ScotRail DOO dispute

[CarterUSM]

A new strategy of political pressure on MSP's, and not to mention an ominous legal challenge of which i do not have many details of at the moment, has been in place since the round of members meetings some weeks ago. These meetings were very poorly attended, in complete contrast to the ones held pre-ballot. The amount of members attending told more of a story than anything else in my view, though it was disappointing to see many of those who had become increasingly vociferous against the action not in attendance themselves. I too have retrospective reservations for the way things have been handled, but lets make it clear, there were NO negotiable conditions to be had from either ScotRail or Transport Scotland. It was always a case of this being implemented like it or not, and non-negotiable. So to be fair, i see the RMT being stuck between a rock and a hard place on that front. 313103 is correct though, after seeing how the company have dragged the grade through the dirt, insulted their conductors professionalism , described the role as 'opening and closing doors' not to mention the sub standard and frankly unsafe, in my opinion of course, service provided by scabs on strike days, then it is pretty clear they are not wanted. The other TOC's have been watching closely with interest , and there will be no coming back from this if(when?) lost.

 

[Aictos]

What I can't understand then is if this new course of action is better for the RMT then why did they not go that way in the first place?

What's actually going to happen, will this actually lead to a renewed agreement not to extend DOO, if they did what lines would be next the Edinburgh and Glasgow suburban routes keeping guards on the longer trips ie Glasgow/Edinburgh to Inverness/Aberdeen/Fort William/Alloa/Far North Lines/West Highland etc?

I hope not as it reassuring as a passenger to have the second member of staff there.

 

[Metroland]

It's a complete myth that they would extend it, one of the requirements for DOO is continuous track circuiting.

The West Highland and Far north lines have no track circuits for the most part and use radio signalling, lines to Aberdeen north of Dundee are still absolute block, with gaps in track circuiting. The Highland main line is mostly tokenless block and some absolute block, with gaps in track circuiting.

This is so the trains can be tracked via the radio system, so if the driver is incapacitated it sends a DSD alarm, and the PA circuits on the trains can be remotely controlled, among other things.

DOO is simply not cost effective where you have relatively low use of trains, with lots of fixed infrastructure like radio masts, and continuous MAS signalling. But none of this will stop the RMT scaremongering people who have no technical or operational knowledge of the railway.

 

[CarterUSM]

Memorandum of Understanding reached at Acas Conciliation 29 July 2010


1. Are First Scotrail in a position to negotiate with the RMT on the staffing and manning of the new Airdrie to Bathgate service?

First Scotrail has been negotiating with the RMT on the staffing and manning of the new Airdrie to Bathgate service . However, in accordance with the franchise agreement and its obligations on First Scotrail we have consulted with Transport Scotland re the staffing and manning of the service.
Transport Scotland indicated that they had no choice but to pursue the most cost effective option which delivered the new service at the lowest possible cost to the taxpayer . As class 334 unit will be used and the route equipped with GSMR secure radios then driver only operation delivers the best value.

2. Can First Scotrail give an underwritten assurance to the RMT that the current compliment for Conductors will remain during your tenure of the franchise ?

Due to the ongoing investment in Scotland's railways a guarantee is given that the conductor posts in First Scotrail will be no less than the current number of 540 until November 2014, the end of the current franchise .

3. Can First Scotrail give a written guarantee of rate retention and any subsequent pay increases to Scotrail conductors if there is any imposition of Driver only operation ?

Rate retentionand eligibility to subsequent pay increases are governed by the agreed P,T, R&R arrangements .

4. Should Transport Scotland call off their current price option can you guarantee that the staffing of all services will be a Driver and Conductor outwith the Strathclyde Manning Agreements?

First Scotrail is not in a position to give a guarantee that the staffing of all services will be a Driver and Conductor outwith the Strathclyde Manning Agreement.
First Scotrail , in accordance with its franchise agreement , must consult with Transport Scotland on each priced option and a decision will be taken on staffing following full consultation of all aspects including infrastructure, units, safe working practices and the best value for money.

5. Are First Scotrail prepared to give a written guarantee to the RMT that there will be a Conductor on every train in passenger service on the North Berwick/Dunbar service to be inaugurated in 2011?

a) Dunbar service

The Dunbar service is a new service introduced from May 2010. It is part of a wider further feasibility survey regarding expansion . The feasibility survey , undertaken by First Scotrail on behalf of Transport Scotland , will explore the possible expansion of rail services in East Lothian.
First Scotrail will share the specification of the feasibility study with the RMT .

b) North Berwick service

First Scotrail gives an undertaking , in line with the 2004 letter, that the North Berwick services will be staffed by a Driver and Conductor until November 2014(the end of the current franchise).

6. Should Transport Scotland call of future price options of any new schemes will First Scotrail give RMT an assurance there will be no extension of Driver only operations ? In accordance with our agreement of 2001 and 2004 assurances from the then Managing Director Mary Dickson.

First Scotrail deem that the 2001 agreement between Scotrail Railways and the RMT expired on 16 October 2004 , i.e the end date of the National Express franchise.
The letter of 2004 , from Mary Dickson , then Managing Director ,refers specifically to services on which a Conductor was present on at the time.

Therefore First Scotrail is not in a position to give assurances sought for the reasons already given in previous answers regarding consultation etc with Transport Scotland .

7. If any additional services are introduced between Glasgow Queen St and Perth, do First Scotrail envisage this being a Driver and Conductor service as per correspondence of the 18 March 2010?

If additional Glasgow Queen St to Perth services are requested by Transport Scotland then these will be staffed by Driver and Conductor.

8. Can First Scotrail give the RMT a written guarantee that Conductors will remain on the Cumbernauld passenger service as this service was not included in the Strathclyde Manning Agreement?

First Scotrail is not in a position to give the guarantee sought. However if the scheme goes ahead and it is a Driver door operated service a guarantee is given for all existing Conductors will remain working at their present depot.

9. Are First Scotrail prepared to give a written guarantee if any new schemes such as the one for Inverness will be a Driver and Conductor operation and how many Driver/Conductor posts do you envisage creating?

Refer RMT back to previous answers relating to future schemes and our franchise obligation to consult etc with Transport Scotland .

10. As part of their revenue protection duties ar First Scotrail prepared to underwrite the Conductors 5% commission scheme?

In the event of a Conductor being redeployed in a revenue protection role as a result of the introduction of a Driver Only Operation scheme then First Scotrail will underwrite the Conductors 5% commission for those individuals .

11. Can First Scotrail give a written guarantee that all services from Scotland to London on overnight sleepers will remain the same? No change to manning or operation Drivers and Train Manager.

Sleeper services from/to Edinburgh and Aberdeen, Inverness and Fort William will continue to be operated by a First Scotrail Conductor.
Sleeper services from/to Edinburgh /Glasgow and London will continue to be operated with a First Scotrail Train Manager .
Any proposals to extend the use of sleeper Train Managers to the North routes would be subject to collective bargaining with the appropriate Company Councils.




Out puts from information above:


-RMT note the First Scotrail position with regards to issues 1,4,6 and 8 above.

-RMT remains in opposition to these positions and will continue to express their total opposition to the imposition of the extension of Driver Only Operations. In doing so they will embark on a political campaign with relevant government bodies.

-Issues 4&6: RMT believe that both these issues are governed by the provisions of the Transfer of Undertaking Regulations and reserve their right to pursue these at an appropriate time.

 

[9K43]

Now that Scotrail have got DOO in that will be the start of the rot.
They will now impose new rosters and pay increases, and roster and conditions without going through the RMT LDC's.
ASLEF will have all the luxury of negotiated pay deals, rosters and terms and condition, cos thats the only Union the management will want to talk to.( As usual).
They may also introduce a new grades for ex guards, in a lower management grade giving all negotiating to TSSA, and ignoring the RMT.
You may think this is a dream but this happened with EWS/DB with the groundstaff.
That is why EWS/DB is a one union set up. That Union is ASLEF.
Watch your backs..............You are only there to be made redundant so drivers can have higher wages than anyone lelse, and the guards will pay for it with thier jobs.

 

[CarterUSM]

Now that Scotrail have got DOO in that will be the start of the rot.
They will now impose new rosters and pay increases, and roster and conditions without going through the RMT LDC's.
ASLEF will have all the luxury of negotiated pay deals, rosters and terms and condition, cos thats the only Union the management will want to talk to.( As usual).
They may also introduce a new grades for ex guards, in a lower management grade giving all negotiating to TSSA, and ignoring the RMT.
You may think this is a dream but this happened with EWS/DB with the groundstaff.
That is why EWS/DB is a one union set up. That Union is ASLEF.
Watch your backs..............You are only there to be made redundant so drivers can have higher wages than anyone lelse, and the guards will pay for it with thier jobs.

Funnily enough, i believe ASLE&F have an office in Scotrail HQ for their wannabe MSP Scottish regional organiser! Yes, it is not good news for the future, however , i don't think it will get quite as bad as you say yet, but perhaps i'm being optimistic.

 

[313103]

It's a complete myth that they would extend it, one of the requirements for DOO is continuous track circuiting.

But none of this will stop the RMT scaremongering people who have no technical or operational knowledge of the railway.

Am i reading this right, that if Scotrail get DOO in on the Bathgate line, that DOO will not spread anywhere else in Scotland? Or will it spread to lines with CTR? Which i think is the point the RMT are making. If this small little line gets in who is to say that Scotrail doesnt have any plans for extending DOO?

Perhaps if Scotrail came out and said to RMT DOO will only be extended to the Bathgate line and will not be extended anywhere else, you might find some sort of agreement. But as we know Scotrail will not come out and say that and i wonder why!

I think that most people are missing the point and that is under the previous administration an agreement was made between the company and the RMT that DOO would not be extended, now under 'New' Management they want to change without negotiation.

 

[CarterUSM]

Am i reading this right, that if Scotrail get DOO in on the Bathgate line, that DOO will not spread anywhere else in Scotland? Or will it spread to lines with CTR? Which i think is the point the RMT are making. If this small little line gets in who is to say that Scotrail doesnt have any plans for extending DOO?

Perhaps if Scotrail came out and said to RMT DOO will only be extended to the Bathgate line and will not be extended anywhere else, you might find some sort of agreement. But as we know Scotrail will not come out and say that and i wonder why!

I think that most people are missing the point and that is under the previous administration an agreement was made between the company and the RMT that DOO would not be extended, now under 'New' Management they want to change without negotiation.

You're more or less correct, Scotrail say that the 2001 agreement of no extension to DOO doesn't apply as it was made with the previous franchise holder, National Express. By that logic, the Strathclyde manning agreement was also made with a previous administration, but they have no problem with regards to that! The union are maintaining that the 2001 agreement is legally binding and thus are looking to go down the legal route in addition to the political one.

 

[9K43]

If any of you RMT members know any Groundstaff from EWS/DB, you only have to ask them what EWS/DB did to those members for conformation what management will get upto.
You have a new District Officer in Scotland, who was Chairman of the EWS Groundstaff Company Council who can verify what went on with the RMT members.
You cannot trust any management team, they have a policy of lies and underhand dealings with staff.
As I have said the ASLEF will smile in your face whilst talking to management for better terms and conditions for thier members, at the expense of other grades.
This comes from very personal experience dating back nearly 3 decades.
Now they have got DOO in watch the dominoes fall, and the jobs go to the wall.
Unless this 2001 DOO agreement has been withdrawn then the status que remains.

 

[CarterUSM]

I don't doubt you for a moment 9k43, there will have to be some forward planning by the union here, that's for sure. For the past few years, the collective bargaining has managed us the exact same pay deal as ASLEF, though the Drivers up here i'd argue have less favourable conditions than us, but I believe that to be due to our less 'important' status. It will be interesting to see how we stand come the end of the franchise 2014, though I have a feeling I'll have moved on by then. Somebody told me once, and I can't remember when or where, on here perhaps?, that if you threw a 1000 pounds worth of pennies into an ASLEF district council meeting room, not one of them would hit the floor! The thing is, I could quite imagine it!

 

[Metroland]

Am i reading this right, that if Scotrail get DOO in on the Bathgate line, that DOO will not spread anywhere else in Scotland? Or will it spread to lines with CTR? Which i think is the point the RMT are making. If this small little line gets in who is to say that Scotrail doesnt have any plans for extending DOO?

Perhaps if Scotrail came out and said to RMT DOO will only be extended to the Bathgate line and will not be extended anywhere else, you might find some sort of agreement. But as we know Scotrail will not come out and say that and i wonder why!

I think that most people are missing the point and that is under the previous administration an agreement was made between the company and the RMT that DOO would not be extended, now under 'New' Management they want to change without negotiation.

DOO will be spread where it is economic to do so, which does not include relatively lightly used lines for the foreseeable future, which make up quite a bit of the Scotrail network.

It actually really irritates me that the RMT look for such silly agreements. Of course Scotrail cannot guarantee what will happen in the future, can you guarantee what the world will be like in 10 years?

In the next 5 years it's likely the railway will have to find some £1-2 billion worth of savings, and some changes will be have to be made if we are to avoid closures.

 

[CarterUSM]

DOO will be spread where it is economic to do so, which does not include relatively lightly used lines for the foreseeable future, which make up quite a bit of the Scotrail network.

It actually really irritates me that the RMT look for such silly agreements. Of course Scotrail cannot guarantee what will happen in the future, can you guarantee what the world will be like in 10 years?

In the next 5 years it's likely the railway will have to find some £1-2 billion worth of savings, and some changes will be have to be made if we are to avoid closures.

It actually irritates me when said agreements are actually ridden rough shod over with impunity and no apologies made, savings to be made or not.

 

[Metroland]

Scotrail are under pressure from Transport Scotland, who are under pressure from the British government to save money.

Whereas I don't agree with the fact that the people that cause a lot of the economic problems (such as the Bankers, Politicians, big business) get away with it, and those that start off with £1 million in life are likely to do far better than those that start off with nothing, and it tends to be the vast majority of the hard working people at the middle to bottom end that lose out with these things, it's nevertheless always the penny that calls the piper.

And the real world is not fantasy agreements that promise things that frankly cannot be promised. That's the world the vast majority of the population live under and have done so for years.

 

[Tom B]

Scotrail are under pressure from Transport Scotland, who are under pressure from the British government to save money.

Whereas I don't agree with the fact that the people that cause a lot of the economic problems (such as the Bankers, Politicians, big bushiness) get away with it, and those that start off with £1 million in life are likely to do far better than those that start off with nothing, and it tends to be the vast majority of the hard working people at the middle to bottom end that lose out with these these, it's nevertheless always the penny that calls the piper.

And the real world is not fantasy agreements that promise things that frankly cannot be promised. That's the world the vast majority of the population live under and have done so for years.

Exactly. And, I'm afraid, I don't think Mr Crow lives in the real world. His communist dreams are slightly different to what actually happens in the world.

 

[CarterUSM]

Scotrail are under pressure from Transport Scotland, who are under pressure from the British government to save money.

Whereas I don't agree with the fact that the people that cause a lot of the economic problems (such as the Bankers, Politicians, big business) get away with it, and those that start off with £1 million in life are likely to do far better than those that start off with nothing, and it tends to be the vast majority of the hard working people at the middle to bottom end that lose out with these things, it's nevertheless always the penny that calls the piper.

And the real world is not fantasy agreements that promise things that frankly cannot be promised. That's the world the vast majority of the population live under and have done so for years.

Fair point, though your 'tough luck and accept it because of the uk's financial predicament' doesn't wash with me, I wish it was the reason! ScotRail under pressure from Transport Scotland? Try, ScotRail asking Transport Scotland for X amount of taxpayers cash for 'training', and thus providing a strike breaking army, and conveniently delivering on the DOO. I am well aware of our nations current financial predicament, and i'm reasonably learned, so I do not need any 'real world' lessons from you either, as much as you love doling them out! I will tell you though, i'd appreciate being told the truth from the off, and that certainly did not happen! In any case, if and when my grade is officially 'retired' I do have the consolation of being paid the same money for a junior grade doing less work, so it is not all black ties and drawn curtains on that front, assuming I don't apply successfully for a promotion to another grade of course.

 

[9K43]

Exactly. And, I'm afraid, I don't think Mr Crow lives in the real world. His communist dreams are slightly different to what actually happens in the world.

Are you a member of the RMT?
How much service have you on the railways, if so what grade were/are you.
You seem to talk about Mr Crow as if you know him well, have you ever met him?
How do you know he is a communist?
I would suggest that Bob Crow has more knowledge about what goes on in this mans railway than you.
I have been a member of the NUR/RMT, and have held positions within this union for a very long time, perhaps before you were born.]
This is Mr Crows email.
[email protected]
Perhaps you ought to send an email to him seen as thought you know him so well with your views on how this DOO imposition can be solved.

 

[87015]

Are you a member of the RMT?
How much service have you on the railways, if so what grade were/are you.
You seem to talk about Mr Crow as if you know him well, have you ever met him?
How do you know he is a communist?
I would suggest that Bob Crow has more knowledge about what goes on in this mans railway than you.
I have been a member of the NUR/RMT, and have held positions within this union for a very long time, perhaps before you were born.]
This is Mr Crows email.
[email protected]
Perhaps you ought to send an email to him seen as thought you know him so well with your views on how this DOO imposition can be solved.

Interesting how you ask for grades but don't mention yours.
Maybe you could tell me how DOO is "unsafe" in Scotland but perfectly safe for his members to undertake elsewhere?

 

[Metroland]

I am well aware of our nations current financial predicament, and i'm reasonably learned, so I do not need any 'real world' lessons from you either.

I'm sure you don't need any real world lessons from me, the real world will see to that. Just a shame the creative response of the RMT, even with a new line opening creating more jobs, is to down tools. I'm sure it will do the power of good in the long term and I'm sure you'll all come running for our support when we're all faced with service cuts and fare hikes, which affects passengers just as much. Not that I bet that figures once in your late night beer and sandwiches discussions. Well maybe it does, but it certainly doesn't come across like that. You may well think I'm arrogant, but all I'm trying to do is look at the bigger picture which affects *everyone*.

 

[CarterUSM]

I'm sure you don't need any real world lessons from me, the real world will see to that. Just a shame the creative response of the RMT, even with a new line opening creating more jobs, is to down tools. I'm sure it will do the power of good in the long term and I'm sure you'll all come running for our support when we're all faced with service cuts and fare hikes, which affects passengers just as much. Not that I bet that figures once in your late night beer and sandwiches discussions. Well maybe it does, but it certainly doesn't come across like that. You may well think I'm arrogant, but all I'm trying to do is look at the bigger picture which affects *everyone*.

Understood, but i do have my fare paying passengers needs at heart on a professional level i assure you, not to mention internal customers. Fare hikes are a certainty of course, but i will be surprised by any significant service cuts, certainly where i am , though stranraer looks ominous in a few years perhaps. I don't think there was much option other than a strike, i would have been less than pleased at a point blank acceptance on the announcement of the manning, that is for sure. Extra jobs? Sure, thats what ASLE&F said their reason for accepting the new service was, negating to mention that due to natural wastage there will be a net gain of zero, or less after 2014 no doubt, so i won't hold my breath. I'm a big critic of my own union at the best of times and some of its leadership, but i regard the occasional hostility by others towards it as jealousy at its significant sway on our railways, i don't see improving its members conditions, pay , and campaigning for a safer railway as a negative thing. At the end of the day though, i expect honest, above board actions from all sides, and this has been a carve up of ridiculous proportions. Perhaps i'm being naive?

 

[harz99]

Interesting how you ask for grades but don't mention yours.
Maybe you could tell me how DOO is "unsafe" in Scotland but perfectly safe for his members to undertake elsewhere?

It looks from the 6th line of 9K43 s post that he/she may in fact be a full time Union person................

 

[chic]

As a passenger and someone not involved in the railways, found the 'safety' argument a strange one and the strike action also didn't really affect emu services in the former strathclyde area.

I'd have 100% backed the RMT if they had made a case on the fact that the existing conductors or the Bathgate/Edinburgh route shouldn't have their terms and conditions changed as a result of the A2B new route and extension of the north Clyde services.

Maybe that's too simplistic, but the safety argument didn't seem to make sense to me and probably loads of other commuters that use the Glasgow area emu's on a regular basis.

I hope that the issue is resolved finally and no staff lose out on it.

 

[9K43]

It looks from the 6th line of 9K43 s post that he/she may in fact be a full time Union person................

As usual you are wrong. I have membership of NUR/RMT for 3 decades in January.
All that time has been spent as a guard/trainman/and team member.
In all that time, I have been a member of the Trade Union and held local positions therein.
I have worked at 2 locations in all my railway service.
I have also seen DOO(NP) at first hand when it first came in at my Depot in 1987.
I saw first hand the antics of other grades toward my grade where money is concerned.

 

[harz99]

As usual you are wrong. I have membership of NUR/RMT for 3 decades in January.
All that time has been spent as a guard/trainman/and team member.
In all that time, I have been a member of the Trade Union and held local positions therein.
I have worked at 2 locations in all my railway service.
I have also seen DOO(NP) at first hand when it first came in at my Depot in 1987.
I saw first hand the antics of other grades toward my grade where money is concerned.

Thank you, so not a full time Union person, simply a part time Union person then; at least we know for future reference.

And pardon me but where does "As usual you are wrong" come from?

I don't profess to be an expert in a particular field, and neither do I remember making any series of comments that would justify the implications of "As usual".

 

[DaveNewcastle]

And pardon me but where does "As usual you are wrong" come from?

Yes.
This is an important issue, and a rather well informed debate.
Sure, we all have different backgrounds, experiences and loyalties, but a common committment to sustain and, where possible, to strengthen conditions of employment as well as the operation of the railways, and ultimately, the levels of service to users.
So where does "As usual you are wrong" get us to those ends?

 

[jimrbrobinson]

For those not familiar, link to the thread I refer to below is here: "http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=484884"

Under DOO, does this mean that the driver would have to keep shutting down the unit, exiting the cab, assisting a wheelchair user by deploying and stowing the ramp, reenter the cab, restart the unit, and then all the other checks before continuing on the journey whenever a wheelchair user wishes to board or leave the train? Given that in many places, the train doors and floors are several inches above the platform level, often with a step (not to mention the gap) the ramp is obviously essential to allow disabled access to trains. (For what I would hope are obvious reasons I accept it would not be realistic to ensure every platform and train doorway / floor were always at the same level everywhere and that the gap from platform to train door never more than say half an inch).

 

[CarterUSM]

For those not familiar, link to the thread I refer to below is here: "http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=484884"

Under DOO, does this mean that the driver would have to keep shutting down the unit, exiting the cab, assisting a wheelchair user by deploying and stowing the ramp, reenter the cab, restart the unit, and then all the other checks before continuing on the journey whenever a wheelchair user wishes to board or leave the train? Given that in many places, the train doors and floors are several inches above the platform level, often with a step (not to mention the gap) the ramp is obviously essential to allow disabled access to trains. (For what I would hope are obvious reasons I accept it would not be realistic to ensure every platform and train doorway / floor were always at the same level everywhere and that the gap from platform to train door never more than say half an inch).

In Strathclyde, it SHOULDN'T happen, as the on board TE should be there to assist, but it has happened on occasion , even instances of the driver NOT assisting have occurred , which is strange, as they are in fact the guard as well as the driver in essence.

 

[scotsman]

It would be interesting if ScotRail could wheel out any other reason than "xx% of our trains have operated without conductors for 25 years"

Also, (ridiculous as it sounds/probably is) could it just be that the RMT hasn't been able to win any of these disputes with TOCs?

Surely a compromise like Conductors that don't work doors could get somewhere? (perhaps it's been brought up)

The problem is that First always want to save money, new TEs will get 80% of conductor pay and they will be able to avoid fines for cancellations by paying smaller fines for running trains without a 2nd crew member (who have only 'basic evacuation training' - The Scotsman)

 

[CarterUSM]

It would be interesting if ScotRail could wheel out any other reason than "xx% of our trains have operated without conductors for 25 years"

Also, (ridiculous as it sounds/probably is) could it just be that the RMT hasn't been able to win any of these disputes with TOCs?

Surely a compromise like Conductors that don't work doors could get somewhere? (perhaps it's been brought up)

The problem is that First always want to save money, new TEs will get 80% of conductor pay and they will be able to avoid fines for cancellations by paying smaller fines for running trains without a 2nd crew member (who have only 'basic evacuation training' - The Scotsman)

I'll need to check, but the fine is pretty substantial for a train with no TE , although less than a cancellation , thats for sure. Any blame on the employees part is disciplinary action too. First really do not like it if you cost them money! A simple misread diagram can turn into a severe reprimand pretty quickly. The RMT believe that control of power operated doors should remain in the hands of a guard, so i think thats a non starter idea as much as it may seem sensible . However, i believe there may come a time where a hybrid grade appears when/if guards become displaced in years to come. Though to be perfectly frank, as much as i like my current role and dont want to see it disappear , i'd probably make more money for less work and responsibility.

 

[Aictos]

Why would the driver need to shut down their cab, a driver is more then capable of securing the cab if any issues arise and they have to leave the cab.

I was on a FCC one day and we pulled in Arlesey and full credit to the driver actually got out of his cab, got the ramp in place and assisted a disabled passenger off the train.

 

[CarterUSM]

Why would the driver need to shut down their cab, a driver is more then capable of securing the cab if any issues arise and they have to leave the cab.

I was on a FCC one day and we pulled in Arlesey and full credit to the driver actually got out of his cab, got the ramp in place and assisted a disabled passenger off the train.

I suppose it depends on the unit, but our cabs are not classed as secure areas. I dont think a cab desk should be left energised while unattended either.