385's some thought could be given to shaving a few minutes off to better the 45min.of the 1970's. Pity the line speed is little changed.
K

42 minutes is the plan.

 

[mde]

I’ve never considered the 170 carpets too bad on the E-G, the 158s to Dunblane however....

The SR branded carpet is usually okay on the 170 - but, the vestibule stuff which is usually a kind of beige colour is the stuff of nightmares. It gets rather, well, dirty.

I hate first class table lamps (at least on the 158s. Not sure I've encountered them elsewhere).
They block up the table, leaving less room for the multiple laptops that the occupants want to put there!

For the length of a journey on the 385 are the lamps really necessary? The lights being bright is perhaps unfortunate for some (including me!), but, arguably, it does make some level of sense to provide a bright cabin as this will be theoretically easier for folks with impairments such as visual problems, and, could also be argued to be a Health and Safety improvement. Naturally of course, if the lighting is too bright then you'd expect it could perhaps be adjusted.

Edit: The relevant part of the franchise agreement (Sch 6.1 app2, 9.12 on page 329) as regards ambience might also help to explain the lighting:
"The Franchisee shall ensure that the interior design of the saloons and vestibules shall provide an open aspect that avoids enclosed unlit areas. The ambience shall be one that reduces the perceived threat to passengers with particular consideration for the elderly, single females and other vulnerable groups."

 

[swaldman]

For the length of a journey on the 385 are the lamps really necessary? The lights being bright is perhaps unfortunate for some (including me!), but, arguably, it does make some level of sense to provide a bright cabin as this will be theoretically easier for folks with impairments such as visual problems, and, could also be argued to be a Health and Safety improvement. Naturally of course, if the lighting is too bright then you'd expect it could perhaps be adjusted.

Edit: The relevant part of the franchise agreement (Sch 6.1 app2, 9.12 on page 329) as regards ambience might also help to explain the lighting:
"The Franchisee shall ensure that the interior design of the saloons and vestibules shall provide an open aspect that avoids enclosed unlit areas. The ambience shall be one that reduces the perceived threat to passengers with particular consideration for the elderly, single females and other vulnerable groups."

I used to work as a lighting design consultant. I can understand why the table lamps are done. They feel cosy, add a sense of luxury. Personally I'd rather have the table space. It's entirely possible to create a nice ambience in first class through lighting without them, but it would require attention to the rest of the lighting, which would mean a different ceiling to the rest of the coach (or, y'know, make the whole coach nice, but that would remove the differentiation). Presumably this is why TOCs like table lamps - because the only differences needed in first are at low level.

I actually like the principle (if not the execution) of Pendalino lighting - plenty of light in the aisle, for safety and perception-of-safety purposes, then a passenger-configurable level at each seat/table.

 

[Carntyne]

There are additional reading/spotlights above First Class seating and pull down blinds too.

 

[GrimShady]

There are additional reading/spotlights above First Class seating and pull down blinds too.

The issue with the pull down blinds is it cuts off the sun for the whole window or the person sitting across from you.

 

[GrimShady]

I used to work as a lighting design consultant. I can understand why the table lamps are done. They feel cosy, add a sense of luxury. Personally I'd rather have the table space. It's entirely possible to create a nice ambience in first class through lighting without them, but it would require attention to the rest of the lighting, which would mean a different ceiling to the rest of the coach (or, y'know, make the whole coach nice, but that would remove the differentiation). Presumably this is why TOCs like table lamps - because the only differences needed in first are at low level.

I actually like the principle (if not the execution) of Pendalino lighting - plenty of light in the aisle, for safety and perception-of-safety purposes, then a passenger-configurable level at each seat/table.

I would agree with you on the Pendolino lighting, that's about all I like about them

 

[SC318250]

Path in for Friday for 385 delivery. Usual times

 

[InOban]

I wonder whether this path is generated every week just in case. It appeared last week, only to fail to happen. Over the weeks dozens of paths have been created, and then cancelled. Must be a nice earner for the drivers.

 

[EMU303]

Does anyone know when the next 385 is likely to enter service?

 

[Journeyman]

170s have them, can't remember seeing them on 158s. They don't have to be in the way with some attention to detail when designing or fitting them.

158s on ScotRail did have them in the small first class area before it was removed with the recent refurb - similar design to the 170s. It incorporated the power sockets, but they're now provided throughout the train in the walls.

I find table lamps annoying if you can't turn them off - they're invariably too bright for my liking and I prefer subtle lighting.

 

[mic505]

Hopefully next month.

 

[youngac]

Maybe Alastair Dalton’s much mocked statement about the next units not coming into service until September is actually true?

 

[EMU303]

Is the current gating factor for more 385 being introduced mileage accumulation or staff training, or another factor?

Was in Queen St after 6pm today and still evidence of train stock availability pressure. I was heading for Croy but couldn't board the 18.18 departure, two coaches rammed full before departure. The 18,30 to Edinburgh, stopping at Croy, was cancelled (apparently due to an earlier incident near the railway) which piled on the pressure for the 18.48 which again was two coaches and rammed. Which got me thinking, were Bishopbriggs, Lenzie, Croy, and beyond, passengers just unlucky this evening or have Scotrail sent the 12 (?) 170's down to Northern? If E-G is now 100% electric or close to it, then have Scotrail now no flexibility until Stirling/Alloa/Dunblane start running electrics?

One positive though - good to see how easily the 365's with their 8 coaches hovered up large numbers of passengers waiting on the platform.

 

[youngac]

Hopefully tonight’s delivery will actually run this time.

 

[Mordac]

Is the current gating factor for more 385 being introduced mileage accumulation or staff training, or another factor?

Was in Queen St after 6pm today and still evidence of train stock availability pressure. I was heading for Croy but couldn't board the 18.18 departure, two coaches rammed full before departure. The 18,30 to Edinburgh, stopping at Croy, was cancelled (apparently due to an earlier incident near the railway) which piled on the pressure for the 18.48 which again was two coaches and rammed. Which got me thinking, were Bishopbriggs, Lenzie, Croy, and beyond, passengers just unlucky this evening or have Scotrail sent the 12 (?) 170's down to Northern? If E-G is now 100% electric or close to it, then have Scotrail now no flexibility until Stirling/Alloa/Dunblane start running electrics?

One positive though - good to see how easily the 365's with their 8 coaches hovered up large numbers of passengers waiting on the platform.

There's 10 170s with Northern now, still six to go later this year.

 

[Typhoon_93]

Path in for Friday for 385 delivery. Usual times

Nothing visible at the factory this morning with the delivery panel fitted so probably won’t run.

 

[InOban]

And so sign of the light engine moving.

 

[GrimShady]

Is there just one 7 car 385 currently in service?

 

[Highlandspring]

At the moment one three car and one four car unit are in use for passenger services. Several more units have been accepted by ScotRail and formally handed over but are not yet signed off for passenger service.

 

[AlistairCowell]

Yep, just 385003 & 385104 as far as I know.

 

[gingertom]

a delivery scheduled for Wednesday: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K96002/2018/08/15/advanced

 

[InOban]

Maybe it'll happen this time...

 

[Chuggington21]

Yep, just 385003 & 385104 as far as I know.

I believe the 3 car has either been switched out or is about to be

 

[Journeyman]

I believe the 3 car has either been switched out or is about to be

Nope, the same pair were operating on the 07.15 Glasgow - Edinburgh this morning.